The 2010-11 Trade Discussion Thread

[ammofan]

What about Andy V from Cleveland? The Cavs are probably looking to break some stuff down and he's signed to a long-term deal. Could he be the banger, defender, rebounder we need down low?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=37cs59b

Also, after the 15th we'd include McGuire, just so LB couldn't keep playing him.

No way CLE would do that....

[DY_nasty]

That Varejao contract is an abomination. 5 years for a glorified scrub? No thanks.
Why does this team have such problems developing talent? Adam Morrison was a terrible pick. Gerald Henderson rides the bench. DJ has been repeatedly on the trading block and Larry Brown doesn't trust him. Sean May never had a fire lit under his ass and became a bloated, oft injured mess. Okafor was decent, but was traded away. Felton signed with another team (ended up being the best pick Charlotte has had since the Bobcats became a team). Oh, and get this, Alexis Ajinca. Yes, that guy. He's actually having a good game in Dallas tonight. He has 6 rebounds, 3 points, 2 blocks and 1 steal in 9 minutes.
Its so much easier to say that this team doesn't draft well.

I've been saying this all the time... the Bobcats haven't drafted any guys that were immediate colossal busts (Alexis was a project player from the start - and given what LB wants from his centers, this could've been a good year for him here). Most of the guys we get come in and either regress because of poorly managed injuries (May, Morrison) or they come in and never improve (Everyone else).

[Absinthe]

That Varejao contract is an abomination. 5 years for a glorified scrub? No thanks.
Its so much easier to say that this team doesn't draft well.

I've been saying this all the time... the Bobcats haven't drafted any guys that were immediate colossal busts (Alexis was a project player from the start - and given what LB wants from his centers, this could've been a good year for him here). Most of the guys we get come in and either regress because of poorly managed injuries (May, Morrison) or they come in and never improve (Everyone else).

The two best draft picks the Bobcats have had no longer play with the team. Okafor and Felton might have been good (not great) players, but they were still the best picks the franchise ever had. Anyone that knew a thing about Sean May knew that he was going to become a fatso with poor work ethic. Hell, he struggled with conditioning in college so I don't know why people thought it would be a good idea to draft him. I really feel like Morrison got shit on. The franchise never gave him a fair chance. Another player that was very similar to him coming out of the draft was JJ Reddick. Many people labeled him a bust and he rode the pine for the first two years in the league. He worked on his game and now he's a contributing player. I'll never believe in a million years that a college player as dominant as Morrison couldn't, at the very least, be a bench player in this league. They then ship him out to LA and he never played there either. I'm not even sure if Morrison is in the D league and that is such a shock to me.

[DY_nasty]

The two best draft picks the Bobcats have had no longer play with the team. Okafor and Felton might have been good (not great) players, but they were still the best picks the franchise ever had. Anyone that knew a thing about Sean May knew that he was going to become a fatso with poor work ethic. Hell, he struggled with conditioning in college so I don't know why people thought it would be a good idea to draft him. I really feel like Morrison got shit on. The franchise never gave him a fair chance. Another player that was very similar to him coming out of the draft was JJ Reddick. Many people labeled him a bust and he rode the pine for the first two years in the league. He worked on his game and now he's a contributing player. I'll never believe in a million years that a college player as dominant as Morrison couldn't, at the very least, be a bench player in this league. They then ship him out to LA and he never played there either. I'm not even sure if Morrison is in the D league and that is such a shock to me.Morrison was fine at first, then he got injured and never mentally or physically recovered - something like that should never happen to a guy drafted that high. I'm still kind of baffled by it. May's weight was never an issue at UNC. Not sure where you're going there... if anything, how his career played out showed how we allowed him to become complacent with the handling of his injury.

But again, no one ever improves as a Bobcat. We pick guys with solid foundations, and they never get better. Only worse.

[Absinthe]

This team has to get better through trades and drafting. This team will never get better through free agency because players will take less money to play in bigger markets. Instead, the front office gives away picks and makes shitty draft choices. It's also bad luck. A lot of very, very, very good players have been taken just before Charlotte could draft them. The biggest one that really sticks out is Dwight Howard. But players like Paul, Deron, and Roy are up there too. It's just shitty luck.

[Dcarnys]

Maybe we can draft a decent franchise player just once?

[DY_nasty]

Maybe we can draft a decent franchise player just once?
To expect to draft the next Tim Duncan is only going to lead disappointment.

How about we draft someone solid and actually get some improvement out of them for once?

[BRNC]

Morrison was fine at first, then he got injured and never mentally or physically recovered - something like that should never happen to a guy drafted that high. I'm still kind of baffled by it. May's weight was never an issue at UNC. Not sure where you're going there... if anything, how his career played out showed how we allowed him to become complacent with the handling of his injury.

But again, no one ever improves as a Bobcat. We pick guys with solid foundations, and they never get better. Only worse.

It is odd when folk "re-write" what draft analyst knew or did not know concerning drafts...this is from DratExpress weakness section concerning Sean May before he was drafted...and a simple check with any other reputable drafting site will indicate the same...his weight was an issue/concern before the draft as was his conditioning (lack of)...

"Weaknesses:

May is not an outstanding athlete by any means and that hurts his draft stock because it might scare a few teams away from him. He does not have very good leaping ability either at this point. The thing that might be holding him back the most is the fact that he is not in great shape at all conditioning wise, although he is not as chubby as he used to be. His explosiveness might be a lot better than what we are seeing right now, but he's not in shape so it's impossible to tell. That's a concern because if he can't get in shape at this age in college, what's going to happen in the pros? He'll have to shed at least 10-15 pounds next year if not more than that if he really wants to be considered a top prospect at his height.

May does run the court well, but most of the time he is playing center on the team and not PF. He will not be able to play center in the NBA at 6-7 or 6-8, so he will have to develop into a more consistent post defender and learn how to defend better away from the basket. I do not think he will have a problem rebounding, but he might have trouble running with NBA PF's and keeping up with them over the course of 82 games that are 48 minutes long. He can most likely handle most NBA PF's in the paint once he gets his feet wet, but if he was taken away from the basket and asked to defend on the perimeter, he would be taken advantage of because he does not move his feet well at this point.

