Blow it up.

[Absinthe]

All of it. Fans deserve better than this. When one sub .500 team is beating another sub .500 team by nearly thirty points you know the latter team has major problems.

The players have turned on Larry Brown, but he isn't the major problem. Put another coach on this team with the same roster and they won't make the playoffs. Larry Brown doesn't necessarily help matters, but he's being used as a scapegoat. This team's major problem is a talent issue. Botched drafts, bad trades, and questionable signings tend to bog down a team. It's past the point of embarrassment.

[GoBobs]

we should have started a year and a half ago

[Absinthe]

we should have started a year and a half ago

I've been very vocal on this board about the Bobs needing to be blown up. But fans are delusional and they think this team can compete. Something has to be done. The Bobcats are just good enough not to be a lottery team. That is a terrible, terrible thing to be. I wish they'd hurry up and trade away valuable assets while they can.

[BETCATS]

We made a big poo poo out on the court today.
MJ and Rod better wipe it up, but not in a rushed way.

[Scottley Crue]

We made a big poo poo out on the court today.
MJ and Rod better wipe it up, but not in a rushed way.

Yes, a fresh change is needed. Although I've been against it, it's really time to make some long-view trades. It might be a good idea to trade for a professional player who understands and can convey the importance of actually trying. That's the most frustrating part to me.

[DY_nasty]

I remember when I said that we should trade Wallace for some late 1st round picks and everyone was all like "no way bro! you're crazy! g-force 4 life"

[BETCATS]

Im gonna add: burning it down all at once is a bad idea.
We have expiring that we should let expire, and we need to trade our hot guys while they are hot. MJ needs to assure 2-3 guys that they are the core and we should build around them. I purpose DJ/Livingston/Derrick Brown/Tyrus

Personal Wishlist: Trade Wallace and Jackson for whatever good young talent/expirings you can get. Try to dump Diop by a miracle and add Henderson to a trade if it increases what we can get back. Let Diaw/Nazr expire. Jeff Green and Spenser Hawes are upcoming free agents and will be obtainable.

[teej]

Hawes sucks and Green hasn't been as good as expected.

There are three guys on this team that have any upside at all: DJ, Tyrus, and UPS. Everyone else is either at or past their best.

[Absinthe]

The front office needs to use Oklahoma's franchise as a model on how to rebuild a team.

[Dcarnys]

The front office needs to use Oklahoma's franchise as a model on how to rebuild a team.

Take a roster from Seattle??

Im sorry I had to.

[BigMike]

For 5 years I have been been the guy screaming "we are sooooo close we just need 1 piece" at my TV and on message boards like this. Telling all my friends how close we are to breaking out.
But that was when we were playing with heart, beating the lakers and cavs, loosing game after game in OT or by less then 3. Heart breaking losses that you couldn't turn off till it was over!

Now most of you here are the same old "the sky is falling" and "I only post when I have something negative to say" people that annoy us "cheer for the team and hope for the best" fans. But for the first time I have to agree with you.

I am embarrassed for these guy when I am watching them.

[TattoodCats4life]

I haven't watched fewer games in any season I've been a fan...and I started following the team when the biscuit took over.

[stun704]

Can anyone tell me why Dominic McGuire started over Tyrus Thomas, PLEASE?

[SWedd523]

At one point, the route was so substantial that another breakaway by Memphis led to the Charlotte players waiting on their offensive end as Arthur scored another dunk.

That's all I needed to read to know that this team is done. Absolutely finished. Tonight was a disgusting display of basketball and showed that this team has a total lack of respect for themselves and their fans. Fuck each and every single one of them. They're all a bunch of butthurt babies that don't deserve for fans to pay to watch them.

Fuck Crash
Fuck Jack
Fuck Boris
Fuck DJ
Fuck Nazr

And fuck all of the bums on the bench. If they don't care, neither do I.

[Fred Williamson]

That's all I needed to read to know that this team is done. Absolutely finished. Tonight was a disgusting display of basketball and showed that this team has a total lack of respect for themselves and their fans. Fuck each and every single one of them. They're all a bunch of butthurt babies that don't deserve for fans to pay to watch them.

Fuck Crash
Fuck Jack
Fuck Boris
Fuck DJ
Fuck Nazr

And fuck all of the bums on the bench. If they don't care, neither do I.

and fuck LB too.

Get rid of each and every one. There is no "talent" or "upside" on this team. They all suck big hairy testicles. Trade'em all.

[Proudiddy]

For 5 years I have been been the guy screaming "we are sooooo close we just need 1 piece" at my TV and on message boards like this. Telling all my friends how close we are to breaking out.
But that was when we were playing with heart, beating the lakers and cavs, loosing game after game in OT or by less then 3. Heart breaking losses that you couldn't turn off till it was over!

Now most of you here are the same old "the sky is falling" and "I only post when I have something negative to say" people that annoy us "cheer for the team and hope for the best" fans. But for the first time I have to agree with you.

I am embarrassed for these guy when I am watching them.

I feel ya Mike. I post through good and bad, but I have to admit the overall tone of my more recent posts have been extremely pessimistic, but this team has done it to me. I posted with my hopes for the team and my expectations. I would sit for agonizing hours in front of my laptop watching games with sh*tty streams, for no reason because the dumbasses in the front office and networks haven't worked something out.

Then we have the disaster known as our playoff appearance to end the season... But, that's cool, we had the next season to look forward to. Just add a few pieces here and there, try to get a draft pick, sign an impact guy to come off the bench, concentrate on helping the 1 and the 5 spots... Well, instead, we didn't get a draft pick. We eviscerated the 1 and the 5 position, with DJ being the only guy worth a shit out of both spots now. Our "impact" guys coming off the bench are McGuire and Livingston... *VOMIT*

Then we trade the only player we had that can consistently compete and set a tone defensively in the post in Tyson for another team's garbage "DNPs." Yup, ladies and gents, that's how you capitalize on your most successful season in team history and first playoff appearance. I was fine with what we did wth Felton either way, if we kept him or let him walk, but I wanted DJ to get more PT regardless. Yet, we let him walk for virtually nothing for a starting PG and his team was riding an 8-game winning streak coming into tonight.

