The talk-shit about Stephen Jackson thread

[fuckjack]

7 for 24 shooting
1 for 11 on threes
5 turnovers
4 straight shots near the end of the fourth that were just complete silly attempts. lets just take more shots when you're ice cold!

boris diaw is on fire and we don't get the ball to him.

fuck
jack

[Chrystos]

I pray that this was his last game as a bobcat.

[ArcandiaS]

Did he not make Cat's win several times? I think he just had a bad night. Is it his fault if he took the last shot (it's a question..)? Is this not the coach?

[The Prodigy]

The fact that he shot 1-11 from 3 is ridiculous. How can you keep tossing them up there like that? Its one thing to have a poor FG%, but to do it over 24 shots is just unacceptable. He has to know his limitations and when he is not feeling it.

I would have no problem trading him. I am sure Henderson could have went 1-11 from downtown and 7-24 overall. Pathetic.

[GoBobs]

I don't know, Hendo was 1-8 that game so 7-24 might be a little optimistic. Between the chucking and the turnovers I have been ready to get rid of Jackson for a long time. I also won't miss his general attitude towards the refs and constant complaining although I must say he has been a little better lately. Still can't believe we wasted a triple double from Diaw and a monster double double from K Brown.

DJ wasn't much better either. I think moving Jack to the Bulls and then moving DJ to the Suns for Nash would be our best moves. Something like:

Jackson for Joe Johnson, Brewer and our pick back. DJ, Joe Johnson, Brewer, our 2012 pick we got back from the Bulls this time top three protected for Nash.

[Black]

Not to mention, zero free throw attempts which means he wan't attacking the basket at all. He just took ill advised jump shot after ill advised jump shot.

[ammofan]

I was 5-6 on threes in my bball game this weekend. No where near the competition jack has lol but at least I can knock down shots!

[Plowright]

unlucky ammo i was 6-7.

[Absinthe]

Jack is not a good number one option. He was always best as second fiddle. He's apparently been given the freedom to throw up bad shots by both Silas and Larry Brown. Either that, or he has a poor attitude and chucks up shots regardless of what the coaches say.

[ammofan]

unlucky ammo i was 6-7.

But your in the UK

[ND22]

He can score, but his shot selection is HORRIBLE. Taking contested shots one after the other gets you 7-24 and 1-11, and you'll never get a foul call when you try to initiate contact at the 3 point line. If I'm Michael Jordan I chew the shit out of him for taking those shots.

[Chef]

I don't know, Hendo was 1-8 that game so 7-24 might be a little optimistic. Between the chucking and the turnovers I have been ready to get rid of Jackson for a long time. I also won't miss his general attitude towards the refs and constant complaining although I must say he has been a little better lately. Still can't believe we wasted a triple double from Diaw and a monster double double from K Brown.

DJ wasn't much better either. I think moving Jack to the Bulls and then moving DJ to the Suns for Nash would be our best moves. Something like:

Jackson for Joe Johnson, Brewer and our pick back. DJ, Joe Johnson, Brewer, our 2012 pick we got back from the Bulls this time top three protected for Nash.

i think both bulls and suns gm's would hang up on you pretty quickly.

[fuckjack]

nope, jack has consistently been awful this season. while he has his good patches in games, the bad outweighs the good. i am tired of seeing him chuck up shot after shot, complaining to the refs, and his general play just irritates the living crap out of me. i doubt we could get much for him from any team.

[fuckjack]

Also, I would like to introduce myself here. I have been lurking this forum for at least a year now. I've consistently followed the bobcats for at least 2-3 years now.

[Bobcat Matt]

You definitely beat me to this thread, as I was going to make a similar post.

I can't stand him...He tries atleast twice a game to draw a foul on a pump fake 3. It's maybe worked once all year, if that. 1-11 from three? It never even crosses his mind to stop shooting them either. Add in 5 TO's and you've got the typical Jack game. We HAVE to get rid of him and I'm open to almost every suggestion. We aren't going anywhere anytime soon...GET RID OF HIM...i'd much rather sit through Hendo mistakes than watch him anymore...

[The Prodigy]

You definitely beat me to this thread, as I was going to make a similar post.

I can't stand him...He tries atleast twice a game to draw a foul on a pump fake 3. It's maybe worked once all year, if that. 1-11 from three? It never even crosses his mind to stop shooting them either. Add in 5 TO's and you've got the typical Jack game. We HAVE to get rid of him and I'm open to almost every suggestion. We aren't going anywhere anytime soon...GET RID OF HIM...i'd much rather sit through Hendo mistakes than watch him anymore...

