View Full Version : Bobcats Front Office
G-Force
07-09-2010, 01:51 PM
With the recent acitivity in FA and Draft, I have been very displeased with Bobcats front office. With all the exciting opportunity thats been going on in the NBA, the Bobcats have not plan properly in anticipation for a FA such as this. What's even more frusrating now is the possibility of losing TT/1st rounder. How can the FO not have planned better for things such as these?!
How do you guys feel about the FO's performance? Currently and in the past. I personally feel the Front Office (Higgins in particular) have been disappointing. Since Higgins arrive in 2007... the highlight transactions we had were: Okafor's extension, Diop's trade, All the draft picks, trading for TT with so many unknown. All of which were terrible choices. Jordan should probably rethink his FO group and hire someone more qualify and has a vision.
Jordan was a major influence in those decision, so maybe he should limit his role.
Talent
07-09-2010, 02:02 PM
I think it was very intelligent to not make many moves in the off season yet. Let the whole LeBron crap die down and the other free agents get over payed. Patience could land a desperate player or Felton could take a pay cut because no one has money left to pay him. Who knows how this will all play out in the end, but I like that the Bobcats have not pulled the trigger yet because the team they have can make the playoffs.
PouncingBobcat
07-09-2010, 02:03 PM
Stupid move by the front office to let Beasley go to the T-Wolves when he was theirs for the taking. Unload Chandler's injury ridden contract and get a recent #2 overall pick. How difficult is that? Let's go Jordan...who are we bringing in this off-season? And please don't make stupid moves like MIN resigning Darko Milicic and NJ signing Travis Outlaw. We want legit talent.
DY_nasty
07-09-2010, 02:27 PM
There is no way I was gonna be cool with giving up Tyson's fat booty expiring for JUST Beasley (a bust - how is he supposed to succeed here when he can't by playing off of wade while being catered to by the entire heat fo) and Jeffries, the layup missing wonder.
If they asked for more, GOOD JOB. That was a horrible trade...
Also, the Heat gave him away to create more cap room, not less. Trading Chandler for him was never an option for us without other teams being involved.
If Miami ended up with Chandler, they would never be able to sign their 3 big guys or fill out a roster around them.
I also agree with DY Nasty, if we play our cards right, Tyson's big fat expiring contract will end up being worth a lot more.
Since Higgins arrive in 2007... the highlight transactions we had were: Okafor's extension, Diop's trade, All the draft picks, trading for TT with so many unknown. All of which were terrible choices.
I do believe you've forgotten trading for Jason Richardson in a weak draft, turning him into Boris Diaw and Raja Bell and turning Raja's expiring along with Vladi for Stack Jack. Oh, and perhaps getting Theo Ratliff for nothing, getting Larry Brown to coach, signing Flip Murray, Stephen Graham, and Larry Hughes.
Rod knows what he's doing.
G-Force
07-09-2010, 04:22 PM
I do believe you've forgotten trading for Jason Richardson in a weak draft, turning him into Boris Diaw and Raja Bell and turning Raja's expiring along with Vladi for Stack Jack. Oh, and perhaps getting Theo Ratliff for nothing, getting Larry Brown to coach, signing Flip Murray, Stephen Graham, and Larry Hughes.
Rod knows what he's doing.
Really? Aside from Jax and L.Brown (I'm sure it was all Jordan), Do you really think those moves had any real significant impact for the team? We ended up letting all of them go within a year, minus Diaw bc honestly no one wants him.
Ampsportsduo
07-09-2010, 04:36 PM
Stupid move by the front office to let Beasley go to the T-Wolves when he was theirs for the taking. Unload Chandler's injury ridden contract and get a recent #2 overall pick. How difficult is that? Let's go Jordan...who are we bringing in this off-season? And please don't make stupid moves like MIN resigning Darko Milicic and NJ signing Travis Outlaw. We want legit talent.
When you and David Kahn are the only guys wanting to acquire a guy, that says something.