Tyson? Well, IIRC, his team only has 5 losses on the year and everyone's raving about his addition.

And what did we get for him? Two more guys that are benchwarmers with niche abilities, they aren't legit players. Oh yeah, and their combined salaries are greater than if we would've just left the roster as-is for next year.

Genius.

Combine all this with the horrible season the Panthers have had, and I'm just kind of in IDGAF mode. I've never recalled such a horrible season to be a Carolina sports fan, there is NOTHING to be happy about.

And people wonder why I was pissed @ our front office for passing on TWill or getting involved in that trade? LMAO. Because we've spent the whole offseason PURPOSELY getting WORSE. It's time to start fixing this. This team is horrible and will not sniff the playoffs as currently constructed. Then again, maybe it was good that we didn't get involved, we probably would've re-signed Gana Diop to a 20-year/$250M deal b/c he can play defense and then added Jared Jeffries and Luke Walton.

WE SUCK and I haven't even attempted to look up a game for about 2 or 3 weeks now. I know what I'm gonna see, and I'm tired of it. I'm always gonna be a fan, but I'm not into masochism.

[ammofan]

I want OJ mayo

[Chef]

here is my take.
1. please don't suggest use the okc model. they had a set of very unique circumstances that got them to where they are now. the durant goof by portland, westbrook jackpot at #5, then 3rd overall the next year (which they missed on curry on that team would be pretty special), ibaka turning into something. if by model you mean try to build through the draft, keep below the cap, make trades to take on dead salary but acquiring picks/talent, then yes. but don't assume it will work the same. we have shown that drafting/multiple picks can certainly end up with busts.
2. the players have quit and should be criticized but LB should get the most blame. usually, when a coach quits on the team/loses the team it goes 1 of 2 ways: the players galvanize and play to spite the coach or lose interest and heart and go into eff it mode. our players have chosen the latter which probably speaks to losing felton's leadership and the fact that they know they will be blamed because the HOF coach couldn't possibly do a bad job. (despite the fact he built a running team and won't run)
3. we have to rebuild, but some of the suggestions as to who we get or keep are not very good. everyone should be moveable. none of our players now are franchise players so why pretend to build a franchise with them. if anyone of them can fetch a pick or salary relief we do it.
4. everyone wanting a rebuild needs be prepared for what that means. it means years not one year. it will be like starting all over again. be ready for very dark times over a few seasons. if you think it is bad now, just wait. most everyone here remembers getting excited for 25 win seasons and 15 game losing streaks.
5. in reality, does mj want to totally rebuild vs try (usually does not work) a rebuild on the fly. it is his money that is at stake, and contrary to popular belief he is in debt with this team. over $100 mil is on credit so it is a big deal to him that people actually show up to the games. that is not happening with a starting lineup of dj/vc/ups/scalabrini/nazr, so don't get too bent out of shape when/if we don't just start over.
6. there are many things to pray for in life (if that is your thing) and god can handle all requests, so after the big stuff it might help to ask for a little luck in the drafting dept because it is going to take some good lotto bounces and a franchise player like griffin, durant, etc on multiple years to turn this completely around.

[Proudiddy]

here is my take.
1. please don't suggest use the okc model. they had a set of very unique circumstances that got them to where they are now. the durant goof by portland, westbrook jackpot at #5, then 3rd overall the next year (which they missed on curry on that team would be pretty special), ibaka turning into something. if by model you mean try to build through the draft, keep below the cap, make trades to take on dead salary but acquiring picks/talent, then yes. but don't assume it will work the same. we have shown that drafting/multiple picks can certainly end up with busts.
2. the players have quit and should be criticized but LB should get the most blame. usually, when a coach quits on the team/loses the team it goes 1 of 2 ways: the players galvanize and play to spite the coach or lose interest and heart and go into eff it mode. our players have chosen the latter which probably speaks to losing felton's leadership and the fact that they know they will be blamed because the HOF coach couldn't possibly do a bad job. (despite the fact he built a running team and won't run)
3. we have to rebuild, but some of the suggestions as to who we get or keep are not very good. everyone should be moveable. none of our players now are franchise players so why pretend to build a franchise with them. if anyone of them can fetch a pick or salary relief we do it.
4. everyone wanting a rebuild needs be prepared for what that means. it means years not one year. it will be like starting all over again. be ready for very dark times over a few seasons. if you think it is bad now, just wait. most everyone here remembers getting excited for 25 win seasons and 15 game losing streaks.
5. in reality, does mj want to totally rebuild vs try (usually does not work) a rebuild on the fly. it is his money that is at stake, and contrary to popular belief he is in debt with this team. over $100 mil is on credit so it is a big deal to him that people actually show up to the games. that is not happening with a starting lineup of dj/vc/ups/scalabrini/nazr, so don't get too bent out of shape when/if we don't just start over.
6. there are many things to pray for in life (if that is your thing) and god can handle all requests, so after the big stuff it might help to ask for a little luck in the drafting dept because it is going to take some good lotto bounces and a franchise player like griffin, durant, etc on multiple years to turn this completely around.

Good points Chef. But, in regards to rebuilding, my point is that we're facing those "dark ages" anyway with this team as it stands. With Gerald's kind of game, his admission that basically he's a nobody without Felton's play and leadership, then you add a 32 or 33 year-old turnover prone, shot-jacking Stephen Jackson as this team's "core," you quickly realize that this team isn't built for success over the short-term either. We're on the cusp of sucking for years to come anyway.

The way I see it... It's kind of like if you had a girlfriend you've been with for 5 years and you find out she's cheating on you. Do you stick around and hope for her to change so she can do it again in 2 years and you wasted 2 more years of your life? Or do you tell her don't let the door hit her on her way out? Either way, it's gonna be painful, so I prefer to face it and get it over with. Who knows, we may be surprised at what good results we could get from just "facing it" now.