May has developed offensive abilities at this point in his career thanks to his strength advantage, but he will have to expand his game even more and become a better outside shooter at the next level. He has great touch from around the rim but he will have to develop a solid 15-foot jump shot to be more dangerous in the league.

He will also have to expand his back to the basket game and include more moves to his repertoire to be as effective as possible.

He is not a great ball handler either, just not being comfortable at this point dribbling the basketball. He is mostly a catch and shoot post player and does not dribble that often to create shots for himself. To his credit, though, he is North Carolina's only post presence right now, the only player that can consistently score with his back to the basket and that's what his role has been so far. He might be able to show off better perimeter skills next year, but at this point he has yet to do that. "


From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Sean-May-11/#ixzz17eICSYzs
http://www.draftexpress.com


Morrison has done nothing to justify him as that high a pick...claiming the team mishandled him while injuried is dubious at best since he is long over the injury and no other team seems to be able to get anything from him...

[DY_nasty]

Sean May's conditioning was never an issue at UNC - thats what I said and have been saying. Whenever he got hurt there, he never bloated and turned into a sideshow.

And Morrison's rookie season wasn't even that bad. For a guy who's game wasn't predicated on athleticism and strongly built around shooting, he was never going to immediately step into the league and light it up. Even if you're of the opinion that he was instantly terrible and a bust on arrival, the fact that no one Charlotte has ever drafted has shown any signs of moderate improvement still stands.

[Dcarnys]

To expect to draft the next Tim Duncan is only going to lead disappointment.

How about we draft someone solid and actually get some improvement out of them for once?

That works too.

[ammofan]

Lets get back to trade discussion guys......and dont me started on defending Morrison....I know yall dont want to hear that! :D

[Black]

Portland management is contemplating trading older players and going young. The obvious targets for such a purge would be Marcus Camby (36), Andre Miller (34), and Joel Przybilla (31).

http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/26323465?source=rss_blogs_NBA

I would love to see us go after Camby if the deal was right. One year left on his deal after this year, but he is still a productive defensive big, which we lack sorely.

[Scottley Crue]

http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/26323465?source=rss_blogs_NBA

I would love to see us go after Camby if the deal was right. One year left on his deal after this year, but he is still a productive defensive big, which we lack sorely.

Camby is very nice and Przybilla interest me too, depending on how he comes back from his injury. Both, when healthy, would provide a big shot-blocking center that we really need. I don't know what youngs we'd be willing to give up, or anyone would take, though. Maybe they want extra savings and take Nazr for Przybilla? (If that's possible)

[mrtarheel]

Why stop with Camby

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=38xejp6

[fallen xxi]

^ Without Thompson in the deal, I feel like we get anally raped in that trade compared to Portland and Sacramento but Thompson provides a nice balance of young-old. This would give Charlotte the chance to keep going with a solid point guard for the rest of this season and look to FA/Draft in the offseason for PG help. So that trade sounds pretty good for all sides from me if Portland is true in their desire to give up Camby AND Miller. But, I also don't see Sacramento giving up Landry in return for Boris...they seem to like him out there.

[Chef]

^ Without Thompson in the deal, I feel like we get anally raped in that trade compared to Portland and Sacramento but Thompson provides a nice balance of young-old. This would give Charlotte the chance to keep going with a solid point guard for the rest of this season and look to FA/Draft in the offseason for PG help. So that trade sounds pretty good for all sides from me if Portland is true in their desire to give up Camby AND Miller. But, I also don't see Sacramento giving up Landry in return for Boris...they seem to like him out there.

if we get anally raped what does portland get?

[spankymoore7]

If Portland wants to get younger...

would they consider this?

DJ, Diaw, and Collins(non guaranteed contract) for Miller and Przybilla? Lets portland get a young point guard and a versatile big guy. Gives us a veteran PG(who has "fight" which i guess wallace and jack feel we need) and a Center. Frees Thomas to get more minutes, plus Joel and nzr give us two expiring contracts that we could move at the trade deadline

Miller/Livingston/Free Agent
Jack/Hendo/Carroll
Wallace/UPS/McGuire
TT/Brown/Najera
Nazr/Przybilla/Diop

[GoBobs]

I posted this on real gm what do you guys think?

Blazers (http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1074210#) out: Camby, A. Miller

Bobcats out: DJ Augustin, Derrik Brown, Gana Diop, Edwardo Najera

Why for the Blazers: This isn't looking like there year so far. There might not be any basketball (http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1074210#) next year. Camby and Miller are not getting any younger. They get two decent young prospects. DJ is in the third year of a rookie contract and putting up decent numbers for a starter. Derrick Brown is a second year player on a very cheep contract that is shooting 61% from the floor. Diop and Najera are just included to make the money work out but can play fill in minutes.

Why for the Bobcats: Even though they have had a rough start this year they are not that far out of a playoff spot in the east. Larry Brown isn't getting any younger and may not be back after this year. They sacrifice some youth for two vets no one thought would be this good by this age. Larry gets his vet point guard in Andre Miller (http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1074210#) and Camby makes a good defense even better as a back stop.

Bobcats:

Miller/Livingston
Jackson/Henderson
Wallace/McGuire
Diaw/Tyrus Thomas
Camby/Nazr

Would this team have an outside shot to compete?

[spectre]

I think Portland fans are gonna massacre you on the RGM trade board. They normally don't like fair trades, so I can just imagine how they're going to react as soon as they see Gana's name included.

A great example of a Larry Brown type move, and we very well could have done something similar last year. With MJ seemingly being more involved in critiquing what LB wants though I'd be surprised if he'd do it right now.

If the Denver win did NOT start a turnaround however I'd think all bets were off.

[Chef]

I posted this on real gm what do you guys think?

Blazers (http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1074210#) out: Camby, A. Miller

Bobcats out: DJ Augustin, Derrik Brown, Gana Diop, Edwardo Najera

Why for the Blazers: This isn't looking like there year so far. There might not be any basketball (http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1074210#) next year. Camby and Miller are not getting any younger. They get two decent young prospects. DJ is in the third year of a rookie contract and putting up decent numbers for a starter. Derrick Brown is a second year player on a very cheep contract that is shooting 61% from the floor. Diop and Najera are just included to make the money work out but can play fill in minutes.