As for the FO, I've been generally pleased. With that said, I feel like our FO is one of the ones playing checkers and not chess (TSG's comparison). Each move seems to be made with little concept of salary cap implications (can we do it within the rules? Yes? Let's do it). as well as the low esteem they hold draft picks in. Based on the success of their picks, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but for a small market team to not be salary cap savvy and to not draft well is to damn a franchise to purgatory or worse. The game changed last night and it got even harder for small market teams. They have to step up their game going forward.
I recognize that the salary cap implications of the EO/TC trade were a big factor, but by and large these implications seem like a secondary concern.
G-Force
07-13-2010, 04:38 PM
I OFFICIAL have no hope for our GM/Owner. The trade with Dallas... We gave up an expiring Chandler and Lexy for 3 Scrubs w/ terrible contracts!!! Really MJ? Really? Perpare to continue losing money in the Franchise!
ohara831
07-13-2010, 04:42 PM
I OFFICIAL have no hope for our GM/Owner. The trade with Dallas... We gave up an expiring Chandler and Lexy for 3 Scrubs w/ terrible contracts!!! Really MJ? Really? Perpare to continue losing money in the Franchise!
How is an un-guaranteed $13 mil contract a bad thing? It is either greata trade bait or you cut $13 mil off the payroll. And Najera and Carroll are OK off the bench.
Proudiddy
07-13-2010, 04:49 PM
How is an un-guaranteed $13 mil contract a bad thing? It is either greata trade bait or you cut $13 mil off the payroll. And Najera and Carroll are OK off the bench.
What's rough now looking back after the trade went final is we took on about 7M or so next season for Damps contract. If we can't move his contract, the trade wasn't a good one.
And I have to admit, I'm still mad we didn't trade into the 2nd for Lance Stephenson to play PG. That should've been the easiest move to make all off-season.
dvdbumpus
07-13-2010, 04:52 PM
Really? Aside from Jax and L.Brown (I'm sure it was all Jordan), Do you really think those moves had any real significant impact for the team? We ended up letting all of them go within a year, minus Diaw bc honestly no one wants him.
LB: result of Jordan
Jax: result of LB
Higgins has played a role with getting Jax and negotiating but LB needs to take the front office job once he's done coaching or someone who takes the majority of decision making from Jordan.
G-Force
07-13-2010, 04:57 PM
How is an un-guaranteed $13 mil contract a bad thing? It is either greata trade bait or you cut $13 mil off the payroll. And Najera and Carroll are OK off the bench.
So I assume Dampier will be waived? If so... we have no quality player at the 5. We will only save 5MM while taking on 7-8MM in cap for 2011. Bobcats FO = FAIL
dvdbumpus
07-13-2010, 04:58 PM
So I assume Dampier will be waived? If so... we have no quality player at the 5. We will only save 5MM while taking on 7-8MM in cap for 2011. Bobcats FO = FAIL
Biedrins....
eleaf14
07-13-2010, 05:01 PM
I OFFICIAL have no hope for our GM/Owner. The trade with Dallas... We gave up an expiring Chandler and Lexy for 3 Scrubs w/ terrible contracts!!! Really MJ? Really? Perpare to continue losing money in the Franchise!
What were you expecting your avatar to pan out?
No matter how you look at it...this franchise is turning the corner. Season ticket holders are up, sponsorships are up, and most importantly product on the floor is up.
Honestly, I would have given us a -1 if the Toronto deal went through. We would have had alot more problems than we have now. And we would've helped a team close to us in the conference get better while we seemingly would have gotten worse.
But this Dallas deal doesnt hurt us. Declining contracts on Najera, and Carroll, plus a nice piece of bait/or space depending on how the Dampier contract works out. Alexis is a scrub, and better to cut our loss with that now. He was a bust, and I chalk that up to Larry being excited to return to coaching, and wanting to mold some raw talent.
This front office has done a nice job the last year. Getting rid of EO's inflated contract, signing Flip, trading for Jack, Hughes, Theo, TT were all good moves...that obviously guided us to where we wanted to go.