[spectre]

here is my take.
1. please don't suggest use the okc model. they had a set of very unique circumstances that got them to where they are now. the durant goof by portland, westbrook jackpot at #5, then 3rd overall the next year (which they missed on curry on that team would be pretty special), ibaka turning into something. if by model you mean try to build through the draft, keep below the cap, make trades to take on dead salary but acquiring picks/talent, then yes. but don't assume it will work the same. we have shown that drafting/multiple picks can certainly end up with busts.
2. the players have quit and should be criticized but LB should get the most blame. usually, when a coach quits on the team/loses the team it goes 1 of 2 ways: the players galvanize and play to spite the coach or lose interest and heart and go into eff it mode. our players have chosen the latter which probably speaks to losing felton's leadership and the fact that they know they will be blamed because the HOF coach couldn't possibly do a bad job. (despite the fact he built a running team and won't run)
3. we have to rebuild, but some of the suggestions as to who we get or keep are not very good. everyone should be moveable. none of our players now are franchise players so why pretend to build a franchise with them. if anyone of them can fetch a pick or salary relief we do it.
4. everyone wanting a rebuild needs be prepared for what that means. it means years not one year. it will be like starting all over again. be ready for very dark times over a few seasons. if you think it is bad now, just wait. most everyone here remembers getting excited for 25 win seasons and 15 game losing streaks.
5. in reality, does mj want to totally rebuild vs try (usually does not work) a rebuild on the fly. it is his money that is at stake, and contrary to popular belief he is in debt with this team. over $100 mil is on credit so it is a big deal to him that people actually show up to the games. that is not happening with a starting lineup of dj/vc/ups/scalabrini/nazr, so don't get too bent out of shape when/if we don't just start over.
6. there are many things to pray for in life (if that is your thing) and god can handle all requests, so after the big stuff it might help to ask for a little luck in the drafting dept because it is going to take some good lotto bounces and a franchise player like griffin, durant, etc on multiple years to turn this completely around.

Well said.

MJ ain't rebuilding from scratch. Just like last year (and for the same reasons) he's going to try and do it on the fly. He HAS to generate revenue, and another 3 years of 18-25 wins would kill him financially with this team.

[Chef]

Good points Chef. But, in regards to rebuilding, my point is that we're facing those "dark ages" anyway with this team as it stands. With Gerald's kind of game, his admission that basically he's a nobody without Felton's play and leadership, then you add a 32 or 33 year-old turnover prone, shot-jacking Stephen Jackson as this team's "core," you quickly realize that this team isn't built for success over the short-term either. We're on the cusp of sucking for years to come anyway.

The way I see it... It's kind of like if you had a girlfriend you've been with for 5 years and you find out she's cheating on you. Do you stick around and hope for her to change so she can do it again in 2 years and you wasted 2 more years of your life? Or do you tell her don't let the door hit her on her way out? Either way, it's gonna be painful, so I prefer to face it and get it over with. Who knows, we may be surprised at what good results we could get from just "facing it" now.

i forgot to put at the end, i am in the blow up camp. just wanted to make sure we all know what is coming and what to expect. it would be unfair to advocate blow it up then membership to this site falls to 10 of us two years later because we are absolutely desolate on the court.

[ziggy]

i forgot to put at the end, i am in the blow up camp. just wanted to make sure we all know what is coming and what to expect. it would be unfair to advocate blow it up then membership to this site falls to 10 of us two years later because we are absolutely desolate on the court.

I don't think membership would drop, but the tone around the site definitely would definitely change.

And for the record... Ziggy says blow it up

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w301/bobcatsplanet/nuclear-explosion.jpg

[fallen xxi]

http://www.mowerhistory.com/wp-content/woo_custom/35-a_bomb.jpg
Blow this shit up! There's no point in losing without a motive. The Bobcats have no motive..and quite frankly...I don't know if they've EVER had a motive towards winning.

[Jennings]

I'm going with blow it up as well. This is terrible! I've actually missed a few games this year and haven't even cared. They need to do something. I do think MJ is trying. I think something will go down in the Melo deal. And to say we need to follow OKC's way is saying we would have to draft well, and we know how that's been working for us. AND I JUST HAD ANOTHER FUTURE BOBCAT FAN YESTERDAY AND i COME HOME TO THIS SHIT FOR GAME!!!!!! Oh well, having a child definitely puts things in perspective though.

[Chef]

I'm going with blow it up as well. This is terrible! I've actually missed a few games this year and haven't even cared. They need to do something. I do think MJ is trying. I think something will go down in the Melo deal. And to say we need to follow OKC's way is saying we would have to draft well, and we know how that's been working for us. AND I JUST HAD ANOTHER FUTURE BOBCAT FAN YESTERDAY AND i COME HOME TO THIS SHIT FOR GAME!!!!!! Oh well, having a child definitely puts things in perspective though.

congrats. this is my rookie season with child as well. good luck watching any stretch of any game uninterrupted. hope you have a dvr because west coast games aren't going to happen period.

[Jennings]

congrats. this is my rookie season with child as well. good luck watching any stretch of any game uninterrupted. hope you have a dvr because west coast games aren't going to happen period.

Haha, I have a 20 month as well. I know how it is. All I can say is THANK GOD FOR DVR!

[BRNC]

I'll try to weigh-in quickly with a couple of quick thoughts...

1) LB left this team (mentally) at the end of last season so no one should be surprised this is happening...
2) I'm still in the "you can't blow up " what has never been functional...
3) Teams that constantly trade/let walk their best players for less talent are always doomed to failure...I was opposed to LB coming here...I was opposed to the Richardson trade (for what little it brought back)....I was opposed to trading EO50 (for what little it brought back)...I was opposed to letting Ray walk...my point....ask Ray or EO50 if they want to come back here...uh...kinda doubt it...
4) I've watched this team since day one (as many others here have) and frankly I've never been a fan of losing but at least the players played hard "all the time" under BBB and I miss that...
5) I'm all for any trade that actually makes this team better...but I do find it laughable that some fans here think the NBA actually works like video games...it does not and you have to have deep pockets and a great deal of luck to pull off what the Celtics did...we have neither...
6) We did not build with a solid core (Crash, Ray, and EO50) when we had the chance by hiring a coach to work with them...we hired a coach that did "blow up the team" and made us older, slower, less enthused, and damned boring to watch..so for all those that wanted the trades I mentioned above to happen...well they did...and for all those who wanted LB here well he is...if you don't like the results I understand...but it will take years to get out of this mess...