Im with you. Trade him for literally any expiring and a draft pick and im happy. We just have for wait for him to actually have a decent game. The way he is playing, nobody is going to want him.

[Demon DeaCat]

You could take your pick about who to blame for the loss today. Jack was just one of several culprits. DJ, GW, Hendo and Jack all missed countless wide open shots. I think Silas even bears some accountability for sitting Boris the majority of the 3rd quarter while we were melting down. He was the only guy who was making shots. The offense ground to a halt when he wasn't in the game. We simply couldn't afford to have him on the bench as long as he was. Boris and Kwame were the only 2 guys that showed up to play today. Even at that, if DJ had bothered to guard the in-bounds play we still might have won. As frustrating as it was though, it's not fair to put it all on Jack. He had plenty of help.

It's really a shame that one of these two teams will probably end up making the playoffs. The Sixers are an atrocious team as are we.

[adam187]

Sometimes when I watch the games on my computer the crappy feed will give out and get pretty bad and I won't really be able to tell what's happening but the audio will still be going and I'll hear a grunt/scream thing and I'll know Jackson did that slow, awkward high dribble drive down the lane, tried to draw a foul, and just ended up throwing up a contested lay up that was nowhere close and then the feed will kick back in and there's capt jack jogging down the court with his head band all askance and he'll be showing that to the referee as the other team hits a wide open pull up 3.

even still, I enjoy having the guy on the team for some reason (I always believe he's one game away from putting it all together and realizing he should only shoot when he's open and can pass out of a double team and that winning is better than being the man) so I'm not that eager to trade him.

[TheBeagle]

Great thread. I can't pinpoint when I started to hate on him, but it was very early in the season, and it has not softened. Everybody has listed the myriad reasons why he is a detriment to the team (both financially and in terms of productivity) and really needs to be moved; I just wanted to add my heartfelt agreement that Jack needs to be moved. If he was the sort of guy he fancies himself to be, namely a shooter, a scorer, a clutch performer, he would not have made the rounds with as many teams as he has.

It's safe to say we wouldn't've made the playoffs without him last year, but that ship has sailed; he had a very solid season and hit some big shots, but that magic's gone. MJ is an idiot if he thinks keeping Jack on the roster makes the team any better than it is without him. If there are as many suitors for him as we've been led to believe, there's no reason not to make a move, be it a pick, youth, or even a salary dump. The team (emphasis on team) is better without him.

Irony is it is his game or lack thereof that has worn out his welcome here, not any off-court behavior issues, where he has been a true pro in fact. Oh well.....

[BRNC]

Jack (IMO) is very much like a player LB...great for a short period of time...I was all for him coming here but hoped we could deal him before the last draft or this summer...he'd be very good on a vet-player heavy team...the Mavs come to mind...but he's played his role here and it is really time he moved to another team...I'm just not for "giving him away"...as I said he has value and we really need value back or we remain stagnant as a team and franchise...

[BlockParty]

The local Subway Store Clerks have been shooting better than Jack lately. He did have a clutch shot late tonight and some Free Throws. Wierd with the Jekyl and Hyde thing, he gives us both every game.

[Deadshot]

This really shouldn't come as a surprise. If there's one area he's been consistent in throughout the duration of his career it's his bad attitude and poor shot selection. We all know Jack can shoot - and when he's on, he's on. But Stephen takes the "if you're cold just keep shooting" strategy to the extreme. Someone already mentioned it but I hate the fact that he constantly complains to the refs instead of getting back on defense. You don't see that kind of garbage from someone like Blake Griffin (who actually deserves more calls in my opinion).

Its easy to say, "Let's just trade him now," but you will be hard pressed to find a team that wants to take a risk on him without having to take back some garbage for your own roster. Look at Indiana for example - in order to get rid of Harrington and Jackson, they had to take on the atrocious monster contracts of Dunleavy and Murphy, a move that handicapped the franchise for at least 3 years. In fact, Dunleavy will come off the books this summer (we were lucky to get Collison for Murphy, but we had to take Posey's horrible contract in return...you see the chain reaction starting to take place now).

And as much as you dislike Jack, what kind of a scoring option will you have without him? I seriously doubt Wallace will pick up the slack. Kwame can't be relied on to continue his current pace. DJ is inconsistent. Henderson is still developing. You won't get anything back that will replace his scoring (and I am NOT defending the guy...I can't stand him and I find it ironic that I wound up following another one of his teams now).