The one thing I have confidence in is that this group will address the issues on hand. Right now it appears to be Center and PG. The Damp contract might not be enough to answer both, but I have faith with as many moves as weve made in the past 2 seasons...we will be straight come Oct.
How is an un-guaranteed $13 mil contract a bad thing? It is either greata trade bait or you cut $13 mil off the payroll. And Najera and Carroll are OK off the bench.
seconded.....
CatNation
07-13-2010, 05:50 PM
What?! You guys are forgetting the biggest coup in Free Agency 2010!
DOMINIC MCGUIRE
YES. WE. DID.
I OFFICIAL have no hope for our GM/Owner. The trade with Dallas... We gave up an expiring Chandler and Lexy for 3 Scrubs w/ terrible contracts!!! Really MJ? Really? Perpare to continue losing money in the Franchise!
I completely disagree with every single word of your post.
spectre
07-18-2010, 09:48 AM
What were you expecting your avatar to pan out?
No matter how you look at it...this franchise is turning the corner. Season ticket holders are up, sponsorships are up, and most importantly product on the floor is up.
Honestly, I would have given us a -1 if the Toronto deal went through. We would have had alot more problems than we have now. And we would've helped a team close to us in the conference get better while we seemingly would have gotten worse.
But this Dallas deal doesnt hurt us. Declining contracts on Najera, and Carroll, plus a nice piece of bait/or space depending on how the Dampier contract works out. Alexis is a scrub, and better to cut our loss with that now. He was a bust, and I chalk that up to Larry being excited to return to coaching, and wanting to mold some raw talent.
This front office has done a nice job the last year. Getting rid of EO's inflated contract, signing Flip, trading for Jack, Hughes, Theo, TT were all good moves...that obviously guided us to where we wanted to go.
The one thing I have confidence in is that this group will address the issues on hand. Right now it appears to be Center and PG. The Damp contract might not be enough to answer both, but I have faith with as many moves as weve made in the past 2 seasons...we will be straight come Oct.
Good post.
My avatar notwithstanding, I do think they did better last year than they ever have before (LB's influence...no doubts about it), but it's hard not to have concerns with this year.
Until it's all played out it's hard to judge one way or the other.
Ghost Kat
07-18-2010, 09:56 AM
what?! You guys are forgetting the biggest coup in free agency 2010!
Dominic mcguire
yes. We. Did.
mvp....mvp...mvp
Ghost Kat
07-18-2010, 09:59 AM
What?! You guys are forgetting the biggest coup in Free Agency 2010!
DOMINIC MCGUIRE
YES. WE. DID.
It's been a couple weeks and I still don't know who he is.
When he gets mail at his house the postal worker delivering it just looks at the letter and says....Who the fuck is DOMINIC MCGUIRE?!?!?!?!
BlockParty
07-18-2010, 02:20 PM
I do believe you've forgotten trading for Jason Richardson in a weak draft, turning him into Boris Diaw and Raja Bell and turning Raja's expiring along with Vladi for Stack Jack. Oh, and perhaps getting Theo Ratliff for nothing, getting Larry Brown to coach, signing Flip Murray, Stephen Graham, and Larry Hughes.
Rod knows what he's doing.
Don't forget Shannon Brown..he is the only reason we were able to unload Morrison and the 1 & 1/2 years left on his contract.
Higgins does know what he's doing, he was primarily responsible for orchestrating the roster in GS that as an 8 seed in the west upset #1 seed Dallas prior to us getting JRich.
vinnie_paz
07-18-2010, 02:42 PM
But this Dallas deal doesnt hurt us. Declining contracts on Najera, and Carroll, plus a nice piece of bait/or space depending on how the Dampier contract works out.
disagree
you dont trade a good player (who you need at that position) who has a expiring contract, for a bunch of scrubs that will expire in 2-3 years.
without executing this trade we would have had chandler for one more year, and then he's off the books and we have cap room...
now we wont have cap room for 2-3 years and these scrubs will only play when s. jax and wallace r hurt.