My hope is that we at least become entertaining again...I've used one, let me emphasize, one of my season tickets this year...that was enough for me...my kids have used a couple to see teams they like...but I doubt (after my daughter and her BF) watched the Celtics fiasco that I can get them to go again...

We have a fairly old-boring-unhappy team after the "last" blow up...so I suggest we all be careful what we wish for...but LB leaving would be a start for me...

[polarcat]

Chef pretty much nailed it. I've been of the opinion that we have been "one piece to the puzzle" away from being a top-3 Eastern Conference team for the past couple of seasons. I wasn't sad about Felton leaving, but I did think he was better in a system that allowed him to do his thing. D'Antoni's system is unique and not many teams subscribe to it, so it's not like Felts could've went to Philly or the Clips and have the same success, but it shows our biggest problem, our coach. LB's luster wore off last year and this year it's turned it an all out coup. DJ was his pick, and he subsequently squashes the youngsters confidence and then tries to trade him the following year. Gerald Henderson isn't Brandon Roy or some stud SG, but given more PT and a bigger role, I think he could be a solid starter....or at worse a spark plug 6th-man. Not with Larry running the ship. Our team needs to be blown up starting with Coach and make some trades that free up cap space, net us some talent and draft picks. I don't know if this team is capable of being fixed on the fly. As an avid Knicks fan since I was a kid, I've endured a team that is not allowed to blow up a team in a city that demands success and is impatient. Isiah and Dolan spent a decade trying to do things on the fly and it was a disaster. Our woes have been drafting, managing our cap in "value-friendly" players, and getting burned in trades/free agent acquisitions. Diaw and Wallace's value needs to be used properly and not on old-ass Rip Hamilton. We screwed up the DUST chip, Tyson Chandler, Diaw-Devin Harris trade. We should have improved off our first successful season and instead have gone backwards.
BLOW
THIS
SH*T
UP
M J

[Robertpel9]

Haha, I have a 20 month as well. I know how it is. All I can say is THANK GOD FOR DVR!


Hmmm, IDK, i have a 20 month old and a 2 month old. I take the 20 month old to weekday games and we have everyone asleep by 9:30 so we watch games regardless of where they are playing

Kids will acclimate to what you expect from them.

Back on topic like I have said since the summer this team is F'ed. Wallace shot his wad last year and the injuries are taking their long term toll, we have TT who basically is a younger Walalce with more size who inexplicably sits on the bench. Jax is Jax and is untradeable and while i like DJ and he is a solid offensive PG he cannot lead a team. Also our coach mentally checked out last year

Time to blow the F'er up. We MUST trade Wallace while he has any real trade value and try and get a real center and some scoring on this team. He is our only real movable assset. If the coach did not go senile we have a decent PG rotation, Jax is not going anywhere at SG, PF is probably overloaded with Diaw, TT, Brown, etc (I would package Diaw and Wallace as teams have interest in both). We then just need to fill C and SG which solves our lack of scoring and our lack of a real center. Our bench if used then is not too bad.

Time to make moves

[Mustachio]

Of course you blow it up. This whole MJ can't afford to blow it up and wants to rebuild on the fly stuff is so wrong. I think its hilarious that people think we will lose some huge fan base if we blow the team up and rebuild it. Obviously those people havent been to a game this year, especially on a weekday.

Look we have like 8000 people showing up to games as it is. MJ has nothing to lose. If anything, rebuilding with young guys and draft picks will keep us in the paper more. All the moves that surround that and people starting to realize that we are going younger will make it more exciting. As it is, I can hardly stand to go to the games. We are old, we have no future, we play the slowest blandest game i have ever been forced to sit through.

I have been saying for months that Larry is the problem. Hes trying to capture the Detroit lightning in a bottle again, and we dont have close to that talent. That team at least had someone who could put the ball in the hoop if need be. With Larry we have no future. Hes abandoned ship anyway like BRNC said... he was gone after last year. He doesnt want to be here. He knew how easy it was to make the playoffs last year, and he knows how far away we are from being any kind of a decent team.

GAMEPLAN:
Fire Larry. Hire some fresh blood, that has a system, that knows what he wants and doesnt waiver from it after a bad game. Someone with some fire, with a chip on his shoulder to prove something. someone young, with a future that doesnt consist of early bird specials.

Trade Gerald first. Let it be known that this is a rebuild. Let it be known that no one is safe. Make damn well sure players know you are serious. We will not miss him. I repeat, we will not miss him. What he does can be replaced easily.

Trade anyone else next. I dont mean trade everyone. I think we have some good pieces. I like Kwame at his rate. I like Brown, Hendo, Liv, DJ, and Tyrus especially. My point is, do whatever it takes to get younger, cheaper and to fit whatever plan the new coach regime has. If you wanna run, get runners. If you wanna slow it down, get bigs. etc.

Finally. Get a new identity. If the Hornets is available that would be a good start. This team has left a bad taste in Charlottes mouth since day 1. Why not jump at the chance to erase that? Winning is the only thing that will keep the stands full anymore, but I guarantee that far fewer people will hate/not care about the Hornets.

[ziggy]

............. Finally. Get a new identity. If the Hornets is available that would be a good start. This team has left a bad taste in Charlottes mouth since day 1. Why not jump at the chance to erase that? Winning is the only thing that will keep the stands full anymore, but I guarantee that far fewer people will hate/not care about the Hornets.

Mustachio,

You had me all the way up until that sentence. I just can't pull for the Hornets. Can't do it.

[Woodsy23]

it's time for the blow up of all blows up. not like a grenade blow up like a blow up on the scale of a serious nuclear bomb blow up. So yeah blow up it is?

