The 2010-2011 Trade Discussion Thread (part IV)

[teej]

Please post ALL trade related posts in this thread.

If you link to a trade proposal, please list the ingoing and outgoing parts for each team - not everyone can click the links.

If you started a thread about a trade and cannot find it, it was moved here.

[Chef]

the 3 parter posted on the page:

no way memphis does mayo and thabeet for nazr, carroll and whoever else was in it. mayo is going to cost at least an expiring and a #1 pick that is projected at or near the lottery

[CrazyCarl139]

Yeah, I can agree with you Chef. Our only hope would be that they'd be desperate to dump him. Maybe we could deal with Dallas, then trade Butler's expiring deal. Also, Nazr has an expiring deal they'd be getting. Really, I'd be willing to give them anyone or I'd be willing to throw in a 1st round pick if it meant getting Mayo.

[Boomer]

I can't see Memphis giving up Mayo/Thabeet for Nazr, Carroll, etc.

[ohara831]

Just a thought. All the rumors from last season and earlier this season about Crash being traded. I have a feeling that our FO knows something that we dont know. Crash has not been the same player since just before the All Star break last year. He was playing like an All Star, and then just like that he started to go downhill. Now all the rumors about bickering and disharmony in the locker room. Crash is playing like a shell of himself. Last night we really needed him in that 76er game, and he shoots only 7 times? And we went to OT to boot.

If you compare his trade value at the All Star break to right now, we have lost a ton of leverage. There is no way to feel good about where we stand right now. Do we trade now and get the best we can get? Do we hold him and hope to heck he gets back to his old self and keep him? Do we hold him and hope he steps his game up a bit to increase his value and then trade him ASAP? All 3 options have a certain amount of risk to them which can totally backfire.

[Chef]

Just a thought. All the rumors from last season and earlier this season about Crash being traded. I have a feeling that our FO knows something that we dont know. Crash has not been the same player since just before the All Star break last year. He was playing like an All Star, and then just like that he started to go downhill. Now all the rumors about bickering and disharmony in the locker room. Crash is playing like a shell of himself. Last night we really needed him in that 76er game, and he shoots only 7 times? And we went to OT to boot.

If you compare his trade value at the All Star break to right now, we have lost a ton of leverage. There is no way to feel good about where we stand right now. Do we trade now and get the best we can get? Do we hold him and hope to heck he gets back to his old self and keep him? Do we hold him and hope he steps his game up a bit to increase his value and then trade him ASAP? All 3 options have a certain amount of risk to them which can totally backfire.

to be fair about yesterday's game. boris was hot and deserved the green light. jax chucked up 24 shots despite missing the ocean. there just weren't alot of shots for crash to take and he isn't the "give me the damn ball" type of player. he was 6 of 7. yes he isn't as aggressive on the boards as he was last year but his play is about the same. even last year, he was one of the league leaders in getting his shot blocked, he was still "crashing" to the rim and ending up on the floor. his game hasn't changed all that much. he just gets less looks and has to force more shots with jax on the team.

i say trade both jax and crash. no surprise coming from me. i have a trade idea that most everyone here will hate, i am sure of it.

out:
crash, jax
in:
deng, bogans, scal, james johnson, our pick back and the bulls pick this year

why: as you said crash's value is a little low but he is still a good player. at this point, i am not sure about his value over the next two years. i believe deng is slightly overpaid but is a big upgrade (for our team) over crash now that thomas and kwame are getting the rebounds gerald used to get. deng can guard just as well if not better than crash as he isn't as prone to getting out of position gambling on steals. i think i would rather pay deng the extra year and a little more but save on jax's contract. we buy out scal immediately and trade bogans next year as an expiring. we get back our draft pick in 2012 which is going to be a strong draft class and we get an extra pick this year, albeit a low first. if the draft chips fall well, it could allow us to do the next to impossible and rebuild on the fly without the 5 or 6 down years.

why for chicago: get the sg in jax but save long term with deng being gone. they also get very close production trade off with crash. with rose and boozer being first and first options, jax won't hurt them like he hurts us. crash is also a better trade chip for them down the road then deng so giving up the two picks is justified.

why we wouldn't do it: deng is a risk and an expensive contract. is this the value we want out of crash? and finally, dallas calls us this week desperate and offers butler, jones and a pick for jax and ups.

[spectre]

Crash is averaging almost exactly the same amount of shots this year as last year (12.6 per game). 7 is a little low, but as Chef said Boris deserved the shots. He usually average 10 per game but had 14 attempts last night.

Jax usually averages 16 shots per game but took 24 last night. DJ averages 11 but took 16.

I still don't believe Crash has suddenly become an old man in just a few months. IMO we have DJ deferring to Jax almost exclusively at the end of games (probably cuz Jax demands it), so Crash is kind of being left out in the cold.

With him just coming off all star status last year you'd think we'd make an effort to have him more involved. Instead...we'll most likely trade him for crap and he'll get right back to form. Pretty much happens after every one of our trades.

Not to crazy about Deng's contract and how much he's been injured. I also question his desire to keep it rolling every minute game in and game out. He's still young and he's been playing very well lately so maybe he's getting there. Big risk tho.

[CrazyCarl139]

I like that deal with Chicago. It would save us a ton of money (which I personally don't care about, but you know the FO does) and it gets us two 1st round picks. Deng can be "the man" if he's put in the right situation. Charlotte might be it for him. Also, you get the up side of James Johnson. He might turn into something.

IF Dalllas offers Butler, Jones and a pick for Jax, we have to, have to do that. Jones is an offensive guy big time (leading the Big East in scoring last year). I'd like to see him and Augustin in the backcourt together.

[Marvel]

I don't think it's Wallace's averages or percentages that makes him look like he's fallen off a cliff, from last years form. It's that intensity, energy, hustle that he's lost which made him.

[ohara831]

I don't think it's Wallace's averages or percentages that makes him look like he's fallen off a cliff, from last years form. It's that intensity, energy, hustle that he's lost which made him.

That is just what I think also. He just does not seem to have the motor running. And I cannot help but wonder if the injuries, especially the concussions, are starting to take their toll on his game in a big way. I hope I am wrong and Specte is right that it may be just a byproduct of our system and who is running the show and who is most agressive for the shots. I just dont know at this point.

[Marvel]

That is just what I think also. He just does not seem to have the motor running. And I cannot help but wonder if the injuries, especially the concussions, are starting to take their toll on his game in a big way. I hope I am wrong and Specte is right that it may be just a byproduct of our system and who is running the show and who is most agressive for the shots. I just dont know at this point.

I hope Wallace gets his Crash form/mojo back too, should be definitive over the next 2-3 games.

[TheBeagle]

Unless we get something unreal, or he has to be included in a package to net something unreal, I'm in favor of keeping GW here. The general fan that comes to games still loves him; he's not a real detriment to the team (man defense is getting there however, I mean, who can't blow by him anymore?); and while lacking in leadership, I think he's still a good teammate.

I'm in the camp that his best days are behind him and that the "crashes" are finally taking their toll. Why else would Larry suddenly encourage GW, and routinely call for the curl jumper? To preserve his playing days, or at least his productive playing days, as they are numbered. He's still our best option at 3, and barring something miraculous, will be for another year or two.

As for the CHI trade Chef puts forth: I'd rather just send Jack for our pick back and whatever else salary that'll even it out. Jack can't get out of here quick enough for me, and we really really need that pick back as it's most likely cemented in the lottery.

[BlockParty]

After GW's tech he seemed to have a fire in him I haven't seen in 12 months. I hope it continues and there is no swelling in that ankle (or suspension from the NBA).

Let's keep GW

[Absinthe]

Part of the reason Wallace has fallen off is because of the arrival of Stephen Jackson. He's a player that has worn out his welcome everywhere he's every played. He's going to get his shots (1 out of 11 for three) and fuck everyone else. Captain Jackass is really grinding on me. Gerald Wallace is injury prone. So I'm torn. You have Stephen Jackson who is a chucker, has attitude problems, has a pretty bad contract, and is older. Then you have Wallace who is injury prone, has a declining value as a trade piece, and is probably one concussion away from an early retirement. This is what happens when your front office trades for a player that makes your best player redundant.

[anton273]

i know theres been a bit of speculation about jackson for mayo and thabeet...

would you take that deal? i dunno if contracts work, maybe throw in a filler..

or if memphis dont want to trade young for old...and are interested in expiring contracts so they can keep marc n zach next year, would you like nazr,mcguire and livingston or carroll or collins depending on contract values for mayo and thabeet?

Would love to see mayo with dj altho its a pretty small backcourt!

OT. Anyone know a good 3 point coach? 0-13 was terrible against bulls!

[Plowright]

Dell Curry the bobcats tv analyst isnt a bad one!

Think Jack needs his number :/ hes been chucking up 3's from all over the place, 1/11 the other night mean come on!

that deal you propose doesnt work with carroll in it. Also i wouldnt wanna give up our only back up pg who has NBA experience . Jack is also one of the few players who can create a shot on this team, even if he does miss them most the time...

[Chef]

i know theres been a bit of speculation about jackson for mayo and thabeet...

would you take that deal? i dunno if contracts work, maybe throw in a filler..

or if memphis dont want to trade young for old...and are interested in expiring contracts so they can keep marc n zach next year, would you like nazr,mcguire and livingston or carroll or collins depending on contract values for mayo and thabeet?

Would love to see mayo with dj altho its a pretty small backcourt!

OT. Anyone know a good 3 point coach? 0-13 was terrible against bulls!

the only speculation is from bobcats fans, memphis has no interest in a mayo/thabeet for jackson deal.

[anton273]

I just want someone new to come in bringing a little excitement to the table. i hope they draft well this year if no trades happen!

Jax out fo sure...

[murphman]

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/01/19/troy-murphy-requests-trade-from-nets-given-leave-from-team/

NJ is in need of a G-F combo more than any other team out there so Jax out and Troy in. However the numbers will not work so out about: Jax/Najera for Troy/Stephen Graham? Although they come out way ahead talent wise they are also eating up cap space for two more years so we may need to throw in a 2nd round pick to sweeten it.

It would put is in a great financial situation for the next free agency period and to help MJ get through any potential missed season because of a lockout.

Unfortunatley it is a potential to eliminate us from playoff hopes this year but that is not for sure. Jax hurts us almost as much has he helps.

[davcbow]

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/01/19/troy-murphy-requests-trade-from-nets-given-leave-from-team/

NJ is in need of a G-F combo more than any other team out there so Jax out and Troy in. However the numbers will not work so out about: Jax/Najera for Troy/Stephen Graham? Although they come out way ahead talent wise they are also eating up cap space for two more years so we may need to throw in a 2nd round pick to sweeten it.

It would put is in a great financial situation for the next free agency period and to help MJ get through any potential missed season because of a lockout.

Unfortunatley it is a potential to eliminate us from playoff hopes this year but that is not for sure. Jax hurts us almost as much has he helps.

We need to be very careful for what we wish for concerning Jax in a trade... we should get someone with the same value or better... Its time for the Bobcats to get the better end of the trade... :)

[Demon DeaCat]

Amen to that Dav. If we were to execute that trade we would be cemented in the basement of the eastern conference for the next 2 years at least. Even if we have cap space, what FA is going to sign up for that? I'm still baffled by the thought that getting rid of Jack at all costs is somehow going to make us better.

[anton273]

I guess we are all praying for some amazing trade where we come out on top! In reality this wont happen.

Personally i dont mind IF we make it to playoffs again this year with no new changes it makes us more attractive being a playoff team 2 years running for off season. Then when we do come to make trades our players may have a better trade value. Yes we do need to make changes so we can guarentee playoffs every year and breaking into the top 5/6 teams in the eastern conference will take time.

Hopefully MJ wont try too hard to get a great deal but just make a good deal and we draft an amazing C buts thats unlikely looking at the draft!

[ALuhrs704]

after hearing geralds comments after the bulls game about how he got "pissed off" after the tech, it makes me think that he still has this all star in him. now the fact that he hasnt played like that at all this season makes me dissapointed in gerald and idk if the trade rumors are a part of it. gerald is open ALOT and calls for it when he is and is often overlooked. i think that if we do trade, it should be jax and i think gerald will be back to normal. i know he isnt good at creating his own shot but i just wanna see wallace get the ball once at the end of a game where we need the last shot. we NEVER give it to him in that. or boris for that matter. its always jack, and he always makes a bad shot decision....... plus gerald doesnt quit. ive seen jack quit a few times this season. and thats a horrible thing. however trading jack may kiss our playoff hopes goodbye bcuz it will be a salary dump.