vinnie_paz
07-18-2010, 02:49 PM
i just hope everyone realizes matt carroll has 3 years left where he will make 4.3 mil, 3.9 mil, and 3.5 mil...
we already have g henderon who needs minutes and UPS...
why trade chandler who's contract woud have been off the books after this season ?
if dampier's non guaranteed contract was so valuable, dallas would'nt have traded it for nothing...
vinnie_paz
07-18-2010, 02:52 PM
carroll and najera will make a combined 6.5 million in 2011-2012
couldn't we have signed a decent player for that much instead of these two ?
spectre
07-18-2010, 03:23 PM
A little premature until you see what they turn Dampier's contract into don'tcha think?
On the face it's not looking great, but you have to let it all play out.
K1NGofAKR0N
07-18-2010, 03:36 PM
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2010/07/17/1569144/chris-paul-in-a-bobcats-uniform.html
EC123
07-18-2010, 04:27 PM
Stupid move by the front office to let Beasley go to the T-Wolves when he was theirs for the taking.
Beasely sucks...period.
He's an undersized prima donna for his position.
Good riddance to even the idea of that jackass being on the team.
vinnie_paz
07-18-2010, 04:57 PM
A little premature until you see what they turn Dampier's contract into don'tcha think?
On the face it's not looking great, but you have to let it all play out.
yea maybe
i just really dont like matt carroll's contract
dvdbumpus
07-18-2010, 05:39 PM
yea maybe
i just really dont like matt carroll's contract
Sure, but at least it's rescinding each year. On top of that, I'm sure he'll be traded again. Henderson will also get minutes as he'll be the primary backup with Carroll as the #3. Just consider that their contracts are reversed because Carroll has a backup SG's pay and Henderson has the rookie/#3 pay.
Ampsportsduo
07-18-2010, 06:38 PM
http://www.humanforsale.com/images/mr_magoo.jpgI think some of you are being shortsighted.
millst2
07-18-2010, 10:21 PM
Well dampiers contract is an immediate write off, if we kept TC we are still on the books for a yr. Carroll I can live with, his contract gets lower and lower each yr and we desperately need someone who can hit the tre. Orlando smoked our bags last yr in the playoffs with all of the three point shooters. Carroll and Damp I can see benefiting us, the third piece not so much.
x2pacalypse
07-19-2010, 12:22 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/michael-jordan-questions-lebron-james-move-to-miami-071910?GT1=39002
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team. But that's ... things are different. I can't say that's a bad thing. It's an opportunity these kids have today. In all honesty, I was trying to beat those guys."
call me crazy but this kind of hints at he wouldn't want a superteam like paul and melo...idk
ohara831
07-19-2010, 02:18 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/michael-jordan-questions-lebron-james-move-to-miami-071910?GT1=39002
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team. But that's ... things are different. I can't say that's a bad thing. It's an opportunity these kids have today. In all honesty, I was trying to beat those guys."
call me crazy but this kind of hints at he wouldn't want a superteam like paul and melo...idk
I didn't interpret it that way. I think he is saying that he knew he was a superstar, and that there were others out there. He did not want to team up with them, his competitive fire made him want to beat them. I bet Magic and Bird would say the same thing MJ and Barkley have said. The move by LeBron only means that he will never be in the same category as MJ or Kobe. He couldn't be the man who drew others to his team to win a title - he had to go to Wade's team. It simply takes away from the LeBron legacy in the long run. Even if he wins 6 titles, he will never be in the running with MJ or Kobe. Not saying he wont be one of the 15 best players ever; but he now can never reach to top of the mountain with the immortals.
spectre
07-19-2010, 04:14 PM
Didn't want to start a thread, so I figured this is kind of related...