I'm not just in the blow up camp, i own the blow up camp, infact i own multiple blow up camps all aimed at blowing up this pile of shit called: 'The bobcats players and coach who deserve to be blown up (metaphorically speaking)'.

Gerald and Jax are first to go. no desire, no heart, no potential. start building for the future, gonna be a long few years though :/

[Toocool]

Most logical thing is to blow it up. I was optimistic for this season. I think MJ would be able to handle a rebuild. If we could go to the start of our games, where our guys tried their butts off, that would bring people. Sure back then we were crap and horrible, but we tried hard.

Several things MUST happen for this team:
1.) Fire LB. He brought part of this on himself, in which HE wasn't interested at all in coming back. IF your coach doesnt' have any heart, how do you expect the players to have any heart?
2.) Jack AND Crash must go. Simple as that. I hate saying it, since I love Wallace and love Cpt. Jack's swagger. They need to go to make room for Hendo and UPS to start.
3.) Diaw must go. Our first option on offense if we rebuild would most likely be Tyrus. Diaw would be taking up significant minutes, and we need TT to continue to develop.
4.) Keep an older vet. Nazzy is my choice. Nazzy is the old grizzled Warhorse, a great professional and he helps brings vet. leadership for the locker room.
5.) Play the young guys. We wont' be able to trade everyone off, Diop's contract etc. However shift them to the secondary unit and FOCUS on the youth that we have. The YOUTH that we have is talented, but LB isn't interested in playing them at all. Which is also why LB MUST go.

Those who know me, I wake up around 8 a.m to watch Bobcats games. I much rather wake up at 8 a.m and see a team trying its hardest than the crap that I saw tonight against the Grizzlies. Generally an optomistic person, but right now I'm pretty disillusioned with this team.

3 words. Blow It Up

[ND22]

Struggling with a young core of players is one thing, struggling with an old tired bunch like this is another. We're a poor man's version of the Celtics. I hate to say it, but its time to blow it up.

[TheDorkLord]

I agree it is time to blow it up. I may as well watch both the Panthers and the Bobcats rebuild at the same time. I'm glad that I watch most of the games off the DVR. It would be very hard to sit and watch this year's games live. It used to be my DVR was used more to back up and watch a good play or see if a call was correct. Now it is fast forwarding through some of the games. Someone said MJ shouldn't blow it all up at once and I think that is a good point on the financial side for MJ, but who knows that may be the way to get us where we want to be in the long run quicker.

[BobCatsFanInTx]

here is my take.
1. please don't suggest use the okc model. they had a set of very unique circumstances that got them to where they are now. the durant goof by portland, westbrook jackpot at #5, then 3rd overall the next year (which they missed on curry on that team would be pretty special), ibaka turning into something. if by model you mean try to build through the draft, keep below the cap, make trades to take on dead salary but acquiring picks/talent, then yes. but don't assume it will work the same. we have shown that drafting/multiple picks can certainly end up with busts.
2. the players have quit and should be criticized but LB should get the most blame. usually, when a coach quits on the team/loses the team it goes 1 of 2 ways: the players galvanize and play to spite the coach or lose interest and heart and go into eff it mode. our players have chosen the latter which probably speaks to losing felton's leadership and the fact that they know they will be blamed because the HOF coach couldn't possibly do a bad job. (despite the fact he built a running team and won't run)
3. we have to rebuild, but some of the suggestions as to who we get or keep are not very good. everyone should be moveable. none of our players now are franchise players so why pretend to build a franchise with them. if anyone of them can fetch a pick or salary relief we do it.
4. everyone wanting a rebuild needs be prepared for what that means. it means years not one year. it will be like starting all over again. be ready for very dark times over a few seasons. if you think it is bad now, just wait. most everyone here remembers getting excited for 25 win seasons and 15 game losing streaks.
5. in reality, does mj want to totally rebuild vs try (usually does not work) a rebuild on the fly. it is his money that is at stake, and contrary to popular belief he is in debt with this team. over $100 mil is on credit so it is a big deal to him that people actually show up to the games. that is not happening with a starting lineup of dj/vc/ups/scalabrini/nazr, so don't get too bent out of shape when/if we don't just start over.
6. there are many things to pray for in life (if that is your thing) and god can handle all requests, so after the big stuff it might help to ask for a little luck in the drafting dept because it is going to take some good lotto bounces and a franchise player like griffin, durant, etc on multiple years to turn this completely around.Excellent post Chef!! The difference with this team and those in the past that would win 25 games for the season and have 15 game losing streaks is that those teams had even less talent but they fought and played hard. They gave a shit. Even with the FHB biscuit it seems like we usually got more effort. These guys have no heart. This team reminds me of the Knicks when they were coached by the crotchety old asshole LB. Is it any wonder that the Knicks are just now climbing out of the hole poorly hired GM's and head coaches put them in? They are a very big market team and yet for many years they struggled mightily to return to respectability. How do you think our Bobcats will fare being a much smaller market? We have not had a great deal of success through the draft but if we fire Higgins and hire a real GM we can build that way. We can at least up our chances and in the mean time keep enough room under the cap to make a few substantial moves if needed. So far going the trade and FA route has not been what one would hope for. It really starts with getting a reputable GM and a fairly young head coach with a winning record in recent years.

[dav7z]

Put me in the camp of blowing it up. But i would like to do it with trades for young talent not just draft picks.
Mayo, Tabeet . For either one of our core players would bea nice start.
I would even take Rip to get Stuckey , for another core player. We just don't have to only do it for 1ST ROUND PICKS.

But no one should be untouchable... Just put out word we taking offers for ever one.

[Chef]

Put me in the camp of blowing it up. But i would like to do it with trades for young talent not just draft picks.
Mayo, Tabeet . For either one of our core players would bea nice start.
I would even take Rip to get Stuckey , for another core player. We just don't have to only do it for 1ST ROUND PICKS.

But no one should be untouchable... Just put out word we taking offers for ever one.

memphis doesn't need crash they have mayo and would probably want TT over any of our players. maybe a TT + nazr combo gets us those two. which is too much and mayo will be way overpaid with his next contract in 2 years. we have got to get out of the "one man's trash is another's treasure" mindset.