Why for the Bobcats: Even though they have had a rough start this year they are not that far out of a playoff spot in the east. Larry Brown isn't getting any younger and may not be back after this year. They sacrifice some youth for two vets no one thought would be this good by this age. Larry gets his vet point guard in Andre Miller (http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1074210#) and Camby makes a good defense even better as a back stop.

Bobcats:

Miller/Livingston
Jackson/Henderson
Wallace/McGuire
Diaw/Tyrus Thomas
Camby/Nazr

Would this team have an outside shot to compete?

be prepared for a bunch of lol's, you are an idiot, do you even watch basketball and this thread should be locked comments.

[Plowright]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2cw2pw2

Now we all know there is something going on behind the scenes in Memphis, Mayo has been benched and is playing under 20mpg averaging just 12 points and not reached double figures in the last 4 games. This trade gives memphis some depth at g to replace Mayo with Hendo. We get that athletic big LB has wanted, yes he is relativley rough around the edges to say the least! However who would be better to teach him than LB! Nazzy is a nice expiring and a decent back up cetre to Marc Gasol. Also i think Memphis may have given up on Thabeat... thoughts? We could throw UPS in there if it was needed but i would rather not!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

think thats realistic? When i think about it it seems it, but on paper i just think Memphis shoot that offer down

[spectre]

I'm sure it's because of Nazr (and his high PER), but that trade says we'd be -8 (that's MINUS) wins.

Way too good for us. I haven't followed Memphis but I doubt they're ready to just give Thabeet away (wasn't he like 2nd-3rd pick a year ago?), and tho OJ is struggling this year I doubt his value has plummeted that far.

They'd want something like Crash for OJ.

[teej]

No way I do that.

Thabeet's a bust, and Mayo would be stuck behind Jack...

[DY_nasty]

No way I do that.

Thabeet's a bust, and Mayo would be stuck behind Jack...
Agreed. Thabeet is an even worse pick than Oden.

And I don't want Mayo unless its too replace Jack.

[Chef]

Agreed. Thabeet is an even worse pick than Oden.

And I don't want Mayo unless its too replace Jack.

plus, do we want to extend mayo for 10-12 mil per year because that is what he wants.

[SWedd523]

He won't get 10-12mil from anyone. Not at this point he wont.


I would, however, trade Jack and Kwame for OJ and Thabeet

[WFU4LIFE]

Get rid of Diaw NOW. I don't care what the trade is. Listen to this. T2 is averaging only 1 point less and .7 rebounds more than Diaw despite playing 16 less minutes per game. And don't give me that shit about T2 not taking care of the ball or taking stupid shots. Diaw and T2 shoot the same percentage from the field and Diaw averages 2.81 turnovers compared to T2's 1.75. Yes, Diaw averages 3 more assists than T2, but I think that Diaw's contribution to this team ball handling wise is vastly overrated. I don't know how many more game I can take of watching Diaw's fat ass out there.

[ZackTB23]

How about Sacramento gets Boris Diaw, Nazr Mohammed, and Jonny Flynn, Minnesota gets Eduardo Najera, Eugene Jeter, and 2013 1st rd pick from Sacramento, and Charlotte gets Samuel Dalembert and Jason Thompson?

[Weezy21]

How about Sacramento gets Boris Diaw, Nazr Mohammed, and Jonny Flynn, Minnesota gets Eduardo Najera, Eugene Jeter, and 2013 1st rd pick from Sacramento, and Charlotte gets Samuel Dalembert and Jason Thompson?

minnesota does that trade why?

[Pepperz]

minnesota does that trade why?

Its the season of giving.

[DY_nasty]

Get rid of Diaw NOW. I don't care what the trade is. Listen to this. T2 is averaging only 1 point less and .7 rebounds more than Diaw despite playing 16 less minutes per game. And don't give me that shit about T2 not taking care of the ball or taking stupid shots. Diaw and T2 shoot the same percentage from the field and Diaw averages 2.81 turnovers compared to T2's 1.75. Yes, Diaw averages 3 more assists than T2, but I think that Diaw's contribution to this team ball handling wise is vastly overrated. I don't know how many more game I can take of watching Diaw's fat ass out there.
Diaw is arguably the best player on the team this season (kill me)

He's easily the most consistent right now and his interior presence is the only thing that the team can count on night in and night out (can't believe i'm saying this)

The last thing the team needs is its 3rd shooter to disappear - not 3rd best, 3rd as in we only have 3.

Tyrus plays better off of Diaw. He can't clear or control space anywhere close. Tyrus has done some of the dumbest things I've ever seen on a basketball court this season. He can't body anyone. He can't stay out of foul trouble. He's hurt and has been hurt for a while. His contract is front-loaded. There's no obligation to rush him onto the court because of money alone. At least not yet. Also, Tyrus is a complete idiot on the court.

(I hate liking Diaw now... feel dirty... need a shower)

[ZackTB23]

Here's another idea to think about. Bobcats trade 2011 2nd rd pick and Boris Diaw to Boston for Glen Davis and Nate Robinson.

[ammofan]

Here's another idea to think about. Bobcats trade 2011 2nd rd pick and Boris Diaw to Boston for Glen Davis and Nate Robinson.

I wish.....I will meet with LB and Doc tonight and tell them to make the switch :D

[Chef]

2 trades to rebuild the bobcats.

1. out: crash, diaw, nazr
in: melo, jr smith (both expiring)
why: obvious for melo, smith is playing during a contract year. get the value, don't resign. way too much of a headcase. good shooter, good sg.

2. out: jax
in: gortat
why: get a center worth a crap, why for orlando make a run at miami and boston. they then turn around and deal vc for more.

[ammofan]

2 trades to rebuild the bobcats.

1. out: crash, diaw, nazr
in: melo, jr smith (both expiring)
why: obvious for melo, smith is playing during a contract year. get the value, don't resign. way too much of a headcase. good shooter, good sg.

2. out: jax
in: gortat
why: get a center worth a crap, why for orlando make a run at miami and boston. they then turn around and deal vc for more.

Id love to see VC here with melo....

[Weezy21]

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1074982

no we dont get melo...but we do get nene and helps us rebuild with some nice young players

[spectre]

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1074982

no we dont get melo...but we do get nene and helps us rebuild with some nice young players

NY won't give up Fields and I'd imagine Chicago probably wouldn't give up Gibson for Jax & his contract.