[TheBeagle]

And as much as you dislike Jack, what kind of a scoring option will you have without him? I seriously doubt Wallace will pick up the slack. Kwame can't be relied on to continue his current pace. DJ is inconsistent. Henderson is still developing. You won't get anything back that will replace his scoring (and I am NOT defending the guy...I can't stand him and I find it ironic that I wound up following another one of his teams now). Yeah, this is the only real fallout of getting rid of him. But I believe that with him out of the lineup, the ball moves much better, doesn't die a slow death on one side of the court, and keeps the other 4 players engaged in the offense. In no way are Henderson and Matty better shooters or scorers than Jack, nor can they (for the most part) create their own shot if they suddently find themselves with the ball, guarded, with seconds left on the shot clock, but that's a side effect I'm willing to accept if it creates offensive flow and team ball.

Yeah, BP, the Jeckyl/Hyde thing that happens during games is infuriating. I mean he chucks js that clang of the rim and backboard, never trying to create anything else in the 1st 6 minutes, then when he finally drives, he dishes to Kwame for the open slam. It's like, 'why the hell didn't you try this 4-5 shots ago, Jack?' And then after more chucking and a bad pass that leads to a CHI fastbreak, he knocks down the turnaround j over Korver again like last week in the clutch; gets a big board; and knocks down both FTs after missing his first two earlier. Like many have said here, he's an ideal 3rd option or so on a vet-laden team, but he's just miscast here as option one.

[110oldeast]

This thread is really funny to me, because some folks laughed when I talked about Jack getting a free pass in the Orlando series as everyone was already brainwashed by the pre-emptive Diaw/Felton scapegoating Bonnell article and were in the "make love to pressure" honeymoon. Fans allowed his terrible play in each of the games we had a shot to win to fly under the radar. The stuff people are complaining about now is not new. It took place on the biggest stage last year and I will point it out again. Jack had ONE good game in the series, and it just happened to be the one where we were getting our ass kicked and he was running up and down the floor hitting shots when it didn't matter. What I have liked this year is that he has knocked down a couple of late fgs in games. For the record, I just think that he and Crash are not the best mixture of talent, especially in the halfcourt.

Again in the 3 COMPETITIVE (make love to pressure)games we had against Orlando last year, Jack's numbers were:

14-47 fg 29.7% fg

1-13 3pt fg 7.7 % 3pt fg

15 pts

3.3 TOs

For the series with the good game added in:

24/67 35.8% fg

3/18 16.7 3 pt %

18 pts

4.3 TOs

[Chef]

i have been wanting a jack trade since the start of this year. dallas will take him and we don't have to take back a crappy contract in return. wait for them to call.

[Deadshot]

Why would Dallas take him with Carlisle at the helm? They would probably rather pick up Stackhouse again lol...

[Reezy]

See my biggest problem with jack is that he's not attacking the rim as much. I don't mind the shooting, but he's forcing it instead of putting the ball on the floor. Just my 2 cents.

[Demon DeaCat]

We can talk trash about Jack all we want, but the inescapable truth is that we need him. We wouldn't have made the playoffs last year without him and we would quickly fall out of contention this year without him on the court. If he is traded, as many of you wish, it would likely be for pennies on the dollar. We would be transformed from a team with hopes of making the playoffs into the Cavs. I can't believe that's really what any of us wants. I'm not a complete Jack apologist. He frustrates me at times as well, but the good outweighs the bad by a pretty wide margin IMO. Even in his "bad" games he still usually finds ways to make big shots. Last night was a case in point.

I'm all for a trade if it makes sense, but to me, making sense requires us getting back decent talent and a draft pick, and I just don't see that happening. If the FO can pull that off I'd be happy to be wrong, but I don't see it.

[coldhardtruth2330]

The man has been in a slump, and all of you want to hate. Just dont forget he's the best offensive skilled player we have. I see everyone of you all over dj's nuts no matter how bad he plays or no matter how quick pg's blow by his ass every single night. Your all over wallace's nuts again, just cuz he had one good quarter. The simple fact is Jack and GW don't coincide well in a half court offense because they both like to hold the ball instead of swing the ball to the other side and make a play. Knowing the Bobcats trade history, he probably will get traded and we won't get shit in return, and he'll go to Dallas and help them win a championship.

[Adam42R]

I agree with cold, the guy is in a slump right now. But there is noone else on this team that we can count on to "try" win the game, "try" take the lead, "try" tie the game when time is of the essence. Jack might make a lot of bad shots but it's not because they are bad ideas - often, it's just not executed well (and I bet he'd tell you that). But hands down, when we need something crucial, not only is he able, he is most importantly willing and he understands a sense of urgency and that is heads above anyone else on this team (right now). I share the sentiments that he can be very frustrating at times but unless you can find a true "go-to" guy to replace him, he's invaluable.