[JayTeeBeeTee]

Do not blow it up. Build on what we've got. Build around Tyrus, DJ, and Hendo. Keep Crash for a while longer. Jack has got to GTFO! He's killing us. I think Kwame sucks but some of you seem to think he's respectable. I'd rather try and hold on to Nazr for at least a little longer, he has been dominant recently. Larry Brown needs to GTFO too, he's old and his philosophies are killing this team. It's like he is trying to make winning harder on our players, the way he is rotating them. Maybe it's lack of talent, but I still see one or two pieces missing, SG and Center. And if we develop Hendo, then we've got one covered. I was down on Crash until the Raptors game, for those of you that missed it; he played 3 quarters of the game with a banged up ankle and it was reminiscent of GW of old. He's still got gas in the tank. Jack and Larry are the two biggest problems, yet I don't know of a more suitable coach.

[dav7z]

Do not blow it up. Build on what we've got. Build around Tyrus, DJ, and Hendo. Keep Crash for a while longer. Jack has got to GTFO! He's killing us. I think Kwame sucks but some of you seem to think he's respectable. I'd rather try and hold on to Nazr for at least a little longer, he has been dominant recently. Larry Brown needs to GTFO too, he's old and his philosophies are killing this team. It's like he is trying to make winning harder on our players, the way he is rotating them. Maybe it's lack of talent, but I still see one or two pieces missing, SG and Center. And if we develop Hendo, then we've got one covered. I was down on Crash until the Raptors game, for those of you that missed it; he played 3 quarters of the game with a banged up ankle and it was reminiscent of GW of old. He's still got gas in the tank. Jack and Larry are the two biggest problems, yet I don't know of a more suitable coach.

Wallace looked lots more like his self with out Jax . The two pieces you say we missing is what i what i wanted to add.
I don't know what it would take to get Tabeet and Mayo but i would be willing to give up any one on our current core.
On the right team Mayo is a all star , The long term scorer we need , Tabeet at 7.3 isn't far from getting it all toghter. He just needs playing time . Something he want get in Menphis. I would give up any one on the roster to land thease two guys.
Though it would be nice to keep TT just to have another core player long term. Add in a certin point from DUKE then we set to really build.

[adam187]

I'm all for blowing it up, but we do have a problem: we don't own our pick for 2012 (which would be one of the times we need it most if we blew it up). I know it's lottery protected, but every year that it doesn't get used, it becomes less protected. It's hard to re-build without your own pick. It would be nice to get that back.

[Chef]

I'm all for blowing it up, but we do have a problem: we don't own our pick for 2012 (which would be one of the times we need it most if we blew it up). I know it's lottery protected, but every year that it doesn't get used, it becomes less protected. It's hard to re-build without your own pick. It would be nice to get that back.

if we do a total rebuild we will have the pick for at least 2-3 maybe even 4 years. we don't have to worry about it right now.

[kickazzz2000]

Haha, I have a 20 month as well. I know how it is. All I can say is THANK GOD FOR DVR!

haha, my 19 month old starts screaming ball ball ball! when any sort of game is on and sits down with me.

[bing!]

The current situation is past the point where even the 'underdog' touch has vanished, and with it, any desire to pull for this team... I mean, for fuck's sake, I'm growing to like the T-Wolves more.

This horror is a twisted amalgam of null effort and broken will.

[Dcarnys]

I don't think membership would drop, but the tone around the site definitely would definitely change.

And for the record... Ziggy says blow it up

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w301/bobcatsplanet/nuclear-explosion.jpg
The funny part is I changed my desktop from the Bobcats schedule to that same picture two nights ago.

[Bobcat Matt]

We've had so many golden opportunities to build a solid core, but draft blunder after draft blunder have done us in. If you draft a bust, or an average player, in the lottery 6 times, you can't recover quickly. As several people have said, it takes YEARS to make up for those mistakes. Larry came in with the assumption Raymond couldn't play PG for him like he wanted, without even trying it 1st. So he bitched and moaned, got his way, and got MJ to take a 5'11 PG with no emotion/heart. He forced us to PASS on a franchise center in Lopez for a 5'11 PG! It's unreal. You ALWAYS go with a big man over an UNDERSIZED PG who was never guaranteed to be elite. No one thought he was the 2nd coming on CP3. The ONLY choice is to blow it up. Dump salary in any way, shape, or form. Hire a YOUNG coach with a great work ethic/attitude and go. If people don't show up for a few years, so be it. It's our only option. NO ONE on this roster should be safe.

[TheBeagle]

I can't remember what the general tone was, but I know I was one of the few pessimists coming into this season. I admittedly was still bitter about how pathetic the post-season peformance was (and really, looking back, that was the beginning of my loathing of the Bobcats players) and was disappointed they let Raymond walk without any plan to replace him with at least an equally talented player, if not better. It was cool in theory to let DJ have his turn, but at least have a productive back up, and Livingston just isn't it. Then we have a coach who asked to leave, but was told no; that's gotta make for a good working relationship, right? And then there's the infamous Whodafuck signing and couple that with the Ericka fiasco, and Kwame signing, and that was our off-season. Oh boy.

But I still held out hope that some of y'all were right and that we could have a successful season, and maybe I was letting the negative vibes of the post-season and off-season affect me too much. Maybe our players would rally around each other and get it done. And then came the Pacers home opener, and I saw the future. And it was ugly. I saw a team coasting and not really giving two shits. I saw no leadership and realized what Raymond meant to the team despite his shortcomings. Since I was already coming into the season on a downer, that Pacers game sorta took a piece of my soul away, or maybe, like SWedd posted, I've become a product of the players on the roster: why care when they dont?