I like our return though

[spankymoore7]

If we are blowing it up, it is all about helping a team get melo since he probably wont come here

NYKnicks in
Melo
NYKnicks out
Curry, Douglas, Gallinari, Randolph

DenverNuggets in
Mohammad, Wallace
DenverNuggets out
Melo

CharlotteBobcats in
Curry, Douglas, Gallinari, Randolph
CharlotteBobcats out
Mohammad, Wallace

NY gets Melo, puts him with Amare, Felton, Chandler for a nice team. Doesnt take on long term money so can get CP3 in a couple of years

Denver gets an allstar and a nice big guy with an expiring contract, which could be traded for something or let go to help them save cash after this season with them having paid the luxury tax for years. Guess it comes to rebuilding by trading for prospects or reloading by getting wallace. not sure which way they want to go but if want to reload, this trade helps

Charlotte gets several young prospects. Would have to cut collins and trade a player like brown for a future pick to get 15 spots for the season. Get younger, gallo can score for us, better bench. Center will be terrible, probably play diaw there, and rotate thomas and randolph in. curry is just there to make the money work, he is expiring so no biggie.

DJ/Douglas/Livingston
Jackson/Hendo/Carroll
Gallo/McGuire/Najera
TT/Randolph/Brown
Diaw/Diop/Curry

[rsxnova]

I would do that trade in second. Try to make NY swap Jack for Wilson Chandler and our rebuild is underway.

[Chef]

If we are blowing it up, it is all about helping a team get melo since he probably wont come here

NYKnicks in
Melo
NYKnicks out
Curry, Douglas, Gallinari, Randolph

DenverNuggets in
Mohammad, Wallace
DenverNuggets out
Melo

CharlotteBobcats in
Curry, Douglas, Gallinari, Randolph
CharlotteBobcats out
Mohammad, Wallace

NY gets Melo, puts him with Amare, Felton, Chandler for a nice team. Doesnt take on long term money so can get CP3 in a couple of years

Denver gets an allstar and a nice big guy with an expiring contract, which could be traded for something or let go to help them save cash after this season with them having paid the luxury tax for years. Guess it comes to rebuilding by trading for prospects or reloading by getting wallace. not sure which way they want to go but if want to reload, this trade helps

Charlotte gets several young prospects. Would have to cut collins and trade a player like brown for a future pick to get 15 spots for the season. Get younger, gallo can score for us, better bench. Center will be terrible, probably play diaw there, and rotate thomas and randolph in. curry is just there to make the money work, he is expiring so no biggie.

DJ/Douglas/Livingston
Jackson/Hendo/Carroll
Gallo/McGuire/Najera
TT/Randolph/Brown
Diaw/Diop/Curry

that is not a great return for crash. it is essentially gallo and salary relief. we don't need randolph if we are paying TT to be the pf of the future which basically puts him in the same situation he has been. also, at what point do we start to ask why he can't play on any team he is on? he may be a summer league all star and not much more. if we move crash in a melo deal we better either a) get melo then get the same nyk package plus draft picks later or b) get significantly better prospects and salary relief.

[rsxnova]

that is not a great return for crash. it is essentially gallo and salary relief. we don't need randolph if we are paying TT to be the pf of the future which basically puts him in the same situation he has been. also, at what point do we start to ask why he can't play on any team he is on? he may be a summer league all star and not much more. if we move crash in a melo deal we better either a) get melo then get the same nyk package plus draft picks later or b) get significantly better prospects and salary relief.

Randolph would easily log big mins at C in this rotation to see what he has. Give the guy 30 mins a game and see what he has to offer you.

[spectre]

that is not a great return for crash. it is essentially gallo and salary relief.

What is a good return for Crash? What could we reasonably expect, esp. given his play last year (or does last year still overrule?)?

Not trying to pick on you or anyone...just thinking settling on this might give us an idea on what we could reasonably expect.

[spectre]

Randolph would easily log big mins at C in this rotation to see what he has. Give the guy 30 mins a game and see what he has to offer you.

I don't think Randolph is really a C. Isn't he more of a SF/PF type?

I haven't seen him that much so I could be wrong.

[Chef]

What is a good return for Crash? What could we reasonably expect, esp. given his play last year (or does last year still overrule?)?

Not trying to pick on you or anyone...just thinking settling on this might give us an idea on what we could reasonably expect.

my stance is (and i imagine jordan's is) get melo as a rental to fill the stadium for a half a season and 1 round of the playoffs. then deal him to nyk for gallo, randolph, a pick and tpe. we could get better prospects/pick combos from other teams such as min, clippers, etc. i know crash isn't getting us anything special and i don't want another veteran and the salary that comes with it for him.

[Chef]

I don't think Randolph is really a C. Isn't he more of a SF/PF type?

I haven't seen him that much so I could be wrong.

no one has seen him because he can't play for the warriors or knicks. this is my point. why trade crash for gallo (a good prospect) and randolph (an unknown and possibly waste) when we can get the exact same thing by dealing an extended melo after the season. if denver wants crash, then melo needs to come to us. this is why we get shafted all the time. we give up the best player in the deal (outside of melo) for basically nothing. if denver wants crash then we have more power than the knicks. if they can come up with an offer that denver likes better let them have it and deal crash elsewhere. either way there is a viable market for crash.

[rsxnova]

I don't think Randolph is really a C. Isn't he more of a SF/PF type?

I haven't seen him that much so I could be wrong.

He is 6'11 and 225 lbs. After thinking it over, i would send Dougles or DJ to Sac for JT and have a solid young rotation.

[spectre]

He is 6'11 and 225 lbs. After thinking it over, i would send Dougles or DJ to Sac for JT and have a solid young rotation.

I think the issue is that he plays like a SF on offense. I have no clue how he is defensively.

He's one of those highly raw guys who's shown great promise but is having a hard time "getting it". If the price is right I certainly wouldn't mind taking a flyer on him for the future (he wouldn't get any burn under LB).