[teej]

According to Cranston on Twitter today, the rumored Cleveland deal was not as reported, and we would've had the first come our way...stop believing everything you read, guys.

[Chef]

According to Cranston on Twitter today, the rumored Cleveland deal was not as reported, and we would've had the first come our way...stop believing everything you read, guys.

many of us were writing we didn't buy it while it was a hot topic

[WAM9]

many of us were writing we didn't buy it while it was a hot topic

What I just love is the incorrect rumor turning into a quotable truth.

Just wait, in a month from now, some folks (and you know who you are) will be quoting this trade as another mistake MJ "almost" made even though in reality, it wasn't as reported.

[CatNation]

I'll trade Cleveland whatever they want for their pick this year unprotected. Kyrie....:wootjump:

Knowing us we'd get stuck with Harrison Bust though :(

[dnbman]

According to Cranston on Twitter today, the rumored Cleveland deal was not as reported, and we would've had the first come our way...stop believing everything you read, guys.

The nature of all of these posts is speculating on the rumors. If a legitimate source says Cleveland's looking for a pick to be thrown in, that's a reasonable thing to wonder about, especially since it would suggest Wallace is seen as damaged goods around the league.

There's a difference between believing and wondering about a rumor.

[ammofan]

If CLE would deal us this years #1 for Gerald.....buh bye Gerald!

[Dcarnys]

If CLE would deal us this years #1 for Gerald.....buh bye Gerald!

Don't know why they would do that. Former all-star who hasn't live up to expectations for a High lottery pick.

Although I would take it in a heartbeat.

[Boomer]

no way Cleveland does that

[ammofan]

Don't know why they would do that. Former all-star who hasn't live up to expectations for a High lottery pick.

Although I would take it in a heartbeat.

I dont knowif they would either....But I would take money and Jarod Sullinger for Gerald

[Plowright]

Jason Thompson he replaces TT for now and starts centre when he is back, make it happen!

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4fh452y

I think maybe we send a pick to sacremento aswell for this maybe a 2nd rounder or 2. Im not sure what u think? I am fully aware this may get shot down

[Chef]

Jason Thompson he replaces TT for now and starts centre when he is back, make it happen!

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4fh452y

I think maybe we send a pick to sacremento aswell for this maybe a 2nd rounder or 2. Im not sure what u think? I am fully aware this may get shot down

not sure how houston feels about casspi but if they like him, i think it would work. would definitely have to send a couple of 2nds to sac because saving money isn't high for them. if we were willing to take on beno and send out nazr they would do it in a heartbeat with just us, just don't think we'd do it. in fact, i want no where near that deal.

i would do a livingston and 2nd for thompson and find a d-league pg to be dj's back up. sac can pawn beno off if the want to in a landry or casspi deal later.

[Plowright]

i am not trusting a borderline playoff team with an undrafted rookie and a d league back up to DJ, just no way

[Pepperz]

What does everybody think about this trade?

Bobcats
In: Caron Butler, A. Randolph
Out: S. Jackson, D. Brown, D. McGuire

Mavs
In: S. Jackson
Out: Caron Butler, 1st round

Knicks
In: D. Brown, D. McGuire, 1st round
Out: A. Randolph

Bobcats do it because they are able to shed cap with Butler coming off the books at the end of the year and they are able to get a young player with a lot of potential who can fill in for the injured T2 for the next 2 months.

Mavs do it because without Butler there chances are slimmer at winning the title and with the team they got now, their window of winning is getting smaller with each passing year.

Knicks do it because they get 2 players that will come off the books if they find no value in either player plus they get that 1st round pick they always wanted for Randolph.

[spankymoore7]

Like the above trade a lot for us, though might be hard to score. But I would pull it in a second

Another one I thought of if New Jersey is out of the Melo race

Wallace for Troy Murphy and a first round pick

Gives us another 4 whos contract expires after this season. Lets us start Hendo and move Jack to the 3, where he is better in my opinion. NJ has a ton of picks over the next couple of years so think we could get one. Gives NJ a core of Harris, Wallace, Favors and Lopez with a high lottery pick coming their way

[ammofan]

What does everybody think about this trade?

Bobcats
In: Caron Butler, A. Randolph
Out: S. Jackson, D. Brown, D. McGuire

Mavs
In: S. Jackson
Out: Caron Butler, 1st round

Knicks
In: D. Brown, D. McGuire, 1st round
Out: A. Randolph

Bobcats do it because they are able to shed cap with Butler coming off the books at the end of the year and they are able to get a young player with a lot of potential who can fill in for the injured T2 for the next 2 months.

Mavs do it because without Butler there chances are slimmer at winning the title and with the team they got now, their window of winning is getting smaller with each passing year.

Knicks do it because they get 2 players that will come off the books if they find no value in either player plus they get that 1st round pick they always wanted for Randolph.



NO....why deal our best player for nothing? Thats just like the Wallace for the TPE trade...NO

[Chef]

NO....why deal our best player for nothing? Thats just like the Wallace for the TPE trade...NO

except i (and alot of others on here) value wallace much higher than jax. he is our best scorer (hard to argue), but he hurts this team alot more than he helps it.

[Chef]

Like the above trade a lot for us, though might be hard to score. But I would pull it in a second

Another one I thought of if New Jersey is out of the Melo race

Wallace for Troy Murphy and a first round pick

Gives us another 4 whos contract expires after this season. Lets us start Hendo and move Jack to the 3, where he is better in my opinion. NJ has a ton of picks over the next couple of years so think we could get one. Gives NJ a core of Harris, Wallace, Favors and Lopez with a high lottery pick coming their way

ditto to this post. i would probably want one first this year and one of their crappy firsts in 2012 to make up for the chi pick though.

[Pepperz]

NO....why deal our best player for nothing? Thats just like the Wallace for the TPE trade...NO

We are not trading DJ away, LOL. Why do you consider Jackson our best player when he plays so terrible? He shoots such a low percentage and turns the ball over way to much to be considered "our best player". I see Jackson is on his downside of his years. Either we trade him now and or wait till his last year of his contract but we have to sell high. We are not going to get better talent in any trade for him so lets trade him for either draft picks or young talent with a lot of upside and Randolph has A LOT of upside to him. I just choose the ladder of the two since we seem to do a tad bit better at trading for talent more so then drafting talent.

[Boomer]

We are not trading DJ away, LOL. Why do you consider Jackson our best player when he plays so terrible? He shoots such a low percentage and turns the ball over way to much to be considered "our best player". I see Jackson is on his downside of his years. Either we trade him now and or wait till his last year of his contract but we have to sell high. We are not going to get better talent in any trade for him so lets trade him for either draft picks or young talent with a lot of upside and Randolph has A LOT of upside to him. I just choose the ladder of the two since we seem to do a tad bit better at trading for talent more so then drafting talent.

I agree we need to sell high on Jackson, I'd liek to be able to get Mayo for him but I doubt that happens. However, Randolph DOES have a lot of potential and maybe he can turn into that young All-Star that we need or maybe not BUT we have to at least try because there's always going to be risk involved and no All-Star free agent is coming here.

[ammofan]

I would do this: http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=47wlflc

CHA IN: Eddy Curry, Roger Mason, Anthony Randolph, Kelenna Azubuike
CHA OUT: Gerald Wallace, Nazr Mohammed, Derrick Brown

Why for us? Gerald isnt the same anymore. We not only dump salary with this deal but we get a good young player in Anthony Randolph who can play both the 4 and 3. Azubuike can knock down threes and play up tempo if he's healthy and we really need another solid three point shooter. Roger Mason is another good back up point/shooting guard. Again, he's a thre point shooter and vet who could really help out. Lastly there is Eddy Curry. IF HEALTHY...and thats a BIG BIG IF....he can play pretty well. I dont think he is actually hurt, I think it is more of a D'Antoni thing. He could realistically start here IF HEALTHY.

Why for NYK? They may not want to dump all of there young talent for Melo...instead they can still acquire an All Star in Gerald Wallace by giving the cats players who dont play in their rotation anyway. Derrick Brown may flourish in there system(Not really sure),or he could get buried on the bench. He is a good young player tho. Nazr would help them at the C position and he is a 6.5 million dollar expiring contract.


Bobcats Lineup after trade:

PG: DJ/Livingston/Mason/Collins
SG: Henderson/Azubuike/Carroll
SF: Jack/Dom
PF: Diaw/Randolph/Tyrus and Najera(Out)
C: Kwame/Curry/Diop(OUT)

[ammofan]

I would do this: http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=47wlflc

CHA IN: Eddy Curry, Roger Mason, Anthony Randolph, Kelenna Azubuike
CHA OUT: Gerald Wallace, Nazr Mohammed, Derrick Brown

Why for us? Gerald isnt the same anymore. We not only dump salary with this deal but we get a good young player in Anthony Randolph who can play both the 4 and 3. Azubuike can knock down threes and play up tempo if he's healthy and we really need another solid three point shooter. Roger Mason is another good back up point/shooting guard. Again, he's a thre point shooter and vet who could really help out. Lastly there is Eddy Curry. IF HEALTHY...and thats a BIG BIG IF....he can play pretty well. I dont think he is actually hurt, I think it is more of a D'Antoni thing. He could realistically start here IF HEALTHY.

Why for NYK? They may not want to dump all of there young talent for Melo...instead they can still acquire an All Star in Gerald Wallace by giving the cats players who dont play in their rotation anyway. Derrick Brown may flourish in there system(Not really sure),or he could get buried on the bench. He is a good young player tho. Nazr would help them at the C position and he is a 6.5 million dollar expiring contract.


Bobcats Lineup after trade:

PG: DJ/Livingston/Mason/Collins
SG: Henderson/Azubuike/Carroll
SF: Jack/Dom
PF: Diaw/Randolph/Tyrus and Najera(Out)
C: Kwame/Curry/Diop(OUT)

EDIT: Jack could be moved after this for maybe OJ? :D

[Fred Williamson]

I would do this: http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=47wlflc

CHA IN: Eddy Curry, Roger Mason, Anthony Randolph, Kelenna Azubuike
CHA OUT: Gerald Wallace, Nazr Mohammed, Derrick Brown

Why for us? Gerald isnt the same anymore. We not only dump salary with this deal but we get a good young player in Anthony Randolph who can play both the 4 and 3. Azubuike can knock down threes and play up tempo if he's healthy and we really need another solid three point shooter. Roger Mason is another good back up point/shooting guard. Again, he's a thre point shooter and vet who could really help out. Lastly there is Eddy Curry. IF HEALTHY...and thats a BIG BIG IF....he can play pretty well. I dont think he is actually hurt, I think it is more of a D'Antoni thing. He could realistically start here IF HEALTHY.

Why for NYK? They may not want to dump all of there young talent for Melo...instead they can still acquire an All Star in Gerald Wallace by giving the cats players who dont play in their rotation anyway. Derrick Brown may flourish in there system(Not really sure),or he could get buried on the bench. He is a good young player tho. Nazr would help them at the C position and he is a 6.5 million dollar expiring contract.


Bobcats Lineup after trade:

PG: DJ/Livingston/Mason/Collins
SG: Henderson/Azubuike/Carroll
SF: Jack/Dom
PF: Diaw/Randolph/Tyrus and Najera(Out)
C: Kwame/Curry/Diop(OUT)

wtf

Curry can't play basketball, Mason sucks at basketball, so does Randolph, Azubuike had a bad knee injury and is just a role player. Why should we trade Crash and our only backup center for this shit?

[ammofan]

wtf

Curry can't play basketball, Mason sucks at basketball, so does Randolph, Azubuike had a bad knee injury and is just a role player. Why should we trade Crash and our only backup center for this shit?

Because this is probably our best offer we can get. Would you rather have what I posted or a TPE?

[GoBobs]

I could almost get into the idea of S. Jackson, G. Diop, M Carroll, E Najara for Antuan Jamison, Anthony Parker. Jackson would likely need to go to a third team for an asset the Cavs would want like a young player or a draft pick. Could work out for us in the wake of the Tyrus Thomas injury.