At present, I wouldn't trade anyone on this team. Sure we might not have the penultimate roster but I think there are some real gems on this team and I am all for Paul Silas finding out how well to use them (plus, we don't exactly have assets that are attractive at their current price-points anyway). And I sure wouldn't trade someone because the fans are upset with him - to listen to most, they'd have traded Diaw last year and DJ would have never played a game this year and Kwame or Hendo ... I think folks need to loosen up and take in that we actually have a pretty good group of guys (albeit somewhat creatively put together) and stop wanting to trade a guy when he's not done something well for 4-5 games.

[Ghost Kat]

Capt. Jack may be our go to scorer but he also has more turnovers then anyone else. He leads the league in minutes ( complaining to the refs ). Jacksons turnovers are stupid and he shouldn't be our #1 option. I hate the Jackson high post run players off down low screens play. Jack will either fire a bullet ( common Jack behavior ) or fire up a brick. Or he drives into the lane and Tarzan yells. I want to rip out my eyelashes for saying it but Diaw... yes.. Diaw needs to stay....Jackson needs to go.

Capt. Jack is a good player, good leader type. Good guy to have on this team. But Jacksom doesn'y really play D. He's a older SF guarding mostly younger SG's. We get the most out of him at SF with Henderson at SG. This is not a slump. Jackson has made bad choices with the ball all year. His poor shot selection is nothing new. His wasteful TO's.... nothing new. Last few games he's been off, bad , reall bad. But did his FT attempts go up? Nope. He didn't try to get into the lane he just kept throwing up shots. He's missed open shots, contested shots, buzzer beaters, FT's, lay ups, shots in the paint, fade aways. Any shot known to man kind he missed over the last few games. He deserves a thread of hate.

[TheBeagle]

I agree with cold, the guy is in a slump right now. But there is noone else on this team that we can count on to "try" win the game, "try" take the lead, "try" tie the game when time is of the essence. Jack might make a lot of bad shots but it's not because they are bad ideas - often, it's just not executed well (and I bet he'd tell you that). But hands down, when we need something crucial, not only is he able, he is most importantly willing and he understands a sense of urgency and that is heads above anyone else on this team (right now). I share the sentiments that he can be very frustrating at times but unless you can find a true "go-to" guy to replace him, he's invaluable.
Mind you, I'm not a Star Wars geek. In fact, I think it's maybe the most overrated multimedia franchise ever, but I've always love Yoda's line "Do or do not; there is no try" (or something to that effect). Jack may "try"; but he rarely does, and his trying destroys offensive flow.

Also, it's one thing to be in a slump, but even at his best he's not a consistent enough shooter that he should solely rely on that. As an oversized 2, his ass should be posting up small 2s, guys he has mismatched (like last when Korver was on him....and he succeeded!), drawing double teams, kicking it out to the open man, or rotating the ball...basically play more like he did last year when he did actually post up more often. I'd love to see the ratio of shots taken from perimeter to shots from post and also successful possessions from his shots from perimeter vs. his having the ball in the post. If some of you think Jack has played well this season except for this recent shooting slump, so be it, but I think there has been a noticeable change in his game since opening night in Dallas.

I guess the point I'm making is I've been upset with Jack's game all year, and it's not because of a shooting slump. That's just part of the game. It's his shot selection, reckless ball handling, poor, high risk passes, and generally forcing things by himself the majority of games that has me upset. And the inability or refusal to change any of these bad habits through the course of half a season. Just because he's the "closeset thing" we have to a go-to scorer, doesn't make him a go-to scorer....it makes it even more imperative to play as a team, which he's struggled with this season.

[Ghost Kat]

Mind you, I'm not a Star Wars geek. In fact, I think it's maybe the most overrated multimedia franchise ever.

Blasphemy!!!!

[coldhardtruth2330]

Well you may not like him as the go to guy, but Paul Silas obviously trusts him more than anyone else on the team. The last game against Chicago, Jack had a bad game was off all night. Still with less than a minute and the game tied, Silas goes to Jack and he converts on a turn around jumper and then hits two crucial FT's down the stretch.

[DY_nasty]

Well you may not like him as the go to guy, but Paul Silas obviously trusts him more than anyone else on the team. The last game against Chicago, Jack had a bad game was off all night. Still with less than a minute and the game tied, Silas goes to Jack and he converts on a turn around jumper and then hits two crucial FT's down the stretch.
A lot of games that Jack 'saves' for us are funny. Most of the time, we wouldn't be in those wholes in the first place if he wasn't 1-8 and still gunnin.