[Weezy21]

my stance is (and i imagine jordan's is) get melo as a rental to fill the stadium for a half a season and 1 round of the playoffs. then deal him to nyk for gallo, randolph, a pick and tpe.

if we get melo an use him to get to the playoffs, how could we trade him to NY for gallo, randolph and a pick if he can out right sign with the knicks? why would they trade? we cant have both

[Chef]

if we get melo an use him to get to the playoffs, how could we trade him to NY for gallo, randolph and a pick if he can out right sign with the knicks? why would they trade? we cant have both

we would be the only team who could extend him ie more years for more money. we can give him 5 years where new york could only give him 4. going into the cba and potential lockout the uncertainty of cap and max contract figures is huge.

[DY_nasty]

I think the issue is that he plays like a SF on offense. I have no clue how he is defensively.

He's one of those highly raw guys who's shown great promise but is having a hard time "getting it". If the price is right I certainly wouldn't mind taking a flyer on him for the future (he wouldn't get any burn under LB).
He's incredibly raw. Think Tyrus, but a guy who puts the ball on the floor more. He's got mid-range oriented game and although he's got the length, he's never going to back anyone down - so he doesn't try. Also, like Tyrus, he's an idiot on the floor. Doesn't understand team-anything, whether it be offense or defense (and when your defense is so bad that both Nellie and Pringles don't play you, it must be bad).

Yeah, his 2k rating and potential is nice and all that, but he's not a good player and is a long ways away from being one.

[DY_nasty]

we would be the only team who could extend him ie more years for more money. we can give him 5 years where new york could only give him 4. going into the cba and potential lockout the uncertainty of cap and max contract figures is huge.
our power would be similar to Utah and Toronto's by letting the guy walk, but still getting some minor assets back via s&t after the season

[spectre]

our power would be similar to Utah and Toronto's by letting the guy walk, but still getting some minor assets back via s&t after the season

The most those guys got were (late) 1st and the fat trade exemption right? I don't think any players actually moved. I wouldn't expect much more than that if our intent was to keep Melo til the offseason and do a S&T. Maybe we get the rights to Chandler (RFA) as I'm not sure they can absorb Melo on a max deal straight up anyway.

Having that TE could be huge tho depending on the new CBA. It would allow us to make a similar move to the one with did with GSW & Richardson....which is probably about the only way we can legitimately get an impact player.

Better off in the end vs just keeping Crash? That would have to play out.

[Black]

One again, I am bored and messing with the trade machine:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=277u283

EDIT: Wrong link. Also, picks would of course be involved.

[DY_nasty]

The most those guys got were (late) 1st and the fat trade exemption right? I don't think any players actually moved. I wouldn't expect much more than that if our intent was to keep Melo til the offseason and do a S&T. Maybe we get the rights to Chandler (RFA) as I'm not sure they can absorb Melo on a max deal straight up anyway.

Having that TE could be huge tho depending on the new CBA. It would allow us to make a similar move to the one with did with GSW & Richardson....which is probably about the only way we can legitimately get an impact player.

Better off in the end vs just keeping Crash? That would have to play out.
I think it is. The team as its constructed now isn't going anywhere and anyone who's seen more than 5 games can see that Wallace isn't the same and is right on the verge of falling off a cliff.

The new CBA makes everything a gamble though.

[Chef]

a little more about the melo trade/contract rules from sheridan's chat on espn. earlier in the chat he answered the question about melo and the bobcats, also pasted.


So, assuming the "Knicks-only" scenario is true, what happens if Denver holds Melo past the deadline? Will the Knicks have enough cap space during the off-season to sign Melo outright?
Chris Sheridan
(2:17 PM)


I am glad you brought this up, JB, because it gets interesting. ...
Chris Sheridan
(2:20 PM)


Carmelo is under contract through next season, but he has an opt-out (actually an ETO, basically the same thing). So Carmelo is not considered an expiring contract, and he remains tradeable right up until June 30 if the Nuggets hang onto him past the deadline. Also, the extension that's sitting on the table is good through June 30, too. This is a piece of leverage the Nuggets hold over the Knicks, because NY needs to make the trade by Feb. 24 in order to include Eddy Curry's expiring contract in the deal. And you need the Curry money to make the salaries match.


Jon (Charlotte)


On ESPN bottom line there was info that Bobcats owner Michael Jordan was initiating talks of the trade to NY. What involvement do the bobcats have, if any?
Chris Sheridan
(2:29 PM)


As I reported Saturday, Jordan has been trying to get Carmelo to save the Bobcats season. He is willing to take him on as a rental. Plus, when Larry Brown says some of his players are tuning him out, history shows that's what he usually says when he wants to trade somebody. Yesterday, at the Garden, Chris Broussard asked Carmelo if he thought the Nuggets would trade him to a team where he wouldn't sign an extension. And Carmelo said in a very confident tone that he does not expect that to happen.


my take from denver's perspective is that they would rather have crash (of last year not this year) and diaw and stay relevant over the next two seasons and rebuild through trading expirings rather than new york's deal. the knicks deal would be getting about fifty cents on the dollar where if we did a naz, diaw, crash for melo, anderson deal that is about 75 cents on the dollar. all of that money comes off the books in 2 years along with billups and nene.

[DY_nasty]

a little more about the melo trade/contract rules from sheridan's chat on espn. earlier in the chat he answered the question about melo and the bobcats, also pasted.


So, assuming the "Knicks-only" scenario is true, what happens if Denver holds Melo past the deadline? Will the Knicks have enough cap space during the off-season to sign Melo outright?
Chris Sheridan
(2:17 PM)


I am glad you brought this up, JB, because it gets interesting. ...
Chris Sheridan
(2:20 PM)


Carmelo is under contract through next season, but he has an opt-out (actually an ETO, basically the same thing). So Carmelo is not considered an expiring contract, and he remains tradeable right up until June 30 if the Nuggets hang onto him past the deadline. Also, the extension that's sitting on the table is good through June 30, too. This is a piece of leverage the Nuggets hold over the Knicks, because NY needs to make the trade by Feb. 24 in order to include Eddy Curry's expiring contract in the deal. And you need the Curry money to make the salaries match.