[ammofan]

I could almost get into the idea of S. Jackson, G. Diop, M Carroll, E Najara for Antuan Jamison, Anthony Parker. Jackson would likely need to go to a third team for an asset the Cavs would want like a young player or a draft pick. Could work out for us in the wake of the Tyrus Thomas injury.

I would do that no doubt....Jamison wouldnt mind being here probably because he is from here...

[CatNation]

I'd take the young player or draft pick over Jamison

[GoBobs]

Young players are up and down and picks are overrated unless they are top picks. Jamison would give us a nice boost on offense. Having two front court players who can play away from the basket (Jamison and Diaw) could be a very dangerous look because we could isolate Gerald Wallace on the inside where he will win most of the rebounding with his guy.

What it comes down to for me is I would rather have Jamison then Jackson. I feel even better about it if Henderson is ready to step up a little bit. If we can toss in Diop and Carroll that will make up the salary difference. In fact we will even get out a year early because Jamison's contract is only two years.

If Jamison sucks next year maybe we can still do something with his expiring contract. My guess is he would play well for us and sign for something reasonable after his contract is up. We would have a lot of forwards after Tyrus Thomas comes back but Diaw can always play the C or Tyrus the 3 sometimes.

[Dcarnys]

Apparently the Warriors are shopping Stephen Curry. Any interest for us, considering the Warriors have been our trade bait for awhile.

[SWedd523]

Apparently the Warriors are shopping Stephen Curry. Any interest for us, considering the Warriors have been our trade bait for awhile.
Link?





10char

[Chef]

wtf

Curry can't play basketball, Mason sucks at basketball, so does Randolph, Azubuike had a bad knee injury and is just a role player. Why should we trade Crash and our only backup center for this shit?

this. if we are moving wallace to nyk it must include chandler or gallo, curry, randolph or pick from minnesota in a 3 teamer. nothing less.

[Chef]

Apparently the Warriors are shopping Stephen Curry. Any interest for us, considering the Warriors have been our trade bait for awhile.

say what? i believe it when i see it from a named source. my gut reaction is no way in hell this is true.

[The Prodigy]

say what? i believe it when i see it from a named source. my gut reaction is no way in hell this is true.

Dont have a link handy, but they were talking about it on Pardon the Interruption. They said that the GM of the Warriors said Monta is untouchable, but they would trade Curry. I believe his reason was because the two were so similar, they felt that they didnt need them both. And for what its worth (nothing), Kornhieser said it was a 100% chance Curry would be moved, and Wilbon went with 90%.

[Dcarnys]

Link?

http://nba-facts-and-rumors.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22748484/27173436
http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2011/01/21/no-talk-or-trade-is-off-limits-for-the-warriors-joe-lacob/

I heard it though On PTI earlier. Both said hes probably on his way out and that Monta Ellis is their untouchable. I know its probably a longshot but potentaly doable.

[rsxnova]

Apparently the Warriors are shopping Stephen Curry. Any interest for us, considering the Warriors have been our trade bait for awhile.

The Warriors want to make a superstar trade and have named Monta their franchise player. Baby Silas needs to hide his boner and pull some strings. They can have Wallace and Jackson and i will take Beans off their hands.

[jdub28]

Dont have a link handy, but they were talking about it on Pardon the Interruption. They said that the GM of the Warriors said Monta is untouchable, but they would trade Curry. I believe his reason was because the two were so similar, they felt that they didnt need them both. And for what its worth (nothing), Kornhieser said it was a 100% chance Curry would be moved, and Wilbon went with 90%.

I can 2nd this. The owner sees Curry as a disappointment because he isn't playing at the level he finished at last season. Curry averages 1 more steal a game but also 1 more TO than DJ. Curry scores 2 points more and shoots a few percentage points better. I'm guessing it would have to be one or the other because playing both would be defensive suicide.

[Dcarnys]

Only problem is Golden State would NEVER take Jack.

[rsxnova]

Only problem is Golden State would NEVER take Jack.

Jack can go to another team and GS can have the expiring/picks he gets. I dont care about comitting defensive suicide if it means landing charlottes Lebron James(Untill Curry holds his decision that is).

[ohara831]

I understood the talk of Ellis or Curry was only with regard to Melo.

[Chef]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4e8ucln

wallace, dj, kwame and a 2011 and 2013 right to swap for curry, bieds

then
we move jax or nazr for a 3 and go with curry, hendo, new sf or jax, diaw, bieds

if they are letting go of curry or putting him on the block it is going to be for a melo rental or to the bulls, griz (for mayo) or a host of other teams that can offer much more than us. larry really painted us in a corner asset and cap-wise. i would love love love curry here. i think paired with a defensive sg like hendo he could be the scorer we have really needed. i am concerned about injuries though. it would be cool to hear dell call his games though.

[rsxnova]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4e8ucln

wallace, dj, kwame and a 2011 and 2013 right to swap for curry, bieds

then
we move jax or nazr for a 3 and go with curry, hendo, new sf or jax, diaw, bieds

if they are letting go of curry or putting him on the block it is going to be for a melo rental or to the bulls, griz (for mayo) or a host of other teams that can offer much more than us. larry really painted us in a corner asset and cap-wise. i would love love love curry here. i think paired with a defensive sg like hendo he could be the scorer we have really needed. i am concerned about injuries though. it would be cool to here dell call his games though.

We do own the defensive star they are looking for.

[Chef]

We do own the defensive star they are looking for.

stop talking like this has a snowball's chance of going down. i can not get even a little excited about this after the cp3 debacle.

[rsxnova]

stop talking like this has a snowball's chance of going down. i can not get even a little excited about this after the cp3 debacle.

As soon as i hear there is a snowballs chance it could happen the gears in my head start turning. The lil Silas connection has to mean something.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

What about two potential trades with NJ now that they are out of the Melo sweepstakes.

First: Kris Humphries and Anthony Morrow for Stephen Jackson
Second: Troy Murphey for Gerald Wallace

I'm not sure if they would do the first, however it would be a sweet deal for us. Morrow is a local kid, and would provide nice scoring off the bench. He would be the ideal back-up for Henderson, instant offense and good shooting. Humphries is an expiring having a quality year. He could provide not only salary relief, but also that temporary back-up to Diaw while Thomas is out.

The second one would be straight salary dump. Maybe we could get a first out of the Nets as well. Hopefully we could keep Murphy here and he could act as that back-up to Diaw while Thomas is out.

I think I would be happy with either one...thoughts?

[rsxnova]

What about two potential trades with NJ now that they are out of the Melo sweepstakes.

First: Kris Humphries and Anthony Morrow for Stephen Jackson
Second: Troy Murphey for Gerald Wallace

I'm not sure if they would do the first, however it would be a sweet deal for us. Morrow is a local kid, and would provide nice scoring off the bench. He would be the ideal back-up for Henderson, instant offense and good shooting. Humphries is an expiring having a quality year. He could provide not only salary relief, but also that temporary back-up to Diaw while Thomas is out.

The second one would be straight salary dump. Maybe we could get a first out of the Nets as well. Hopefully we could keep Murphy here and he could act as that back-up to Diaw while Thomas is out.

I think I would be happy with either one...thoughts?

This trade kills me a bit inside. I want no part in giving NJ a playoff team for a salary dump.

Harris/Jack/Wallace/Favors/Lopez...

Welcome to BCP!!!

[Chef]

What about two potential trades with NJ now that they are out of the Melo sweepstakes.

First: Kris Humphries and Anthony Morrow for Stephen Jackson
Second: Troy Murphey for Gerald Wallace

I'm not sure if they would do the first, however it would be a sweet deal for us. Morrow is a local kid, and would provide nice scoring off the bench. He would be the ideal back-up for Henderson, instant offense and good shooting. Humphries is an expiring having a quality year. He could provide not only salary relief, but also that temporary back-up to Diaw while Thomas is out.

The second one would be straight salary dump. Maybe we could get a first out of the Nets as well. Hopefully we could keep Murphy here and he could act as that back-up to Diaw while Thomas is out.

I think I would be happy with either one...thoughts?

1st trade is fine with me. whatever gets rid of jackson for no long term salary is good. the second, i would like to submit a rule for vote. no more gerald for expiring, tpe or salary relief only trades. it won't/shouldn't happen in real life and certainly shouldn't happen on a fan site. the only thing i could even come close to buying into would be a gerald, diop, carroll package for salary relief.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Why thank you! I've been an outside viewer for a while, decided this could be a real interesting season so why not go ahead and join the discussion!

I wouldn't do both trades. i would do one or the other. But I think both are trades that the Nets might at least consider. That is if they are willing to add additional salary. Honestly, i'm not sure which one I like best. Right now i'm not a big fan of either Jack or Wallace.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

1st trade is fine with me. whatever gets rid of jackson for no long term salary is good. the second, i would like to submit a rule for vote. no more gerald for expiring, tpe or salary relief only trades. it won't/shouldn't happen in real life and certainly shouldn't happen on a fan site. the only thing i could even come close to buying into would be a gerald, diop, carroll package for salary relief.


i'm just not really sure how you can say that considering how consistently bad Wallace has played all season. Especially as of late. I mean i know I would take salary for Wallace at this point. In my eyes Hendo is better than Wallace, and you could even argue McGuire could provide the same results as Wallace is providing right now. You especially can't right off any trade scenarios like that considering MJ is rumored to be looking to dump either of these guys for salary relief...

[Chef]

i'm just not really sure how you can say that considering how consistently bad Wallace has played all season. Especially as of late. I mean i know I would take salary for Wallace at this point. In my eyes Hendo is better than Wallace, and you could even argue McGuire could provide the same results as Wallace is providing right now. You especially can't right off any trade scenarios like that considering MJ is rumored to be looking to dump either of these guys for salary relief...

2010-11 stats
wallace 16/8/2/1 st/1 bl per game 42%fg/33%3/73%ft 14 PER
hendo 5/2/.4/.3 41%/0%/64% 8.5
dom 4/3/.2/.6 37%/0%/73% 9.3

wallace is not arguably worse than either hendo or dom. MJ maybe looking to save money and rebuild but he isn't a complete idiot. he knows the value of his players.

also, welcome to the planet and i don't mean that sarcastically plenty of room on the bandwagon!

[rsxnova]

i'm just not really sure how you can say that considering how consistently bad Wallace has played all season. Especially as of late. I mean i know I would take salary for Wallace at this point. In my eyes Hendo is better than Wallace, and you could even argue McGuire could provide the same results as Wallace is providing right now. You especially can't right off any trade scenarios like that considering MJ is rumored to be looking to dump either of these guys for salary relief...

Is that you Larry?

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

2010-11 stats
wallace 16/8/2/1 st/1 bl per game 42%fg/33%3/73%ft 14 PER
hendo 5/2/.4/.3 41%/0%/64% 8.5
dom 4/3/.2/.6 37%/0%/73% 9.3

wallace is not arguably worse than either hendo or dom. MJ maybe looking to save money and rebuild but he isn't a complete idiot. he knows the value of his players.

Well yeah of course his numbers are going to be higher. Look at the minutes he's been playing compared to those two. I would be interested to see Wallace's numbers recently, and his defense is not nearly as good as Hendo.

If you really look at it, McGuire is not much worse than Wallace if Wallace is going to continue to do nothing but shoot (aka not drive). McGuire has greater size, is just as good a rebounder, better defense, and under Silas might even have a better Jumper. I mean if your consistently going to get at or under 10 points in 40 minutes from Wallace, no way you can tell me McGuire could not get close to that. And Hendo could Defiantly get OVER that in 40 minutes and play MUCH better defense. Open your mind up to the Bobcats without Wallace. I think so many Bobcat's fans try to find any excuse they can to defend Wallace in this terrible season he is putting together. In reality, most of it is just because you can't let go of him. Well it just MIGHT be that time. And if you ask me, Wallace for Murphy is a much better deal than Wallace for TPE because at least with Murphy you get a proven vet who actually fills a need.

Having said all that. I would probably still prefer the Jackson trade.

[Chef]

Well yeah of course his numbers are going to be higher. Look at the minutes he's been playing compared to those two. I would be interested to see Wallace's numbers recently, and his defense is not nearly as good as Hendo.