Fast forward to the Raptors game on Tuesday after the Saturday debacle vs. Boston. I give no applause when the lineups are announced (something I've always done), and only clapped three times during the game: two hustle plays by the Raptors' in the first half, and the entire halftime. No applause the entire night for the Cats (did they deserve it?) and I left at the under 6 timeout in the 4th in a close game, without caring what the outcome was, and sort of secretly hoping the Cats lose if I'm perfectly honest. Like bing! posted, I'm looking at other teams now, thinking how much more likeable their players are, more easy to pull for, how harder they play (like the Raps on Tuesday), how much better the talent and or potential is. Hell, I was way more excited watching the Knicks/Celts game and I pretty much hate both those franchises. I won't go to the extreme that SWeed does and say fuck the whole team, but on the whole, I do despise most of our players, and as a fan, that is a fucking miserable feeling.

On subject, I'm all for destroying this roster, but it won't happen. I'd say the best we can hope for is a trade of some sort and a change in coaching. Like Larry says after each loss now, when it gets to the point you as a coach have to beg your players to hustle, it's over. I understand the finances involved, but I have to think the competitor in MJ will come out and he'll do something to change this. Get rid of Higgins? Cut a player? Allow Larry to leave?

We can all agree there is no quick fix to this mess, but a first step has to be taken, and I think the post-game scoldings of a couple hall of famers card has been overplayed and worth even less than the effort of the team.

Win. Lose. Whatever. Wake me when we have players who give a fuck.

************

To the GM folk who understand all that rigamarole: what are the rules on cutting a player (I'm think about Jack in particular)? If someone were to pick him up after cutting him, how much would the Cats have to pay him? The rest of his entire contract, or would the team that claimed him pay some of that too?

[polarcat]

Also with the lack of a 2012 pick, our 2011 pick becomes an even bigger need for a franchise player because we won't have an opportunity at one until 2013. If we are in re-build, we will start to suffer the fate that the Knicks did when they kept trading away 1st rounders and continued to suck. I'm not for tanking, but blow this isht up soon, and the closer to finishing in the bottom 3 of the league and hopefully the balls will bounce our way in the lottery. I at the same time don't want to trade strictly for draft picks considering our track record on draft night. A nice blend of young potential (like a player buried on the bench.... i.e. - Wallace when we nabbed him) and some draft picks. I love the OKC and PDX blueprint, but we need a competent scouting/drafting/front office to work the frontlines..... which I'm not too confident in.

[SWedd523]

I hold my stance on "Fuck Everyone" other than maybe Boris and Whodafuck (go figure). I just cannot force myself to pull for a team that obviously doesn't give a shit anymore. They don't even run back on D? Who does that? I get pissed off at my boys for not getting back on D...... in an INTRAMURAL game! And these MILLIONAIRES want me to continue to pay my HARD EARNED money to watch them loaf around?

No thanks.




As for your other question Beagle. We could buy Jack out, but we'd be on the hook for whatever money he agreed to take. For example, if he was on the hook for 10mil but agreed to leave if we pay him 2mil. That 2mil would be what we pay him, but our cap hit would still be 10mil.

[dnbman]

Also with the lack of a 2012 pick, our 2011 pick becomes an even bigger need for a franchise player because we won't have an opportunity at one until 2013. If we are in re-build, we will start to suffer the fate that the Knicks did when they kept trading away 1st rounders and continued to suck. I'm not for tanking, but blow this isht up soon, and the closer to finishing in the bottom 3 of the league and hopefully the balls will bounce our way in the lottery. I at the same time don't want to trade strictly for draft picks considering our track record on draft night. A nice blend of young potential (like a player buried on the bench.... i.e. - Wallace when we nabbed him) and some draft picks. I love the OKC and PDX blueprint, but we need a competent scouting/drafting/front office to work the frontlines..... which I'm not too confident in.

Scary thought: If a lockout is imminent, many college players might choose to stay in school another year, making this draft weaker than usual. I may be making that scenario up. I hope so.

[Chef]

Scary thought: If a lockout is imminent, many college players might choose to stay in school another year, making this draft weaker than usual. I may be making that scenario up. I hope so.

don't worry about it, we will have that pick.

[Absinthe]

This whole franchise is in trouble. Felton is playing fantastic in New York. Jason Richardson is playing fantastic for Phoenix. Okafor has been up and down for New Orleans, but he's played better for them than he ever did here. Tyrus Thomas is playing fantastic for Dallas. So why is it that players flourish when they leave this team? I get the feeling that a lot of players simply don't want to come to Charlotte. If I were an NBA player I'd be less than enthused about playing for the Bobcats. Charlotte is no Miami, New York, or Chicago. No one attends the games. Attendance is an embarrassment. Hell, I'd rather play in Denver and Minnesota even though those places are frigid just because they're better cities. As a result, this team cannot and will not get better via free agency. Who would want to willingly come here?

I think the Stephen Jackson trade was pretty stupid. He's always had an awful attitude and I think it has been contagious. I get the feeling there's a lot of bad blood between Crash and Jackson. As a result, it has effected both of their skills negatively on top of pissing off the rest of the team. DJ is not good enough. He wouldn't start on a vast majority of NBA teams because *gasp* he's a bench player, at best. I'd actually hold onto Diaw because he is an expiring contract and I don't think anyone is going to give them back anything of any real value in return.

People are saying don't blow it up, but teams aren't going to help Charlotte out. It's not going to happen. Apparently, the front office thinks that Wallace and Jackson are worth more than they actually are. Which tells me that they'll stay put and trot out a team that is just bad enough to miss the playoffs, but not bad enough to be a lottery team. Hurray for mediocrity. Or, maybe they'll come to their senses and just try to get as much cap space/salary, draft picks, and young players in return.

DJ = I have nothing against him as a person, but he's a bench player, at best. 90% of the teams in the NBA wouldn't think about trotting him out as their starting PG. Felton was a tremendous loss.

Stephen Jackson = a head case that is known for having a bad attitude and causing problems for teams. Thinks he is a much better player than he actually is and has likely pissed off his teammates. Greg Popovich passed on him in the off season even though he's been one of the few coaches that can keep him under control. Even he knows that it's not worth the hassle.

Crash = injury prone and seems like he has checked out. If he doesn't want to play here then someone can show him the door. If he really quit on this team like I think he has then he is a piece of shit prima donna.

Mohammed = old and wouldn't start on 90%+ of NBA teams.