Jon (Charlotte)


On ESPN bottom line there was info that Bobcats owner Michael Jordan was initiating talks of the trade to NY. What involvement do the bobcats have, if any?
Chris Sheridan
(2:29 PM)


As I reported Saturday, Jordan has been trying to get Carmelo to save the Bobcats season. He is willing to take him on as a rental. Plus, when Larry Brown says some of his players are tuning him out, history shows that's what he usually says when he wants to trade somebody. Yesterday, at the Garden, Chris Broussard asked Carmelo if he thought the Nuggets would trade him to a team where he wouldn't sign an extension. And Carmelo said in a very confident tone that he does not expect that to happen.


my take from denver's perspective is that they would rather have crash (of last year not this year) and diaw and stay relevant over the next two seasons and rebuild through trading expirings rather than new york's deal. the knicks deal would be getting about fifty cents on the dollar where if we did a naz, diaw, crash for melo, anderson deal that is about 75 cents on the dollar. all of that money comes off the books in 2 years along with billups and nene.
thanks chef, good info in this bit. didn't know about the Feb 24 stuff...

[Scottley Crue]

a little more about the melo trade/contract rules from sheridan's chat on espn. earlier in the chat he answered the question about melo and the bobcats, also pasted.


So, assuming the "Knicks-only" scenario is true, what happens if Denver holds Melo past the deadline? Will the Knicks have enough cap space during the off-season to sign Melo outright?
Chris Sheridan
(2:17 PM)


I am glad you brought this up, JB, because it gets interesting. ...
Chris Sheridan
(2:20 PM)


Carmelo is under contract through next season, but he has an opt-out (actually an ETO, basically the same thing). So Carmelo is not considered an expiring contract, and he remains tradeable right up until June 30 if the Nuggets hang onto him past the deadline. Also, the extension that's sitting on the table is good through June 30, too. This is a piece of leverage the Nuggets hold over the Knicks, because NY needs to make the trade by Feb. 24 in order to include Eddy Curry's expiring contract in the deal. And you need the Curry money to make the salaries match.


Jon (Charlotte)


On ESPN bottom line there was info that Bobcats owner Michael Jordan was initiating talks of the trade to NY. What involvement do the bobcats have, if any?
Chris Sheridan
(2:29 PM)


As I reported Saturday, Jordan has been trying to get Carmelo to save the Bobcats season. He is willing to take him on as a rental. Plus, when Larry Brown says some of his players are tuning him out, history shows that's what he usually says when he wants to trade somebody. Yesterday, at the Garden, Chris Broussard asked Carmelo if he thought the Nuggets would trade him to a team where he wouldn't sign an extension. And Carmelo said in a very confident tone that he does not expect that to happen.


my take from denver's perspective is that they would rather have crash (of last year not this year) and diaw and stay relevant over the next two seasons and rebuild through trading expirings rather than new york's deal. the knicks deal would be getting about fifty cents on the dollar where if we did a naz, diaw, crash for melo, anderson deal that is about 75 cents on the dollar. all of that money comes off the books in 2 years along with billups and nene.

Weeeeeeeeelllll, Carmelo's not the one charged with putting the Nuggets' roster together, so it doesn't particularly matter if he doesn't think it'll happen. And unless he really wants to have the LeBron treatment, I highly doubt he'll refuse to show up if it's not the Knicks he's traded to. Now he may not end up a Bobcat, but it's Denver who'll decide where he finishes the season, not him.

[Scottley Crue]

a little more about the melo trade/contract rules from sheridan's chat on espn. earlier in the chat he answered the question about melo and the bobcats, also pasted.


So, assuming the "Knicks-only" scenario is true, what happens if Denver holds Melo past the deadline? Will the Knicks have enough cap space during the off-season to sign Melo outright?
Chris Sheridan
(2:17 PM)


I am glad you brought this up, JB, because it gets interesting. ...
Chris Sheridan
(2:20 PM)


Carmelo is under contract through next season, but he has an opt-out (actually an ETO, basically the same thing). So Carmelo is not considered an expiring contract, and he remains tradeable right up until June 30 if the Nuggets hang onto him past the deadline. Also, the extension that's sitting on the table is good through June 30, too. This is a piece of leverage the Nuggets hold over the Knicks, because NY needs to make the trade by Feb. 24 in order to include Eddy Curry's expiring contract in the deal. And you need the Curry money to make the salaries match.


Jon (Charlotte)


On ESPN bottom line there was info that Bobcats owner Michael Jordan was initiating talks of the trade to NY. What involvement do the bobcats have, if any?
Chris Sheridan
(2:29 PM)


As I reported Saturday, Jordan has been trying to get Carmelo to save the Bobcats season. He is willing to take him on as a rental. Plus, when Larry Brown says some of his players are tuning him out, history shows that's what he usually says when he wants to trade somebody. Yesterday, at the Garden, Chris Broussard asked Carmelo if he thought the Nuggets would trade him to a team where he wouldn't sign an extension. And Carmelo said in a very confident tone that he does not expect that to happen.


my take from denver's perspective is that they would rather have crash (of last year not this year) and diaw and stay relevant over the next two seasons and rebuild through trading expirings rather than new york's deal. the knicks deal would be getting about fifty cents on the dollar where if we did a naz, diaw, crash for melo, anderson deal that is about 75 cents on the dollar. all of that money comes off the books in 2 years along with billups and nene.

Weeeeeeeeelllll, Carmelo's not the one charged with putting the Nuggets' roster together, so it doesn't particularly matter if he doesn't think it'll happen. And unless he really wants to have the LeBron treatment, I highly doubt he'll refuse to show up if it's not the Knicks he's traded to. Now he may not end up a Bobcat, but it's Denver who'll decide where he finishes the season, not him.

[Plowright]

Thabeet is avaiable according to real gm, the athleticl big we are looking for? I know RAW is an understatment but remember he has only played since he was 16, he is yearsssssssssss behind everyone else. I know the major development years for leaning are 10-14 (its that in soccer anyway) but we could get him, sign him to a shoddy deal then in 3-4 years he could be a dalembert type player on the cheap.

[DY_nasty]

Thabeet is avaiable according to real gm, the athleticl big we are looking for? I know RAW is an understatment but remember he has only played since he was 16, he is yearsssssssssss behind everyone else. I know the major development years for leaning are 10-14 (its that in soccer anyway) but we could get him, sign him to a shoddy deal then in 3-4 years he could be a dalembert type player on the cheap.
He's terrible, not all that young, can't defend anyone, isn't exactly cheap, and looks like a goofball on the court. We're better off with Kwame no-hands and Nazr (with minutes, lulz)

[rsxnova]

We are so bad off at C that i would take a shot in the dark on Thabeet. He could be a good shot blocker at least.