If you really look at it, McGuire is not much worse than Wallace if Wallace is going to continue to do nothing but shoot (aka not drive). McGuire has greater size, is just as good a rebounder, better defense, and under Silas might even have a better Jumper. I mean if your consistently going to get at or under 10 points in 40 minutes from Wallace, no way you can tell me McGuire could not get close to that. And Hendo could Defiantly get OVER that in 40 minutes and play MUCH better defense. Open your mind up to the Bobcats without Wallace. I think so many Bobcat's fans try to find any excuse they can to defend Wallace in this terrible season he is putting together. In reality, most of it is just because you can't let go of him. Well it just MIGHT be that time. And if you ask me, Wallace for Murphy is a much better deal than Wallace for TPE because at least with Murphy you get a proven vet who actually fills a need.

Having said all that. I would probably still prefer the Jackson trade.

PER is based on 48 minutes played. since coming back from injury wallace has scored 14, 20, 15, 11, 13, 6 and avg'd slightly over 4 FT's per game. he is certainly playing under last years level and it is yet to be determined if this is the beginning of the end of his playing days but he is head and shoulders above any other sf on this team. look back through these threads, my record is steadfastly in favor of moving wallace but not for less than half of his worth. i am not disagreeing with trading him, i am very much against trading him for peanuts.

[davcbow]

I for keeping GW and trading Jax but not for peanuts like Chef said.. :)

[ballwhore]

Trade Dj, Gerald Wallace and Najera to Miami for Chalmers and Bosh. You get rid of DJ's inability to lead and create and bad defense for Chalmers good defense and also add a legit scoring option in Bosh. Deal of the century.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

PER is based on 48 minutes played. since coming back from injury wallace has scored 14, 20, 15, 11, 13, 6 and avg'd slightly over 4 FT's per game. he is certainly playing under last years level and it is yet to be determined if this is the beginning of the end of his playing days but he is head and shoulders above any other sf on this team. look back through these threads, my record is steadfastly in favor of moving wallace but not for less than half of his worth. i am not disagreeing with trading him, i am very much against trading him for peanuts.

I just don't think he has much value at all around the league. I mean watching him and he looks like he is done. He is a player that relies so much on his athleticism, and we all know that is the first to go when your older. He has no jump shot to depend on, which is what prolongs guys careers. To make things worse, he has an injury issue and who knows, one more concussion could end his career. I think your overrating his value. Obviously all of us would love to get more out of him, but i'm just being realistic based on the trade rumors we have heard. I would take Murphy over the TPE. At least with Murphy he is an expiring AND fills a newly created need.

I just think that McGuire, if given the same 40 minutes, could get at least CLOSE to 10 points. And McGuire is the better defender. Plus I also think this is a better team with Henderson at the 2 and Jackson at the 3. Jackson is a better defender than Wallace at the 3, and Henderson obviously has developed into a pretty damn good defender. Not to mention, again, i'm confident in Henderson being able to score at least close to 10 in 40 minutes. The ONE thing you loose there is rebounding.

[murphman]

Trade Dj, Gerald Wallace and Najera to Miami for Chalmers and Bosh. You get rid of DJ's inability to lead and create and bad defense for Chalmers good defense and also add a legit scoring option in Bosh. Deal of the century.



Your sister is just dying to get down to the bright lights and warmth of South Beach huh?!

[BlockParty]

I think most here need to take a reality check and realize Larry is gone and the possibility of multiple trades in the same year are not likely to happen. Larry turned the roster over a time and half during his 2.3 years here. Silas averaged about 1 trade per year involving 2 players in his last two coaching stints (Hornets and Cavs).

I know it's the GM and Owner in many cases 'forming' the roster, but a lot trades occur because the coach is in the GM's ear everyday complaining about what he doesn't have, and in some instances, making a move just to shut the coach up. I don't think we are in that situation any longer with Silas, I think he appreciates the roster (assuming they continue to give him maximum effort) and we only make a trade in reaction to multiple injuries which cannot be adequately covered by the players available.

So..maybe I should've started a thread...since we aren't going to do any trades, what would you change about the Bobcats offensive/defensive players and player rotations.

[davcbow]

Trade Dj, Gerald Wallace and Najera to Miami for Chalmers and Bosh. You get rid of DJ's inability to lead and create and bad defense for Chalmers good defense and also add a legit scoring option in Bosh. Deal of the century.

I think you must be high... Id love to have Bosh here but not by losing GW and DJ...

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

I'll bet you there will be a trade. Especially if we come out of this road trip loosing a lot. The first second MJ see's were slipping out of the playoffs he won't hesitate to trade for pure Cash. Which at that point would probably be the right move.

[ammofan]

I just wnat some sort of trade to happen.......I bet there will be some sort of trade soon(It has to, we have a month left to make a deal).

[DY_nasty]

PER is such a ridiculous stat...

[Chef]

PER is such a ridiculous stat...

why?......

[Chef]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4e8ucln

wallace, dj, kwame and a 2011 and 2013 right to swap for curry, bieds

then
we move jax or nazr for a 3 and go with curry, hendo, new sf or jax, diaw, bieds

if they are letting go of curry or putting him on the block it is going to be for a melo rental or to the bulls, griz (for mayo) or a host of other teams that can offer much more than us. larry really painted us in a corner asset and cap-wise. i would love love love curry here. i think paired with a defensive sg like hendo he could be the scorer we have really needed. i am concerned about injuries though. it would be cool to hear dell call his games though.

here is simmon's trade on the subject
atl out: smiff, pachulia, crawford
gst out: curry, bieds, rad, charlie bell

the deal i came up with is better for them of course draft wise but also crawford is a worse version of monta so they won't want him and they take on salary with pachulia and resigning crawford. the other angle i would try to sell them on is maybe hendo over dj as a defensive compliment to ellis. then we move dj, jax, nazr for a defensive sg, center/pf.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

why?......

I'm sure PER wouldn't had predicted Hendo's 19 point game when he actually got the minutes. Fact of the matter is, how can you judge a player that plays 5 minutes and expand it as if he played 40? How many players play 10 minutes, do nothing, but then do EVERYTHING in the next 10 minutes? How you can judge a guy who plays 40 minutes as better than a guy who plays 15 minutes based on PER is beyond me.

[DY_nasty]

why?......
based on metrics extrapolated from a "what if" formula

same with Per 36 numbers

Basketball isn't baseball.... People tend to fall in love with numbers way too easily and instead of arguing what they see with factual support, instead they rely on numbers making the argument for them entirely.

[BobCatsFanInTx]

If there are going to be any trades they won't be trades to put this team in the playoffs. Charles Barkley thinks it would be better for MJ to blow it up and start from scratch because he feels the team will be stuck in the bottom of the playoffs no matter what trade they make. Charles feels it is better to blow it up and try to build from scratch and I am thinking MJ will have the same mind set. The team as constructed does not have much flexibility and room to improve very much. So if the team is sliding heading into the All Star break do not expect any trades that are going to get us to "just make the playoffs." I would rather go through a few seasons of growing pains and have a team with some cap space than to be a playoff doormat for several years to come.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

If there are going to be any trades they won't be trades to put this team in the playoffs. Charles Barkley thinks it would be better for MJ to blow it up and start from scratch because he feels the team will be stuck in the bottom of the playoffs no matter what trade they make. Charles feels it is better to blow it up and try to build from scratch and I am thinking MJ will have the same mind set. The team as constructed does not have much flexibility and room to improve very much. So if the team is sliding heading into the All Star break do not expect any trades that are going to get us to "just make the playoffs." I would rather go through a few seasons of growing pains and have a team with some cap space than to be a playoff doormat for several years to come.

First, I would not follow ANYTHING Charles Barkley says. haha. But if you look at our contract situation, in 2 years we have nearly everyone off the payroll. If we can make the playoffs, even as a bottom feeder, the next 2 years it builds up fan support and credibility heading into that free agency. At that time we should look to blow it up, obviously. But until then, keep milking making the playoffs for the fans.

Anyway, Silas said pre game he does not expect any moves at the moment, they are going to try out what they have and see. Najera will be the primary back-up to Diaw.

[ammofan]

Anyway, Silas said pre game he does not expect any moves at the moment, they are going to try out what they have and see. Najera will be the primary back-up to Diaw.

shit........

[GoBobs]

I would love to get Tyler H from the pacers I wonder what they would take for him.

[CrazyCarl139]

Is there a link to what Sir Charles said? I'm a big fan and if he's talking about the Cats that's awesome!

I actually agree with him too, kind of. I think that finishing in the bottom half of the playoff rankings is pointless and with the current roster that we have, that's all that we will be doing. We should "blow it up" and try to build a team. However, getting cap space is not going to do anything if free agents won't sign here, so I think it's important that we stay competitive too. We need to make trades to acquire young talent and assets like draft picks. I have no problem taking on a teams bad contract if that helps us to acquire young talent that we can develop.

The bottom line is, the Bobcats need to develop a plan and stick with it for the next 3-5 years. That plan can't be, "How can we finish in the 8th seed in the playoffs?" The plan should be, "How can we acquire young talent?"

Players like Steph Curry, OJ Mayo, Hasheem Thabeet and other young guys need to be targeted.

[ohara831]

All I know is I am sick and tired of our two "best players"- Crash and Jax - absolutely bringing this team down. DJ and Boris have been the most reliable players we have had all year long. And isn't it funny how those are the 2 that so many of us were talking about trying to trade away for better pieces for so much of the time. You want to improve? Ditch Crash and Jax for some youth and draft picks and be rid of the anchor which is weighing us down. Damnit, I'm pissed!!!!

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

All I know is I am sick and tired of our two "best players"- Crash and Jax - absolutely bringing this team down. DJ and Boris have been the most reliable players we have had all year long. And isn't it funny how those are the 2 that so many of us were talking about trying to trade away for better pieces for so much of the time. You want to improve? Ditch Crash and Jax for some youth and draft picks and be rid of the anchor which is weighing us down. Damnit, I'm pissed!!!!

Could not agree more. And to make it worse, these two bums are our freaking captains. They are freaking KILLING this team right now! Seriously, the fact this team was able to win ANY games with the two of these guys in recent weeks is a complete mystery. If were lucky enough to get the Nets to accept a Jackson/Wallace deal for Murphy, you take that and RUN away as fast as you can before they realize what we left them with!

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

And now would be the ideal time to make a trade. We have 2 days until our next game. Once we get to that road trip we have 5 games in 7 days. At least if we were to make a trade, say tomorrow, there could be SOME time to get the new player(s) in and accustomed to what we want to do. Once we get to that road stretch, if we make a trade were almost screwed for a game until we got the player back in. It would be bad timing...I hope MJ's has his phone in his hand right now.

[BobCatsFanInTx]

First, I would not follow ANYTHING Charles Barkley says. haha. But if you look at our contract situation, in 2 years we have nearly everyone off the payroll. If we can make the playoffs, even as a bottom feeder, the next 2 years it builds up fan support and credibility heading into that free agency. At that time we should look to blow it up, obviously. But until then, keep milking making the playoffs for the fans.

Anyway, Silas said pre game he does not expect any moves at the moment, they are going to try out what they have and see. Najera will be the primary back-up to Diaw.Barkley is a person I actually do take somewhat serious. Also making any mid season trades to make the playoffs is useless. For one, most trades only hinder us as far as cap flexibility and the the luxury tax. Either Jordan maintains the status quo for two seasons or he rebuilds. My personal opinion is that it is better for MJ and all of us if he takes the rebuild approach NOW. There is a chance that we end up like the old Clippers teams who blew it in the draft more times than not but there is also a chance we are a team on the rise in three seasons and have our own drafted talent taking us to places we have never been. Personally I would try to trade every player on the team outside of DJ Augustine, Gerald Henderson and Maybe Tyrus Thomas.

The longer we take to start a rebuild the more suffering this organization and it's fans goes through. I don't see us making the playoffs this season anyway. There is a disconnect with certain players. Namely our two so called corner stones Gerald Wallace and Stephen Jackson. Gerald is playing almost as if he doesn't care and Stephen Jackson is just being Stephen Jackson. Of course Jax is even worse this season than normal. This team will be lucky to make the playoffs this season and they sure as hell are a long way off for next. If the team is sliding fast and falling way behind making the playoffs I say we try to rebulid.

Charles Barkley can be an idiot but he can also make a lot of sense. I think in this instance he is 90% right. If this team looks poorly heading in to the trade deadline I say we take young talent and draft picks in trades and treat this team as if it were a first year expansion team.

[BobCatsFanInTx]

Is there a link to what Sir Charles said? I'm a big fan and if he's talking about the Cats that's awesome!