Dude needs to stop trying to draw Wade fouls with his slow ass release too...

[davcbow]

Well you may not like him as the go to guy, but Paul Silas obviously trusts him more than anyone else on the team. The last game against Chicago, Jack had a bad game was off all night. Still with less than a minute and the game tied, Silas goes to Jack and he converts on a turn around jumper and then hits two crucial FT's down the stretch.

Jax has had alot more than 1 bad game in a row... Just take a look at his stats for the last 10 games.... :)

[TheBeagle]

This'll be last last ragging on Jack here publically; y'all know by now how I feel about him, and that isn't likely to change (if it does, I'll make sure to let it be known). The best ball movement of the entire game occurred late in the 1st qtr and after the under 3 timeout of the 3rd qtr, both of which Jack was on the bench. And that's entirely objective. If anybody DVRed this game, go back and watch. And how many fastbreaks did he ruin tonight by stopping at the 3 pt line when he had an easy lane to the basket for DJ to feed him for a layup? And then when he gets the ball, he pump fakes, which nobody goes for because they figure he'll miss anyway, so what's the point? All which gives the defense time to get back upcourt and defend halfcourt.

Also, the ball did not find Jack's hands at the end, in the clutch, and we did just fine with Gerald and DJ.

Return to last year's form, or get the fuck outta here, man; we're winning despite you now, not because of.

That is all.

[coldhardtruth2330]

Your wrong Beagle, the ball did touch his hands in the clutch. With about 2 minutes left, down by one I think, Jack hits a shot. The play before Henderson hit his 3 jumpers...It was a huge bucket, I'd say it was pretty clutch. If your going to hate on anyone, Wallace played worse than Jack.

This'll be last last ragging on Jack here publically; y'all know by now how I feel about him, and that isn't likely to change (if it does, I'll make sure to let it be known). The best ball movement of the entire game occurred late in the 1st qtr and after the under 3 timeout of the 3rd qtr, both of which Jack was on the bench. And that's entirely objective. If anybody DVRed this game, go back and watch. And how many fastbreaks did he ruin tonight by stopping at the 3 pt line when he had an easy lane to the basket for DJ to feed him for a layup? And then when he gets the ball, he pump fakes, which nobody goes for because they figure he'll miss anyway, so what's the point? All which gives the defense time to get back upcourt and defend halfcourt.

Also, the ball did not find Jack's hands at the end, in the clutch, and we did just fine with Gerald and DJ.

Return to last year's form, or get the fuck outta here, man; we're winning despite you now, not because of.

That is all.

[DY_nasty]

Your wrong Beagle, the ball did touch his hands in the clutch. With about 2 minutes left, down by one I think, Jack hits a shot. The play before Henderson hit his 3 jumpers...It was a huge bucket, I'd say it was pretty clutch. If your going to hate on anyone, Wallace played worse than Jack.
Jackson was 1 for 5 in the 4th...

[TheBeagle]

Your wrong Beagle, the ball did touch his hands in the clutch. With about 2 minutes left, down by one I think, Jack hits a shot. The play before Henderson hit his 3 jumpers...It was a huge bucket, I'd say it was pretty clutch. If your going to hate on anyone, Wallace played worse than Jack. You're right. It was that off balance, BACK TO THE BASKET, flip in. I emphasize "back to the basket" because once again, when he does post and/or back his man down good things tend to happen, or at least more good things than a perimeter chuck.

Once again, good call, coldhard; I admit I was wrong on that particular point about the ball NEVER touching his hands near the end. +1

[Bobcat Matt]

I hate Jack! God he sucks...another 3-14, bitch at the refs night...get him out of here!!!!

[Black]

So sick of him. No point in elaborating.

[CatNation]

Henderson is making him look extremely expendable right now. His passes make me want to throw up. Don't even need to bring up the shooting.

[ammofan]

Henderson is making him look extremely expendable right now. His passes make me want to throw up. Don't even need to bring up the shooting.

Henderson makes GW look expendable too.....One has to go

[Ghost Kat]

Henderson makes GW look expendable too.....One has to go

That means Jackson needs to go....And Boris Diaw too

[davcbow]

Why not just trade everybody? we can be an expansion team again.. 8)

[ammofan]

Why not just trade everybody? we can be an expansion team again.. 8)

HELL to the no!

[GoBobs]

Jackson leads the team in turnovers. He takes by far the most shots and has the worst fg% of the rotation players. I vote him gtfo.