[ammofan]

Thabeet is avaiable according to real gm, the athleticl big we are looking for? I know RAW is an understatment but remember he has only played since he was 16, he is yearsssssssssss behind everyone else. I know the major development years for leaning are 10-14 (its that in soccer anyway) but we could get him, sign him to a shoddy deal then in 3-4 years he could be a dalembert type player on the cheap.

I dont want him as long as LB is coach. I think the kid could do good in the NBA eventually, but I dont want him to be ruined under LB like Lexy, Hendo, Morrison(to some extent) and DJ(kinda) have been...

[Chef]

I dont want him as long as LB is coach. I think the kid could do good in the NBA eventually, but I dont want him to be ruined under LB like Lexy, Hendo, Morrison(to some extent) and DJ(kinda) have been...

he sucks something terrible. at this point he is a bad contract. he can't even make it in the d league.

[DY_nasty]

We are so bad off at C that i would take a shot in the dark on Thabeet. He could be a good shot blocker at least.
The griz drafted him thinking that at worse he could do just that.

He's not even good enough to stay on the court to goon it up.

[mrtarheel]

True Thabeet isn't that good but what if we were able to lure them into a three team deal with us and Sac. They could use Diaw at pf with Zbo backing up Gasol. Sac is said to be getting rid of Landry because he won't resign after this year and Mayo is said to be tradeable.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=25wwdof

[Black]

True Thabeet isn't that good but what if we were able to lure them into a three team deal with us and Sac. They could use Diaw at pf with Zbo backing up Gasol. Sac is said to be getting rid of Landry because he won't resign after this year and Mayo is said to be tradeable.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=25wwdof

1-The Grizzlies would never trade Mayo AND Henry.

2-Randolph off the bench? Not in a million years.

3-No way we get Landry and Mayo and only give up Diaw and Hendo.

[Black]

Also, the Kings are in the market for a point guard.

[Proudiddy]

Terrance Williams headed to Houston for virtually nothing.

Joe Smith from NJ to LA for LA's '11 1st rounder.

Sasha Vujajic and HOU '12 1st Rounder to NJ as well

WTF ARE WE DOING?!?!?

http://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA

[DY_nasty]

Not giving away what little assets we have for one unproven headcase - like we did last year. Twice.

[Proudiddy]

Wouldn't you rather have a YOUNG headcase than an aging turnover prone one? Or even just bring him in to come off the bench. I mean, it's not like LB is playing Hendo or Brown anyway. We HAVE DOMINIC FUCKING MCGUIRE.

My main point is, that not only did we miss out on acquiring TWill, it was a lose-lose for us b/c now we basically lose out on any chance to get Carmelo as well. Our front office gets more awesome by the minute.

[ND22]

WTF ARE WE DOING?!?!?

Not trying to get Terrence Williams? He's a nice player sure, and I think he's going to turn it around, but is he the guy to push us into the playoffs? No. We know MJ is looking for a trade so it's not like we are sitting on our ass.

[BIGCatBobcat]

Just because there is a trade and the Bobcats are not involved, even if it's a guy you covet, I don't think you get pissed at the front office.

[Proudiddy]

Just because there is a trade and the Bobcats are not involved, even if it's a guy you covet, I don't think you get pissed at the front office.

lol, you must not be familiar with me BCB.

It really does piss me off. We make a move for Dampier's "coveted" contract and pick up ultra-scrubs, kings of DNPs Eduardo and Matt... But we can't pull the trigger on a trade that actually makes us better. The Jack move is questionable now, because it wasn't viable long-term. We've got to do something to redeem ourselves from this offseason of disaster.

I just don't like sitting around with the label of dumbest front office in the league. If you're not getting better, you're getting worse.

[DY_nasty]

Wouldn't you rather have a YOUNG headcase than an aging turnover prone one? Or even just bring him in to come off the bench. I mean, it's not like LB is playing Hendo or Brown anyway. We HAVE DOMINIC FUCKING MCGUIRE.

My main point is, that not only did we miss out on acquiring TWill, it was a lose-lose for us b/c now we basically lose out on any chance to get Carmelo as well. Our front office gets more awesome by the minute.We already have a young headcase in Tyrus. If LB isn't playing Brown over McGuire, then thats Larry Brown being a dope... not the front office.

TWill is nice and all, but is he the guy thats going to get us into the playoffs? I doubt it. And if we bring in another guy who can't shoot, I'll start showing up to games with a paper bag over my head.

[BIGCatBobcat]

Is NJ loading up first rounders to get Carmello?

[Proudiddy]

IIRC, He wasn't that bad of a shooter last year, but don't hold me to that b/c I don't feel like looking.

And honestly, Jack can't shoot, he just shoots a lot. I'd rather have TWill than Jack at this point. And yes, I believe he could've given us a spark to the playoffs, whether he was playing behind Jack or starting in his place. He also shares a similar skill set and size, and is younger.

[RMT]

Bobcats Get: Melo & Billiups.

Nuggets Get: Stephen Jackson,Gerald Wallace,and Boris Diaw.

Reason For Bobcats: to get them back to the playoffs this year and make a splash.I know Melo would never resign here in the off season but it be fine cause the team we got now has reached it peaked and its time for us to rebuild again.

Bobcats Line up:
PG:Billiups/DJ/Livington
SG:Henderson/Carroll
SF:Melo/D.Brown/McGuire
PF:Thomas/Najera
C:Naz/K.Brown/Diop

[Proudiddy]

Is NJ loading up first rounders to get Carmello?

Yeah, that was my point. We should've at least attempted to block the move somehow... They picked up two firsts for Melo, AND we missed out on TWill. If we would've been involved somehow, whether it was keeping those picks from going to NJ, or getting TWill then I'd be happy. But, no we missed on him and have zero chance at Melo now with the assests they've acquired.

[DY_nasty]

Yeah, that was my point. We should've at least attempted to block the move somehow... They picked up two firsts for Melo, AND we missed out on TWill. If we would've been involved somehow, whether it was keeping those picks from going to NJ, or getting TWill then I'd be happy. But, no we missed on him and have zero chance at Melo now with the assests they've acquired.
I was cool with a Melo rental... not really hyped for it.