I actually agree with him too, kind of. I think that finishing in the bottom half of the playoff rankings is pointless and with the current roster that we have, that's all that we will be doing. We should "blow it up" and try to build a team. However, getting cap space is not going to do anything if free agents won't sign here, so I think it's important that we stay competitive too. We need to make trades to acquire young talent and assets like draft picks. I have no problem taking on a teams bad contract if that helps us to acquire young talent that we can develop.

The bottom line is, the Bobcats need to develop a plan and stick with it for the next 3-5 years. That plan can't be, "How can we finish in the 8th seed in the playoffs?" The plan should be, "How can we acquire young talent?"

Players like Steph Curry, OJ Mayo, Hasheem Thabeet and other young guys need to be targeted.Crazy, he said it on TNT. It is nice to know that we agree.

[BobCatsFanInTx]

Could not agree more. And to make it worse, these two bums are our freaking captains. They are freaking KILLING this team right now! Seriously, the fact this team was able to win ANY games with the two of these guys in recent weeks is a complete mystery. If were lucky enough to get the Nets to accept a Jackson/Wallace deal for Murphy, you take that and RUN away as fast as you can before they realize what we left them with!What we may end up leaving another team with is two guys who make a big difference in a good way to the success of the teams they are on.

Just because these guys are not performing well for us does not mean that they can not perform for another team. I really think that damned near the whole team as constructed should be traded. Getting rid of two of our best players regardless of how they are playing now will not end the suffering. You wonder how we have won ANY games with these two guys in recent weeks? It is the fact that those two guys showed up to a handfull of them. We just get irate over the losses and don't acknowledge the wins nearly enough. That does not mean that I think these two guys are not hurting us on many a night but let us not scapegoat two players on a TEAM. Paul Silas should have the ability to get his players to perform and perform smartly. So when the team lays an egg part of the blame is on him.

Still, even if everything was happy and fun in Bobcat land this team will never be more than a 6th seed at most. MJ needs to level with the Bobcats fans and let them know that the best course of action for the team is to rebuild. If done the right way the Bobcats could be similar to the Thunder and I would say Blazers but the promise that team was showing is falling fast.

[ammofan]

The trade I would do....and I think GSW would as well:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4byybum

BOBCATS IN: Steph, Biedrins, Williams, Bell
WARRIORS IN: Naz, GW, UPS, and draft picks

Lineup:
DJ
Steph
Jack
Boris
Biedrins

Thats a great running lineup for Silas and a good young team(Tyrus, DJ, and Steph...maybe Hendo)to build around.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

What we may end up leaving another team with is two guys who make a big difference in a good way to the success of the teams they are on.

Just because these guys are not performing well for us does not mean that they can not perform for another team. I really think that damned near the whole team as constructed should be traded. Getting rid of two of our best players regardless of how they are playing now will not end the suffering. You wonder how we have won ANY games with these two guys in recent weeks? It is the fact that those two guys showed up to a handfull of them. We just get irate over the losses and don't acknowledge the wins nearly enough. That does not mean that I think these two guys are not hurting us on many a night but let us not scapegoat two players on a TEAM. Paul Silas should have the ability to get his players to perform and perform smartly. So when the team lays an egg part of the blame is on him.

Still, even if everything was happy and fun in Bobcat land this team will never be more than a 6th seed at most. MJ needs to level with the Bobcats fans and let them know that the best course of action for the team is to rebuild. If done the right way the Bobcats could be similar to the Thunder and I would say Blazers but the promise that team was showing is falling fast.

You mean the wins which we got in spite of them? I mean now-a-days were getting wins where Wallace scores 6 points in 40 minutes and Jakson scores 10 in 40 minutes. Anyone looking at this team can clearly tell these two guys are terrible right now, absolutely terrible and killing the team.

I think it's too important for this franchise and there future to make the playoffs. You don't understand, they are desperate for money. There loosing millions. They need to build a fan base and quick. They cannot afford to miss the playoffs, and miss out on that chance for additional revenue, more notoriety, and more fans. They just can't. Sure you can rebuild now, but another 3 years of loosing and this franchise may not be here anymore. That's just reality. We need to build up a bigger fan base before we can truly tear it all apart. We have to make the playoffs this year, just simply have to. For the future of the franchise.

[CrazyCarl139]

The trade I would do....and I think GSW would as well:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4byybum

BOBCATS IN: Steph, Biedrins, Williams, Bell
WARRIORS IN: Naz, GW, UPS, and draft picks

Lineup:
DJ
Steph
Jack
Boris
Biedrins

Thats a great running lineup for Silas and a good young team(Tyrus, DJ, and Steph...maybe Hendo)to build around.


I don't see the Warriors moving Curry unless they get a "star" back. If the Bobcats were to acquire Curry (and I hope they do more then anything) I think a 3rd team would have to be involved.

I thought of this in about 2 seconds and I don't think it would ever go down, but it would need to look something like this:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4tmwcfu

I know GSW doesn't get a star, but I think their roster is improved. (I would only deal Augustin if it meant landing Curry or Paul)

[bbh2020]

I think this is the move we see next month. From CBS sportsline:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/14584064/postups-nene-impatient-with-nuggets-focus-on-melo

The Bobcats are 8-5 since Paul Silas replaced Larry Brown and arrived at the halfway point in seventh place in the Eastern Conference, quieting speculation that owner Michael Jordan could be moving toward fire-sale mode with veterans Stephen Jackson and Gerald Wallace. Jackson, in fact, wants to stay in Charlotte and is not asking for a trade -- despite apparent interest from Dallas. A trade to the Mavs presumably would give Jackson a chance to be the missing piece on a championship-contending team in the West, but sources say it's more complicated than that. The Mavs first have to find out if they're still an elite team with a healthy Dirk Nowitzki and with Peja Stojakovic replacing Caron Butler, who may or may not return for the playoffs. If they're not, adding Jackson and the $19.3 million he is owed over the next two seasons wouldn't make sense for either party. "He's happy there," a confidant said of Jackson. "He loves the city of Charlotte, and he loves to play for one of the greatest players to play the game, Michael Jordan."

[ammofan]

I think this is the move we see next month. From CBS sportsline:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/14584064/postups-nene-impatient-with-nuggets-focus-on-melo

The Bobcats are 8-5 since Paul Silas replaced Larry Brown and arrived at the halfway point in seventh place in the Eastern Conference, quieting speculation that owner Michael Jordan could be moving toward fire-sale mode with veterans Stephen Jackson and Gerald Wallace. Jackson, in fact, wants to stay in Charlotte and is not asking for a trade -- despite apparent interest from Dallas. A trade to the Mavs presumably would give Jackson a chance to be the missing piece on a championship-contending team in the West, but sources say it's more complicated than that. The Mavs first have to find out if they're still an elite team with a healthy Dirk Nowitzki and with Peja Stojakovic replacing Caron Butler, who may or may not return for the playoffs. If they're not, adding Jackson and the $19.3 million he is owed over the next two seasons wouldn't make sense for either party. "He's happy there," a confidant said of Jackson. "He loves the city of Charlotte, and he loves to play for one of the greatest players to play the game, Michael Jordan."

You mean a deal where Jack goes to Dallas?

[ammofan]

I don't see the Warriors moving Curry unless they get a "star" back. If the Bobcats were to acquire Curry (and I hope they do more then anything) I think a 3rd team would have to be involved.

I thought of this in about 2 seconds and I don't think it would ever go down, but it would need to look something like this:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4tmwcfu

I know GSW doesn't get a star, but I think their roster is improved. (I would only deal Augustin if it meant landing Curry or Paul)

I think the owner wants players that help them build a better lineup. Curry/Ellis do essentially the same exact thing and the owner has said that Ellis is the guy in GSW. They want a guy like Wallace who brings other stuff to the table....Wallace is also an All Star(They are not completely aware of how bad he has been) and I have gotten a general sense from Warriors fans that they would do a Wallace for Curry deal.

[ammofan]

From TradeStreetPost.com:

"What’s up next? The next game for the Bobcats comes on Tuesday as they begin a lengthy swing out West, playing 5 games in 7 nights to finish up the month of January. Our first stop will be all the way out to Sacramento. The Kings are currently suffering a 4-game losing streak and have only won 9 games all season. They will also be playing us on the back end of home/away back-to-back after facing the Trailblazers in Portland Monday evening. It looks like it may be one of our best chances to come away with a win on this road trip, but with Tyrus still out, nothing is certain.

One final note – there is a rumor gaining a lot of traction in the media that Michael Jordan is trying hard to work out a deal that would send Boris Diaw to the Orlando Magic for Jason Richardson. There will have to be additional players involved because Richardson’s expiring contract is worth over $5 million more than Diaw’s. While the upside for the Magic is obvious – they get to shore up their front line behind Dwight Howard – the only advantage I can see for the Cats is to Jordan’s checkbook. The trade will leave us with one of the weakest frontcourts in the NBA until Tyrus Thomas recovers from his (successful) knee surgery. That’s at least 8 long weeks away and by then it will be far too late to salvage a good season. Let’s all hope that this becomes another Jordan trade that ends up being close, but never actually happens. I don’t think Diaw is the glue of the team that many other fans believe him to be, but right now we need him more than ever before if we hope to see another playoff game anytime soon down on Trade Street."

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

I would LOVE J-rich, but in that trade scenario not only would we need to receive SOME type of front court help, but we woudl also have to trade one of Jackson or Wallace. I mean Hendo has looked solid. I have no problem J-rich starting....if Jackson was out of here. But trading our one PF for a guy which would fill a position we already have guys are doesn't make much sense. Find a 3rd team o spin Jack off to and add in a PF coming our way and it's a good trade. I know that Murphy has struggled this season, but maybe Jack to NJ for Murphy, and then Diaw and other pieces to Orlando for J-rich. That would be the ideal money saving trade that wouldn't completely kill this team.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

I might also add. There isn't a need for Orlando to make that trade to "sure up" there front court. Bass AND Anderson are both playing well. They already have a distributor in Hedo. What would be there need for Diaw?

[Chef]

From TradeStreetPost.com:

"What’s up next? The next game for the Bobcats comes on Tuesday as they begin a lengthy swing out West, playing 5 games in 7 nights to finish up the month of January. Our first stop will be all the way out to Sacramento. The Kings are currently suffering a 4-game losing streak and have only won 9 games all season. They will also be playing us on the back end of home/away back-to-back after facing the Trailblazers in Portland Monday evening. It looks like it may be one of our best chances to come away with a win on this road trip, but with Tyrus still out, nothing is certain.

One final note – there is a rumor gaining a lot of traction in the media that Michael Jordan is trying hard to work out a deal that would send Boris Diaw to the Orlando Magic for Jason Richardson. There will have to be additional players involved because Richardson’s expiring contract is worth over $5 million more than Diaw’s. While the upside for the Magic is obvious – they get to shore up their front line behind Dwight Howard – the only advantage I can see for the Cats is to Jordan’s checkbook. The trade will leave us with one of the weakest frontcourts in the NBA until Tyrus Thomas recovers from his (successful) knee surgery. That’s at least 8 long weeks away and by then it will be far too late to salvage a good season. Let’s all hope that this becomes another Jordan trade that ends up being close, but never actually happens. I don’t think Diaw is the glue of the team that many other fans believe him to be, but right now we need him more than ever before if we hope to see another playoff game anytime soon down on Trade Street."

i am not jordan, so i don't have to pay a luxury tax or the team bill period (but i also don't think you should get into the team ownership business and not want to pay luxury taxes etc) but i think we should hang onto diaw. he actually does alot for our team and will be infinitely more valuable next year as an expiring mulit-position glue guy and i am sure there will be many teams looking for expirings following the cba. but, if the team has a future trade of either jax or crash whoever is left sliding or staying at the sf, i guess it could work. i just hope it isn't crash for kaman. if we go the route of trading diaw for expiring (he won't resign here) and trading crash/jax we should just rebuild. we would still be short a frontcourt player either center or pf after the trades to really do anything playoff wise.

as many "mini-blockbuster" good return trades as i propose on this board, see curry, steph, i am not really expecting much coming back except for money saving bs trades as that has been shown to be MJ's MO.