To pay or not to pay the luxury tax
On the Charlotte forums there's a guy whose pretty "up" on salary (bobfan1) and he posted this thread yesterday:
Is the Luxury Tax really that expensive? (http://www.charlotteobserver.com/forums/?plckForumPage=ForumDiscussion&plckDiscussionId=Cat%3ae6c8a297-bda3-4986-9497-eea243ec323eForum%3a05d70f4d-f5ae-4a75-9e15-c94404e2799cDiscussion%3a5190f1d5-7a15-44e3-ae65-cfcde8e67451)
as others have posted there is a 'hidden' tax if you pay the luxury tax.
Not only do you pay $1 for each dollar over the limit, but you don't get to participate in receiving your fair share from the teams that pay into the pool.
In 2008-2009, 7 teams paid in $87mm, meaning the other 23 teams received $3.8mm each.
In 2009-2010, 11 teams paid in $111mm, meaning the other 19 teams received $5.8mm each.
But based on all the wheeeling and dealing so far this summer, only 5 teams are over the cap: Orlando ($91mm), Lakers ($89mm), Dallas ($78mm) and Denver and Boston($77mm each). There are some massive trade exceptions, but so far these are the only teams over $70mm. I've excluded the Bobcats as they are certain to dump Dampier before the end of October.
So 5 teams would pay in $77mm to be shared by 25 teams or $2.5mm, way down from last season. And since the tax is assessed on the salaries at the end of the season, there could be some reduction from here.
So I ask, since the 'give up' to go over the luxury tax limit will be closer to $2mm than $6mm, is it worth going over the limit? Maybe MJ is being too conservative? IMO that's a VERY informative post.
One thing of note...I'm not sure that the entire tax amount gets divided to the non-taxpaying teams. There are all sorts of smaller issues where the NBA pulls monies out...so his 2.5 million figure may be even lower.
ziggy
07-19-2010, 04:41 PM
That was a strong post ny bobfan1... he needs to come on over to the BCP dark side.
I was wondering about those exact numbers within the past week or so. Thanks for the info!
Ampsportsduo
07-19-2010, 07:59 PM
Not only do you pay $1 for each dollar over the limit, but you don't get to participate in receiving your fair share from the teams that pay into the pool.
In 2008-2009, 7 teams paid in $87mm, meaning the other 23 teams received $3.8mm each.
In 2009-2010, 11 teams paid in $111mm, meaning the other 19 teams received $5.8mm each.
But based on all the wheeeling and dealing so far this summer, only 5 teams are over the cap: Orlando ($91mm), Lakers ($89mm), Dallas ($78mm) and Denver and Boston($77mm each). There are some massive trade exceptions, but so far these are the only teams over $70mm. I've excluded the Bobcats as they are certain to dump Dampier before the end of October.
So 5 teams would pay in $77mm to be shared by 25 teams or $2.5mm, way down from last season. And since the tax is assessed on the salaries at the end of the season, there could be some reduction from here.
Just want to point out a slight inaccuracy in this post.
Teams under the luxury tax always receive 1/30 of the luxury tax money. This way if only 1 team was below, they wouldn't receive the whole kitty Free Parking Monopoly-style.
So:
In 2009-2010, 11 teams paid in $111mm, meaning the other 19 teams received $5.8mm each.Wrongly assumes the $111 million is split between the 19 remaining teams = $5.8 million
or
111/19=5.8
when its actually
111/30=3.7
Why is this important, because it means that not all the money going in to the luxury tax "fund" is being re-distributed to teams under the cap. In this case
19 teams under the cap multiplied by $3.8 million received = $70.3 million (of the $111 million paid)
This leaves $40.7 million in the luxury tax fund. Some or all can be used for "league purposes" but I suspect most owners know approx. how much will be used for said purposes. For the sake of argument, let's say $10 million used for league purposes. This leaves $30.7 million dollars. This money would then be redistributed to all teams (including those over the luxury tax)
So each team would receive $1 million back. For the teams under the tax, their total gained would be $4.7 million and for teams over they'd receive just the $1 million.
I point this out for accuracy, but also because depending on the amount of money going into the luxury tax fund, it can become a much bigger or smaller deal depending on the numbers.
Powered by vBulletin™ Version 4.0.6 Copyright © 2013 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.