Not that big of a deal for the franchise either way really. *shrug*

[Dcarnys]

I would do it in an instant, I doubt Denver would. We would need to get another 2 or move Billups there and let DJ start at PG.

[TattoodCats4life]

I would do it in an instant, I doubt Denver would. We would need to get another 2 or move DJ there and let Billups start at PG.

Fixed that for you. DJ has more 2 in his blood than Billups, size be damned.

[TattoodCats4life]

I would rather have Sasha V out of that trade...sorry

[WarioVsMooChicken]

Why the heck did LA do that?

[DY_nasty]

Why the heck did LA do that?
Because they hate Sasha and they really need some more bigs because Pau is being worked too hard.

[WarioVsMooChicken]

Joe Smith is not worth a 1st rounder...at all. Seriously, I'm trying to justify this and just can't. LA just doesn't give a fuck about picks

[G Wuh Wuh Wuh Wallace]

Ya, I don't get this by LA at all. Looks like a steal for HOU and NJ is getting stocked for the mello trade. Who is to say we are not still a third party to that trade though?

[Marvel]

Where does T-Will fit in Houston exactly?

[teej]

Where does T-Will fit in Houston exactly?

Next to Adelman on the bench.

[Marvel]

According to Larry Coon the Lakers get a $5.5 mil trade exception with the trade.

[ohara831]

Denver is going to come out of this with 4 1st round picks. Man, way to reload the gun.

[Marvel]

Denver is going to come out of this with 4 1st round picks. Man, way to reload the gun.

As long as they don't draft 4 point guards they should be good.

[BlockParty]

Denver is going to come out of this with 4 1st round picks. Man, way to reload the gun.

One of them will be the Laker's though (and a late late 1st round pick is frowned upon because of the guarantees vs a early 2nd round pick) Though the CBA may blow that up.


As long as they don't draft 4 point guards they should be good.
Minnesota tried that...they still haven't had all 4 in the same state yet

[kickazzz2000]

As long as they don't draft 4 point guards they should be good.

kaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhnnnnnnn

[Scottley Crue]

Just because there is a trade and the Bobcats are not involved, even if it's a guy you covet, I don't think you get pissed at the front office.

I've gotta go along with this. The 'Cats have shown they're more than willing to make deals, so I don't think there's a lack of effort on that front. I don't really view Williams as a game-changer, so I can't say I'm bothered by not being involved in this deal.

And all those picks certainly help NJ's case with Carmelo, but I wonder how eager they'd be if he has no intention of signing there long-term. Favors, an expiring contract and multiple draft picks is a helluva price to pay for a rental (and could serve NJ well themselves). That deal my look good for Denver, but it's not too sweet for NJ if Carmello's not in it long-term.

[Woody]

Local ABC outlet in Denver reporting Carmelo Anthony has been traded to the New Jersey Nets.

[G Wuh Wuh Wuh Wallace]

send the link

[Woody]

@DenverChannel (http://twitter.com/DenverChannel): The Nuggets and Nets come to terms to trade Carmelo Anthony to the Nets full report at 10:00

[Woody]

@denverchannel The Denver Nuggets and New Jersey Nets come to terms to trade Carmelo Anthony to the Nets... full report at 10:00 p.m. with Lionel Bienvenu!

@denverchannel Camelo Anthony will need to commit to a long term contract with the Nets before the deal is done...full report in 2 mins on channel 7.

@christomasson A Nuggets official said rumor is false. I just talked to Melo and he said, "It's terrible. There's no truth to it.''

Reporting these days is terrible

[Toocool]

Chill Diddy. Just because we didn't get involved, doesn't mean we weren't interested. You can't expect the FO to jump at every frickin trade available can you? Sure T-will is good and all, however in terms of play style he's pretty much a glorified Hendo at this point.

[Chef]

Wouldn't you rather have a YOUNG headcase than an aging turnover prone one? Or even just bring him in to come off the bench. I mean, it's not like LB is playing Hendo or Brown anyway. We HAVE DOMINIC FUCKING MCGUIRE.

My main point is, that not only did we miss out on acquiring TWill, it was a lose-lose for us b/c now we basically lose out on any chance to get Carmelo as well. Our front office gets more awesome by the minute.

they could get 8 first rounders but melo wants to be in madison square garden not brooklyn and if he isn't signing an extension he is at the most a 1/2 season rental for 2 late first rounders.

[Chef]

Joe Smith is not worth a 1st rounder...at all. Seriously, I'm trying to justify this and just can't. LA just doesn't give a fuck about picks

the pick will be very late so it probably won't amount to much. unless they luck out and get a landry fields or geroge hill.

[Chef]

According to Larry Coon the Lakers get a $5.5 mil trade exception with the trade.

then they turn around and do this with philly
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2e8fo8k

and throw in a pick or two. they take virtually all the contracts off phil give them a center and/or trade chip and could probably turn artest into something minor from a contender in a year or two and walton may retire any second. meanwhile the lakers load up on contracts but everyone comes off the books at or just before kobe's last contract year. go for a 4-5 year run.

[Chef]

glorified Hendo

too many jokes. glorified hendo that sounds as nice as a glorified vanilla pudding.

[rsxnova]

Hou will probably reroute TWill to Sac for Landry.

[Chef]

Hou will probably reroute TWill to Sac for Landry.

twil and reke play the same position. they are looking for a pg, right?

[rsxnova]

twil and reke play the same position. they are looking for a pg, right?
I think either or at this point. Twill has pretty good handles so they could work together with the ball.

[SWedd523]

Neither one can shoot from outside. A TWill/Tyreke pairing would be terrible

[Marvel]

Neither one can shoot from outside. A TWill/Tyreke pairing would be terrible

It would be catastrophic...

[ammofan]

Shouldnt this thread be in the Around the NBA section? lol

[teej]

Merged 4 threads into the one they should all be in.

Common sense, guys.

[SWedd523]

Merged 4 threads into the one they should all be in.

Common sense, guys.

Speaking of!

[BigMike]

Merged 4 threads into the one they should all be in.

Common sense, guys.

tldr;

sorry ;)