Diaw = out of shape, soft, and Phoenix's leftovers of better days past. At least he is expiring, however.

Kwame Brown = lol I still can't believe he is even on this team

Gerald Henderson = who knows, he seems like another draft pick that was wasted, but he never plays

Larry Brown - obviously wants to be fired and doesn't want to be here. He let that be known loud and clear in the off season

Matt Carrol = terrible contract

Diop = terrible contract

That's our team, folks!

[Chef]

This whole franchise is in trouble. Felton is playing fantastic in New York. Jason Richardson is playing fantastic for Phoenix. Okafor has been up and down for New Orleans, but he's played better for them than he ever did here. Tyrus Thomas is playing fantastic for Dallas. So why is it that players flourish when they leave this team? I get the feeling that a lot of players simply don't want to come to Charlotte. If I were an NBA player I'd be less than enthused about playing for the Bobcats. Charlotte is no Miami, New York, or Chicago. No one attends the games. Attendance is an embarrassment. Hell, I'd rather play in Denver and Minnesota even though those places are frigid just because they're better cities. As a result, this team cannot and will not get better via free agency. Who would want to willingly come here?

I think the Stephen Jackson trade was pretty stupid. He's always had an awful attitude and I think it has been contagious. I get the feeling there's a lot of bad blood between Crash and Jackson. As a result, it has effected both of their skills negatively on top of pissing off the rest of the team. DJ is not good enough. He wouldn't start on a vast majority of NBA teams because *gasp* he's a bench player, at best. I'd actually hold onto Diaw because he is an expiring contract and I don't think anyone is going to give them back anything of any real value in return.

People are saying don't blow it up, but teams aren't going to help Charlotte out. It's not going to happen. Apparently, the front office thinks that Wallace and Jackson are worth more than they actually are. Which tells me that they'll stay put and trot out a team that is just bad enough to miss the playoffs, but not bad enough to be a lottery team. Hurray for mediocrity. Or, maybe they'll come to their senses and just try to get as much cap space/salary, draft picks, and young players in return.

DJ = I have nothing against him as a person, but he's a bench player, at best. 90% of the teams in the NBA wouldn't think about trotting him out as their starting PG. Felton was a tremendous loss.

Stephen Jackson = a head case that is known for having a bad attitude and causing problems for teams. Thinks he is a much better player than he actually is and has likely pissed off his teammates. Greg Popovich passed on him in the off season even though he's been one of the few coaches that can keep him under control. Even he knows that it's not worth the hassle.

Crash = injury prone and seems like he has checked out. If he doesn't want to play here then someone can show him the door. If he really quit on this team like I think he has then he is a piece of shit prima donna.

Mohammed = old and wouldn't start on 90%+ of NBA teams.

Diaw = out of shape, soft, and Phoenix's leftovers of better days past. At least he is expiring, however.

Kwame Brown = lol I still can't believe he is even on this team

Gerald Henderson = who knows, he seems like another draft pick that was wasted, but he never plays

Larry Brown - obviously wants to be fired and doesn't want to be here. He let that be known loud and clear in the off season

Matt Carrol = terrible contract

Diop = terrible contract

That's our team, folks!

boris has a player option for 9 mil next year. so, he has 2 years left. worse than that, we have diop for 2 more years where he is making 7.6 mil! how the hell did anyone let lb trade for him. good god.

[Absinthe]

boris has a player option for 9 mil next year. so, he has 2 years left. worse than that, we have diop for 2 more years where he is making 7.6 mil! how the hell did anyone let lb trade for him. good god.

They should just go ahead and trade Diaw then. I thought he was an expiring this year. And that Dampier trade looks increasingly more stupid considering they got back Carrol.

[dunnlx]

G Fore, that's funny as hell. He may not bring back a bag a rocks now, lol.


I remember when I said that we should trade Wallace for some late 1st round picks and everyone was all like "no way bro! you're crazy! g-force 4 life"

[Brad]

Just look at how this team was set up and mismanaged from the beginning by Bickerstaff. What they said they were going to do and what they did were two different things. Then Brown comes in and gets his guys in, and now he can't win with them so it's their fault. Meanwhile, any other coach looks at this roster and can't do anything with it.

It's a damn mess.

[JayTeeBeeTee]

Tyrus Thomas is playing fantastic for Dallas.

Tyrus Thomas is playing great for Charlotte.

Never mind, I see where you're going with that.

[BlockParty]

ESPN just updated their 'Future Power Rankings' which the first began last fall. Not shockingly we are still in 30th place out of the 30 NBA teams. Harshly realistic comments:


30. Charlotte Bobcats (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/clubhouse?team=cha) | Future Power Rating: 195


PLAYERS MANAGEMENT MONEY MARKET DRAFT
50 (29th) 31 (29th) 42 (30th) 23 (26th) 49 (16th)

A year ago, we ranked Charlotte dead last in these rankings despite the fact they were headed for the playoffs. Now you know why. With no money, no young talent and no sign that management has any cohesive plan for how to deal with these problems, the Bobcats have the most dismal future of any of the league's 30 teams.

Normally, a bad team gets a lift from the draft, but even that is a question mark since the 'Cats sent a future first-rounder to Chicago for Tyrus Thomas (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=3032). While Thomas has been one of their few bright spots, their only other good players are aging wings Stephen Jackson (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=378) and Gerald Wallace (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=1026). As a result, we rated Charlotte's players 29th of the 30 teams -- only Cleveland did worse.

Money-wise, they're also in terrible straits. The Bobcats have managed their cap horribly and have no space for the foreseeable future, plus they're strapped enough that they spent the offseason shedding assets such as Tyson Chandler (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=984) and Raymond Felton (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=2753). The next asset to go, one presumes, is head coach Larry Brown, given his track record of leaving for greener pastures. It won't be hard to find more verdant ones than this barren patch.
(Previous rank: 30)


Closest to the Cats in the rankings were Cleveland, Toronto, Minnesota and Phoenix. And who knew the strongest thing about our team was our Drafting position (16th) and our Market (in comparison to the rest of the NBA, we are ranked 26th in that catagory above).