[CrazyCarl139]

No way Orlando tries to acquire Diaw for J-Rich. The Magic need a back up CENTER who can fill in for Dwight. Diaw would be the same player the Magic have with Anderson and Bass. If they trade JRich, who is there starting shooting guard? That is the dumbest trade, it is a lose-lose for both teams involved

[Chef]

No way Orlando tries to acquire Diaw for J-Rich. The Magic need a back up CENTER who can fill in for Dwight. Diaw would be the same player the Magic have with Anderson and Bass. If they trade JRich, who is there starting shooting guard? That is the dumbest trade, it is a lose-lose for both teams involved

there is a 5-6 mil difference. nazr is paid 6 mil. i pray that he is not included. we would not be getting back even close to fair value. i am sure it would be a nazr, diaw for j-rich, anderson (highly doubt it), daniel orton (probable) and a pick.

[BRNC]

I think it funny that all our trade threads end up centered around the "blow-up" the team-theme and bring in picks/young talent...

Teams take players with (what is perceived to be) a hefty contract AND get 1st round picks along with those contracts...why anyone thinks we can demand young talent and picks when every team in the league will know we want to blow-it-up is beyond me...

We'd be lucky yo trade Jax to the Mavs for Butler and their first...which will be what...mid to late 20s...where we'll get a star player for sure...

We need to face the fact that we're pretty much stuck with what we have...or we make a trade like Jax to the Mavs...or move one player (maybe Diaw) for cap-space (which does nothing at this point for us since we don't seem capable of signing any relevant player to come play here)

The whole blow-it-up for picks and young talent sounds nice...but it's not happening when every team knows the cap changes are coming but they don't know how they will change...

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

there is a 5-6 mil difference. nazr is paid 6 mil. i pray that he is not included. we would not be getting back even close to fair value. i am sure it would be a nazr, diaw for j-rich, anderson (highly doubt it), daniel orton (probable) and a pick.

Now if we got that kind of return back, it would be worth it. But the chances of us getting J-rich and Anderson and Orton are slim to none. I also don't know how much of a C Orton is. I mean if he was good, the Magic would not be looking for a C. Still would be a quick way to make this team younger and get savings. Anderson is liek a Diaw minus the passing ability. He is a 3 point threat and plays dont he perimeter. So that could help this team. I know this team had interest in Brandon Bass in the past. I wouldn't mind getting him either. I just don't think a trade is very likely..

[Chef]

I think it funny that all our trade threads end up centered around the "blow-up" the team-theme and bring in picks/young talent...

Teams take players with (what is perceived to be) a hefty contract AND get 1st round picks along with those contracts...why anyone thinks we can demand young talent and picks when every team in the league will know we want to blow-it-up is beyond me...

We'd be lucky yo trade Jax to the Mavs for Butler and their first...which will be what...mid to late 20s...where we'll get a star player for sure...

We need to face the fact that we're pretty much stuck with what we have...or we make a trade like Jax to the Mavs...or move one player (maybe Diaw) for cap-space (which does nothing at this point for us since we don't seem capable of signing any relevant player to come play here)

The whole blow-it-up for picks and young talent sounds nice...but it's not happening when every team knows the cap changes are coming but they don't know how they will change...

which is why the trade order matters so much. if we are going to move crash, he needs to move first. he has the best rep and is probably still our best player (as far as joining a legit team goes, his play will return when he isn't THE guy). we could either get diop or carroll out with him OR get a pick and young player. then if we did move nazr later we could take back salary and get picks back with it. it is a chess game, we can't let the league know we are in blow it up mode until after we deal our best piece. unfortunately, we send out league wide pressers that so and so is on the block which only drives their value down.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Wallace is not THE guy as it is. He is the 3rd option behind DJ and Jack....and he is still sucking it up.

[Chef]

Wallace is not THE guy as it is. He is the 3rd option behind DJ and Jack....and he is still sucking it up.

they are all options 1A,B,C, diaw is D. that is why we can't score. we have 2nd, 3rd and 4th options all competing/forced to be THE guys. all 4 of them would be much much better on a team like the clippers where there are clear alpha and beta guys.

[CatNation]

we should trade one of em for Terrence Williams. Apparently Houston doesn't want to play him...I still remember him from the draft being one of the few guys who actually wanted to be a Bobcat more than anything. And he had the tweet saying "I wonder what it would be like if I was picked one spot higher..." etc. Bring this kid home! Trade the other one to Dallas for Caron, Jones, and a pick, draft a big man re-sign Silas, boom rebuild complete.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

they are all options 1A,B,C, diaw is D. that is why we can't score. we have 2nd, 3rd and 4th options all competing/forced to be THE guys. all 4 of them would be much much better on a team like the clippers where there are clear alpha and beta guys.

I think I woudl group Dj and Jack at 1 A,B and Wallace and Diaw at 2 A, B. But I see your point.

We have a solid foundation here. DJ, hendo, and Tyrus all seem to be quality guys. If we can be smart and trade Wallace and Jack and maybe Diaw and recieve some picks, even if they are late, then we can build this thing back up fast. I mean we already have our own pick next year. Add 1 or two more to that, IF it were possible, and you could retool pretty fast because theres a good chance you find a solid guy with at least one of those picks. Again though, can we get first roun dpicks for these guys? thats the real question.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

we should trade one of em for Terrence Williams. Apparently Houston doesn't want to play him...I still remember him from the draft being one of the few guys who actually wanted to be a Bobcat more than anything. And he had the tweet saying "I wonder what it would be like if I was picked one spot higher..." etc. Bring this kid home! Trade the other one to Dallas for Caron, Jones, and a pick, draft a big man re-sign Silas, boom rebuild complete.

I'm sure Houston would love to get there hands on Wallace. They have a ton of young trade chips. I wouldn't mind Terrance Williams. You might be able to squeeze another yong player out of them as well, perhaps a Jordan Hill, plus an expiring in Battier. Houston would be one of the first teams I call with Wallace. And I like Jack to Dallas for the expiring, Jones ( aformer first round pick with promise) and a first rounder. THat COULD rebuild fast. 2 first round picks, a couple young pieces, plus expiring contracts. Plus, i think if you made moves like that, you could still salvage the season. But that makes too much sense for us to do it :(

[Chef]

we should trade one of em for Terrence Williams. Apparently Houston doesn't want to play him...I still remember him from the draft being one of the few guys who actually wanted to be a Bobcat more than anything. And he had the tweet saying "I wonder what it would be like if I was picked one spot higher..." etc. Bring this kid home! Trade the other one to Dallas for Caron, Jones, and a pick, draft a big man re-sign Silas, boom rebuild complete.

my reservation with williams is that a) he plays the same position as hendo, so all the hendo lovers out there would you want him stealing minutes and b) his attitude is so bad that he hasn't played for nj or houston and had been bounced down to the d-league (where he destroyed). i know where you play makes a big difference and being wanted is huge for these players but his attitude is really really concerning. if he were a throw in to a trade i would certainly take him, but if he were the reason for a trade, no thanks.

[CatNation]

Well I'd want him at SF playing with Hendo where I think he would help Hendo and DJ because he is a great distributor. I agree that he has had some behavioral problems, but he was so enamored with MJ that I doubt he would start any problems here. He wouldnt have to be the only part of a trade, another player or expiring would obviously be included for salary. I just think there are a few guys in the league that really WANT to be here, and he's one of them, he's easily attainable, and he fits our rebuilding plan perfectly.

[BRNC]

Daryl Morey is not the kind of GM to give away assets...and I've heard no interest concerning the Rockets and any of our players...with that said...

The things we've heard earlier in the season (our FO calling every team in the league to gauge interest/value) about our players holds today...other teams (IMO) know we'll make a trade but what are they willing to trade back...that's the key...and to get more value it is imperative that Jax and/or Crash starts to play better BB...but (caveat coming) what if they don't want to be traded...what is their incentive to play better before the trade dead-line ends? Just tossing that out as food to gnaw on......

[CatNation]

I really doubt GMs (at least the good ones) really look at recent play as a reason for pulling a trade. They know what they need, they know what Crash can do. Pure numbers doesn't tell you much. In fact, GMs probably look at his recent play, and see a guy that needs a new situation that they can get at a discount and start calling. and now its a matter of letting them bid each other up till we get something we can live with.

[Absinthe]

Jackson needs to go. He's been a problem for every team he's every played for and he's apparently a locker room problem here too. Wallace's contract is better, he's younger, and Wallace was an all star last year. I guarantee you that if they trade Jackson then Wallace's numbers will immediately improve/go up.

[BRNC]

Cat...I'd love to assume we're getting calls on Crash...and I think everyone knows I like him (Crash)...I'm willing to trade anyone (at this point) to make the team better...but I have serious doubts we're getting anything close to any value on calls for Crash..."if" we're even getting calls about him....:shrug:

[Weezy21]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=66ztnq4

we also send a 2nd round pick and orlando sends a 1st pick both to Golden State

[CatNation]

depends on what you consider fair value. I think an expiring, mid pick, and midlevel prospect would be a steal. Teams that want him view him as a 3rd, 4th option on a championship team, and they're probably right.

[CatNation]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=66ztnq4

we also send a 2nd round pick and orlando sends a 1st pick both to Golden State

You don't think we could match the value for Jameer and a late pick and take Curry for ourselves?

[BRNC]

depends on what you consider fair value. I think an expiring, mid pick, and midlevel prospect would be a steal. Teams that want him view him as a 3rd, 4th option on a championship team, and they're probably right.

Cat...I do this but realistically what team (I'd love to know) is offering this to the 'Cats for Crash...?

[CatNation]

Well, the Mavs, Warriors, Rockets, Clippers seem like the best options right now. Unfortunately our team is too tightlipped/nobody cares so we don't get all the juicy trade rumors.

[sc_11]

Jax for Caron Butler, he is hurt for year and we clear up some cap space. Jax goes to team that needs him and we get cap space for the summer, works out perfect. Could trade Jax to someone like the Bulls who could use another scorer. Also I know Nazr has an expiring contract, therefore we could use him to and trade him to Blazers for a youngin, they are in playoff hunt and need another center with all their injuries. If Jax goes though, it will probably be in a 3-way deal because of his larger contract and bad sportsmanship

[BRNC]

The Mavs are the only one we're hearing at the moment...and that is totally dependent on them "feeling" they have a championship chance "after" all their current players are healthy...and Jax for Butler straight-up only gives cap relief...

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Jackson needs to go. He's been a problem for every team he's every played for and he's apparently a locker room problem here too. Wallace's contract is better, he's younger, and Wallace was an all star last year. I guarantee you that if they trade Jackson then Wallace's numbers will immediately improve/go up.

Actually Jackson has 2 years after this with 19 million left.
Wallace has 2 years after this with 21 million left.

And Jackson has always had better production than Wallace. Not saying we should keep Jackson over Wallace, but Wallace does have the worse contract of the two and produces less than Jackson.

[Absinthe]

He produces more because he is a chucker, not because he is the better player.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

He produces more because he is a chucker, not because he is the better player.

Not saying he is the better player. I'm just saying he produces more. Which when it comes down to it, is what you want. Just saying that to say jackson's contract is worse than Wallace's is false.

[mrtarheel]

Ok here is a trade that helps now and gives us young talent in the wake of if we trade Diaw
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4qwcef9

bobcats out: Collins, D Brown, Nazr
in: Thompson, Hickson, Moon

kings out: Thompson, Casspi
in: Nazr, Brown, Gibson

cavs out: Hickson, Moon, Gibson
in: Collins, Casspi

Dj, Livingston
Jax, Hendo, Carrol
Crash, Moon, McGuire
Diaw, TT, Hickson, Najarea
Brown, Thompson, Diop

or include McGuire and get a pg back or let him the take the place of Collins

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Ok here is a trade that helps now and gives us young talent in the wake of if we trade Diaw
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4qwcef9

bobcats out: Collins, D Brown, Nazr
in: Thompson, Hickson, Moon

kings out: Thompson, Casspi
in: Nazr, Brown, Gibson

cavs out: Hickson, Moon, Gibson
in: Collins, Casspi

Dj, Livingston
Jax, Hendo, Carrol
Crash, Moon, McGuire
Diaw, TT, Hickson, Najarea
Brown, Thompson, Diop

or include McGuire and get a pg back or let him the take the place of Collins

So let me get this straight. We trade two crap players and an expiring and somehow get back not 1, but two promising young BIGS and an athletic SF? Haha, bit of a fantasy isn't it? NO way that trade happened....Bobs would get laughed off the phone.

[mrtarheel]

So let me get this straight. We trade two crap players and an expiring and somehow get back not 1, but two promising young BIGS and an athletic SF? Haha, bit of a fantasy isn't it? NO way that trade happened....Bobs would get laughed off the phone.

Hickson is wanted out of Cleveland and Sac has been dreaming of a pg. With the addition of Nazr they can then trade Dalembert for more pieces, while the Cavs get a young wing in Casspi that was decent last year and has promise. Maybe through in some second rd picks but it isn't to far fetched IMO.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Hickson is wanted out of Cleveland and Sac has been dreaming of a pg. With the addition of Nazr they can then trade Dalembert for more pieces, while the Cavs get a young wing in Casspi that was decent last year and has promise. Maybe through in some second rd picks but it isn't to far fetched IMO.

The Cavs are giving up two young productive player for a D-league PG and a player who doesn't even produce more than 1 of the guys there giving up. Plus he is older. Why would they ever even consider that? Heck, Cavs fans woudln't even consider Gibson as part of the Wallace trade.

[mrtarheel]

The Cavs are giving up two young productive player for a D-league PG and a player who doesn't even produce more than 1 of the guys there giving up. Plus he is older. Why would they ever even consider that? Heck, Cavs fans woudln't even consider Gibson as part of the Wallace trade.

They still have the TPE, more players can be coming in with both teams having better trade options. Better yet if need be they could get Dalembert and send out Mo Williams instead. The trade would still work. It's just they have more options than we do with trade pieces and that could be a piece that they would't have to find. They could use the TPE and get Iggy and be set with Iggy at the 2 and Casspi at the 3. Both young talents while Sac send Dalembert to Houston for all kinds of young talent and not have to worry about a backup C and get players like Hill and Battier to cover and if not better make up the loss of Casspi and Thompson.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

They still have the TPE, more players can be coming in with both teams having better trade options. Better yet if need be they could get Dalembert and send out Mo Williams instead. The trade would still work. It's just they have more options than we do with trade pieces and that could be a piece that they would't have to find. They could use the TPE and get Iggy and be set with Iggy at the 2 and Casspi at the 3. Both young talents while Sac send Dalembert to Houston for all kinds of young talent and not have to worry about a backup C and get players like Hill and Battier to cover and if not better make up the loss of Casspi and Thompson.


And with Iguadala and Casspri they would probably win about as many games as with Gibson and Hickson. Sorry, but that type of trade is VERY unlikely to happen. Anytime you start throwing 3 team trades involving as many players as that involves it becomes highly unlikely to happen. Especially when none of it is based on a rumor.

[mrtarheel]

And with Iguadala and Casspri they would probably win about as many games as with Gibson and Hickson. Sorry, but that type of trade is VERY unlikely to happen. Anytime you start throwing 3 team trades involving as many players as that involves it becomes highly unlikely to happen. Especially when none of it is based on a rumor.

It is know around the league and all chat talk Houston is looking for a Center and even want Landry back. Byron Scott publicly said his team is not responding to him and that Hickson was a distraction.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

It is know around the league and all chat talk Houston is looking for a Center and even want Landry back. Byron Scott publicly said his team is not responding to him and that Hickson was a distraction.

Doesn't mean they want to get rid of Gibson just to get rid of Hickson and get next to nothing back. Gibson is having a really good year for them, there not just going to give him away.

[TheGayKid]

I like this trade: http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa471/Barret_Beck/2011-01-23_1858.png?t=1295827307

[ammofan]

On RufusOnFire Ourday says MJ has Rod working the phones hard for a fire sale. But the catch is MJ wants to do a fire sale without it being viewed to fans as a fire sale. So maybe guys like Troy Murphy and J-Rich.

[davcbow]

Oh good lord who wouldnt?

[Proudiddy]

On RufusOnFire Ourday says MJ has Rod working the phones hard for a fire sale. But the catch is MJ wants to do a fire sale without it being viewed to fans as a fire sale. So maybe guys like Troy Murphy and J-Rich.

Well, I wish they would get it started already... I've seen enough of this team and I couldn't agree more with Charles Barkley's comments.

[Proudiddy]

Also, I didn't know if this was worthy of its own thread but:

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/71298/20110123/rubio_still_not_interested_in_playing_for_minnesot a/

Anyone think we could make a play for Rubio? It's obvious he wants a bigger market team, but he also wants an East Coast team, which we are... If he keeps a hard stance on those demands only to play for a bigger market team, I hope he never plays in the league... Otherwise, I'd like to make a play for him.

[ammofan]

Also, I didn't know if this was worthy of its own thread but:

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/71298/20110123/rubio_still_not_interested_in_playing_for_minnesot a/

Anyone think we could make a play for Rubio? It's obvious he wants a bigger market team, but he also wants an East Coast team, which we are... If he keeps a hard stance on those demands only to play for a bigger market team, I hope he never plays in the league... Otherwise, I'd like to make a play for him.

I dont think he would want to play here. I would love to have him but we have DJ and Rubio isnt needed.

[Proudiddy]

Yeah, I know, just throwing it out there... He is 6'3" though, so maybe we could run a small backcourt with him and DJ. At the least, he's another asset, but I agree, I doubt he'll want to play here or any other mid-small market team.

[DY_nasty]

Kahn's job rides on Rubio. He's had 7 picks in 2 years and done nothing with it but get worse.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

On RufusOnFire Ourday says MJ has Rod working the phones hard for a fire sale. But the catch is MJ wants to do a fire sale without it being viewed to fans as a fire sale. So maybe guys like Troy Murphy and J-Rich.

I could go for both, and I think both a are the ideal guys for this type thought process. I actually completely agree with MJ here. There are players that have expirings that you can trade for that WILL help this season, and then still allow you to start over. That would be the ideal situation. We have a solid base here with DJ, Hendo and Thomas. Even if you trade for expirings, but get some talent back we could still make the playoffs. I agree 100 percent with MJ here. I hope it's true.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Caron Butler (just the contract, obviously no player)
Kenyon Martin,JR Smith
Tayshuan Prince
Shane Battier, Jared Jeffries
Dunleavy
Troy Murphy
Nened Kristic, Mo Petereson
J-rich
Jason Kapano
Dalembert
Reggie Evans
Kirilenko

That's just names with sizable expirings that could help us now. Who do you think we could be looking at if this rumor is true?

[Marvel]

Kahn's job rides on Rubio. He's had 7 picks in 2 years and done nothing with it but get worse.

He's drafted 10 point guards and 10 small forwards. Minnesota is the only exception where if a player says/states they don't want to play there, i am in total agreement. Poor Love and Beasley.

[ammofan]

Caron Butler (just the contract, obviously no player)
Kenyon Martin,JR Smith
Tayshuan Prince
Shane Battier, Jared Jeffries
Dunleavy
Troy Murphy
Nened Kristic, Mo Petereson
J-rich
Jason Kapano
Dalembert
Reggie Evans
Kirilenko

That's just names with sizable expirings that could help us now. Who do you think we could be looking at if this rumor is true?

I would love to have any of those guys to be honest. Murphy, Prince, JR Smith, J-Rich, and Evans are the most attractive to me.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

I would love to have any of those guys to be honest. Murphy, Prince, JR Smith, J-Rich, and Evans are the most attractive to me.

Prince, Murphy, J-rich, JR Smith, and Kristic would be my favs of the group.

[CatNation]

On RufusOnFire Ourday says MJ has Rod working the phones hard for a fire sale. But the catch is MJ wants to do a fire sale without it being viewed to fans as a fire sale. So maybe guys like Troy Murphy and J-Rich.

yeah he's never been completely full of shit. should I turn on ESPN yet?

[Chef]

if we did get murphy for g-wall (someone's fav trade on here) i won't be pissed UNLESS we don't get at least 1 draft pick for him more like one good one and one of their shitty ones. if we did a straight swap i would be upset.

[ALuhrs704]

ive been wanting jr smith for a while now, espicially now with him being an expiring i think he'd work out well in the silas offense. but we definitely need a BIG to help soften the blow of the tyrus injury. diaw cant play d in the post (even though since oak and silas came he has gotten better). i really just want jax out of here, he only plays hard when he is having a good game. and he takes the WORST shots on the court. i think crash would benifit too, but his effort has been lacking and its really dissapointing to me bcuz he is def my favorite player in the league. i am really impressed with DJ though and jax/wallace getting trade even further cements him being a leader on the team. i almost want to keep diaw, bcuz i think we get way more value next year for him being an expiring (or we just let it play out)

[DY_nasty]

If you love dumb shots, JR is your man

[Fred Williamson]

yeah he's never been completely full of shit. should I turn on ESPN yet?

this. he needs to stfu.

[ALuhrs704]

lol ya i know jr takes dumb shots, but he still wont chuck as many as jax does and he is athletic and can play some defense.

[BRNC]

Part of Karls' problem with JR was not playing "D"...so I"m not sure why it would be better here...I'd pass on him myself....

[BRNC]

I've just had this response from the Bill Ingram chat at HoopsWorld for those interested:


Larry in Blowing Rock, NC:
Good morning Bill...we're starting to hear rumors of "fire sale" in Bobcats land...any truth or just rumors...thanks...
http://www.hoopsworld.com/images/hw_icon.gif
Bill Ingram:
Alright, everyone . . .10-minute drill. I'll try to answer all the remaining questions, but I've turned off the form to submit more.

Larry, that's a good question. The injury to Tyrus Thomas is a huge blow, and the team isn't deep enough to overcome that. So do they cash everything in? I'm hearing they won't. They aren't interested in dealing Stephen Jackson, and teams have been calling for him, or Gerald Wallace, and those are their two biggest trade assets. Paul Silas has those guys believing in themselves again, so maybe things will continue to turn around.

Read more NBA news and insight: http://www.hoopsworld.com/chat.asp?status=&CHAT_TOPICS_ID=1400#ixzz1ByMrutdB

I found it interesting that we're getting calls on Jax but don't want to deal him...that kinda blows the MJ wanting to "fire sale" without the fans knowing...if it had not been the end of the chat I'd have tried to find out what teams are calling on him...oh well...maybe next week...

[ammofan]

I've just had this response from the Bill Ingram chat at HoopsWorld for those interested:


Larry in Blowing Rock, NC:
Good morning Bill...we're starting to hear rumors of "fire sale" in Bobcats land...any truth or just rumors...thanks...
http://www.hoopsworld.com/images/hw_icon.gif
Bill Ingram:
Alright, everyone . . .10-minute drill. I'll try to answer all the remaining questions, but I've turned off the form to submit more.

Larry, that's a good question. The injury to Tyrus Thomas is a huge blow, and the team isn't deep enough to overcome that. So do they cash everything in? I'm hearing they won't. They aren't interested in dealing Stephen Jackson, and teams have been calling for him, or Gerald Wallace, and those are their two biggest trade assets. Paul Silas has those guys believing in themselves again, so maybe things will continue to turn around.

Read more NBA news and insight: http://www.hoopsworld.com/chat.asp?status=&CHAT_TOPICS_ID=1400#ixzz1ByMrutdB

I found it interesting that we're getting calls on Jax but don't want to deal him...that kinda blows the MJ wanting to "fire sale" without the fans knowing...if it had not been the end of the chat I'd have tried to find out what teams are calling on him...oh well...maybe next week...

Come on....what does he know. What do any of us know? I just find it very hard to believe that we arent talking trade.

[SWedd523]

I hold Ingram in much higher regard than most everybody else as far as knowing what's going on behind the doors.




p.s. do you still want to keep the "ammo"fan name? I can change it to TyrusFan or AugustinFan or something if you want.

[ammofan]

I hold Ingram in much higher regard than most everybody else as far as knowing what's going on behind the doors.




p.s. do you still want to keep the "ammo"fan name? I can change it to TyrusFan or AugustinFan or something if you want.

Ammo forver lol....idk

[Proudiddy]

IDK, the fire sale would make sense to most of us... But I've grown pretty tired of the crap they post over at Rufus on Fire. I've never ONCE heard anything they've discussed beforehand come to fruition.

I'm still waiting to turn ESPN on myself.

[ammofan]

A little bit of new info on twitter from Mike Cranston:

"Nothing is imminent. RT @jessediebolt: Any sense that a trade is coming soon?"

"They are talking with lots of teams. Deadline still month away RT @jessediebolt: Well is anything currently being discussed within the team?"

Nothing really new but thought i would post.

I am @jessediebolt btw....follow me!

[Proudiddy]

A little bit of new info on twitter from Mike Cranston:

"Nothing is imminent. RT @jessediebolt: Any sense that a trade is coming soon?"

"They are talking with lots of teams. Deadline still month away RT @jessediebolt: Well is anything currently being discussed within the team?"

Nothing really new but thought i would post.

I am @jessediebolt btw....follow me!

I know we're fans and this is what we do - imagine up and discuss trades/roster moves, but honestly, how many times has any of these places been right that we're seeking info from.

This isn't directed at you ammo, because Cranston is my favorite reporter on the Bobcats and to me, he seems to be the most informed. And he has always responed to my questions, I just think he has a better idea of what's going on than any of the other guys.

That being said, what I'm trying to say is, how often have we known about any of the trades that we've done before they actually happened... Besides ballwhore's posts (The Phoenix trade, DJ to Indy, DJ to LAC), we've never had any idea what our FO was doing until after the fact.

SO, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

[ammofan]

Well we dont have any idea but most of the rumors taht come out are true....they are just old. We didnt have any idea about Tyrus or Theo on deadline day last year.

[Proudiddy]

lol that's my problem though... I want to know BEFORE THE FACT!!!

[BRNC]

AMMO...one of the reasons I like Ingram...minimum BS and if he does not know/not heard he'll say it...if he has heard teams are talking with us about certain players (Jax in this case) but we're not interested in dealing then I believe him...

I just wanted to check out this "MJ in fire sale mode" rumor...I found it hard to believe and Ingram was a guy I thought might know and verify/or shoot it down...IMO he shot it down and I trust that...

[Proudiddy]

AMMO...one of the reasons I like Ingram...minimum BS and if he does not know/not heard he'll say it...if he has heard teams are talking with us about certain players (Jax in this case) but we're not interested in dealing then I believe him...

I just wanted to check out this "MJ in fire sale mode" rumor...I found it hard to believe and Ingram was a guy I thought might know and verify/or shoot it down...IMO he shot it down and I trust that...

As everything that comes from ROF should be. I get so tired of them doing that crap over there, I just stopped checking their site for the most part... They start so much crap over there that never happens and "report" it as fact, it's sickening.

Not trying to bring up "board wars" again like what happened over the summer, but I had let that stuff go and yet they still are stirring up crap over there and serving it up as hope.

[DY_nasty]

My info comes from ballwhore alone. :P

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

I'm very confident we will see a trade by deadline. I think Jackson is likely to be kept. I just think that MJ really likes and values jackson, plus his contract is slightly less and he is the go-to scorer this team needs. Obviously he is not the BEST go-to option ANY team could have, but his value to this team probably could not be matched by any trade. Wallace on the other hand I do think is a guy that MJ would be willing to trade. Just pure speculation, but I would not be surprised at all to see Wallace traded for an expiring contract. It was at least comforting to know that the reason the Wallace to Cavs deal didn't go through was because we were demanding there first round pick for Wallace. Really outside of Jackson and Wallace the only piece I see being moved is Diaw. I don't think MJ will move Nazr unless it's in combination of Diaw/Jackson/Wallace and we get an expiring back along with some type of pick or something. Should be an interesting month, on and off the court. We do poorly on this road trip and it could decide the season.

[DY_nasty]

Remember in the offseason when I said that we should jump at the chance to be able to unload Wallace for 3 mid-late first round picks and everyone said I was crazy? Good times.

[SWedd523]

No I don't remember that.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Hoopsworld has an interesting article up about Wallace going to Houston. I would support that. Houston has a ton of young pieces and some draft picks....we could use any combination of the young players they have. Plus they have a decent expiring in Battier.

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=18563

Wallace for Battier + Patrick Patterson + pick

You think either side would go for that? Patterson would give us a young guy to back-up Diaw, and eventually Thomas in the future. We get a pick, and we get a really solid defender to come off the bench. Plus of course Battier is expiring. I'm not sure what Houston would give up for Wallace though...I would have to assume that wouldn't be asking too much though...

[ammofan]

I could see us trying to do this:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4wkxba3

Hayes, Battier, Jefferies to CHA
Wallace, Diop to HOU

[Chef]

Hoopsworld has an interesting article up about Wallace going to Houston. I would support that. Houston has a ton of young pieces and some draft picks....we could use any combination of the young players they have. Plus they have a decent expiring in Battier.

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=18563

Wallace for Battier + Patrick Patterson + pick

You think either side would go for that? Patterson would give us a young guy to back-up Diaw, and eventually Thomas in the future. We get a pick, and we get a really solid defender to come off the bench. Plus of course Battier is expiring. I'm not sure what Houston would give up for Wallace though...I would have to assume that wouldn't be asking too much though...

be very leery when dealing with houston. we get taken to the woodshed in almost every deal we do and moorey is the absolute toughest gm out there.

[DY_nasty]

No I don't remember that.
Right before the draft when Memphis was talking about unloading their picks

Probably buried under the pages and pages of "draft picks that late are worthless! we can't draft!" etc.

[BobCatsFanInTx]

You mean the wins which we got in spite of them? I mean now-a-days were getting wins where Wallace scores 6 points in 40 minutes and Jakson scores 10 in 40 minutes. Anyone looking at this team can clearly tell these two guys are terrible right now, absolutely terrible and killing the team.

I think it's too important for this franchise and there future to make the playoffs. You don't understand, they are desperate for money. There loosing millions. They need to build a fan base and quick. They cannot afford to miss the playoffs, and miss out on that chance for additional revenue, more notoriety, and more fans. They just can't. Sure you can rebuild now, but another 3 years of loosing and this franchise may not be here anymore. That's just reality. We need to build up a bigger fan base before we can truly tear it all apart. We have to make the playoffs this year, just simply have to. For the future of the franchise.They will lose a lot more money when people realize this team will be rebuiliding in two seasons and the playoffs runs are only good for a couple more years anyway. I think if people know the team will have to rebuild at some point they will be willing and able to watch a young team perform and GIVE THEIR ALL for the two seasons that the team would have made the playoffs "only to get bounced in sweeps". This team as it is may not make the playoffs. If they do make the playoffs will people be all that more interested when their Bobcats make the playoffs in a weaker Eastern Conference? Just what good will the playoffs be if the team is humilliated once again this season as they were last season? I would rather watch young athletic players compete every night than to watch players with talent and veteren know how falter game after game.

I will somewhat disagree with you on Gerald Wallace and Stephen Jackson during most of the teams wins. Gerald Wallace may not be anywhere near his All-Star play of last season but he has not been completely non existent. Stephen Jackson has contributed to losses and wins but let us not act like Stepehen Jackson has not made large contributions on several nights.

Now as far as this loss to the Atlanta Hawks bringing out all the nay sayers and haters it is ridiculous. I am not down on the team. They "all of them" have played much better since Paul Silas came along and have won some games against a few good teams. They beat Chicago twice and even if key players were injured it was still impressive. I will say that I dreaded Gerald Wallace coming back from injury when he did because the team seemed to be building chemistry without him. Gerald Henderson was growing and becoming a much better player as time went on. That said Gerlad Wallace has not been back that long and has lost some of his old "Crash" self since he has been hurt. Still I don't think it is time to panic.

I would like to see this thing blown up but I also feel this team has a chance to make it as high as a sixth seed. If it seems like the team is sliding fast in the standings then by all means I see no reason to keep them together and we should indeed blow it up. If on the other hand there is a way to make us better or have us remain as good while saving some $ we should do so. I am not however advocating a trade unless it looks like this team as constructed will not make the playoffs or they are going to be no more than an 8th seed. If is out of the playoffs going into the trade deadline than by all means they should be blown up and they should look to rebuild. If the team is in the 7th or 8th spot heading into the trade deadline perhaps a trade can take place that gives us the look of a team that can finish with a higher seeding. My prefeered move would be to rebuild though. I think fans are more understanding than you may think. All one has to do is look at the OKC Thunder and their quick rise to contender from the sellar. That does not mean that will happen for the us but it does mean there is precendent for rebuilding.

[rsxnova]

I could see us trying to do this:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4wkxba3

Hayes, Battier, Jefferies to CHA
Wallace, Diop to HOU

There is no way we land the Chuckwagon.

[SWedd523]

Trade 1

Gerald Wallace + Derrick Brown for Shane Battier + Patrick Patterson


Trade 2

Gerald Henderson for Terrence Williams + 2nd Rounder





DJ/Shaun/Tank
Jack/TWill/Hammer
Battier/Dom/Najera
Diaw/Tyrus/Patterson
Kwame/Nazr/Diop



Why?

While Hendo has shown some nice flashes, Terrence is still better, so we upgrade the backup 2 spot (and eventual replacement). Battier is a solid defensive role player and great outside shooter who lets Jack and DJ handle the ball and most shots. If all Crash is going to do is sit in the corner then I'd be more than happy to have Battier do that instead. Patterson for UPS is a wash because neither one is doing anything special, but we need another big so it's a necessary move.

[teej]

I would do both in a heartbeat.

[rsxnova]

Twill would be a must have in a houston deal. Im not sure what happened to him in NJ but i love his potiential.

[Marvel]

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/71319/20110124/cavaliers_unlikely_to_acquire_gerald_wallace/

Write that one off. Geez this isn't good for Wallace's trade value.

[BRNC]

Trade 1

Gerald Wallace + Derrick Brown for Shane Battier + Patrick Patterson


Trade 2

Gerald Henderson for Terrence Williams + 2nd Rounder

Why?

While Hendo has shown some nice flashes, Terrence is still better, so we upgrade the backup 2 spot (and eventual replacement). Battier is a solid defensive role player and great outside shooter who lets Jack and DJ handle the ball and most shots. If all Crash is going to do is sit in the corner then I'd be more than happy to have Battier do that instead. Patterson for UPS is a wash because neither one is doing anything special, but we need another big so it's a necessary move.

SWedd...I actually like this deal but what is the Houston motivation to do it...other than move TWill...?

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/71319/20110124/cavaliers_unlikely_to_acquire_gerald_wallace/

Write that one off. Geez this isn't good for Wallace's trade value.

Also directly negates Bill Ingrim and supports the guy on ROF. At least it's nice to know that we were demanding there first rounder and the cap space. I still think that Wallace's value is MUCH lower than what people think his value is. However, for the Cavs that trade would make almost no sense. Even without the first rounder headed our way included.

[DY_nasty]

Also directly negates Bill Ingrim and supports the guy on ROF. At least it's nice to know that we were demanding there first rounder and the cap space. I still think that Wallace's value is MUCH lower than what people think his value is. However, for the Cavs that trade would make almost no sense. Even without the first rounder headed our way included.
Doesn't negate anything. RealGM's wiretaps are usually poorly dated and poorly sourced - at best... no telling when that information came to light.

[teej]

Doesn't negate anything. RealGM's wiretaps are usually poorly dated and poorly sourced - at best... no telling when that information came to light.

Cranston reported that last week.

[Carolina Swagger]

i like the deal with Chicago. I think that if we can bring some first round picks up it would be great as well.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Which means it could be now, OR it could be late. But seeing as how I also saw that same report on hoopshype and hoopsworld (i believe) I would go on the side of it being current. I think Ingram was misinformed, no way MJ can't be looking to trade either of Wallace or Jackson right now....

[Twan's Kin]

Would you guys do a three-team trade sending Jackson out and getting Jamal Magloire and Carlos Arroyo in return?

[stun704]

Would you guys do a three-team trade sending Jackson out and getting Jamal Magloire and Carlos Arroyo in return?
are u stoned? both of them are shit garbage

[DY_nasty]

Cranston reported that last week.
It took a month to go from "we'll need a first round pick" to "no u"?

[Marvel]

Would you guys do a three-team trade sending Jackson out and getting Jamal Magloire and Carlos Arroyo in return?

Would you do a GTFO.

[WAM9]

Would you guys do a three-team trade sending Jackson out and getting Jamal Magloire and Carlos Arroyo in return?

What else would we get because you must have left something out. No one in their right mind would do this trade in a million years.

[Fred Williamson]

Would you guys do a three-team trade sending Jackson out and getting Jamal Magloire and Carlos Arroyo in return?

http://i52.tinypic.com/1552fsm.jpg

[SWedd523]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2482/3811055786_b51d292cde.jpg

[dav7z]

What do you guys think about

Rip and Daye and a first top 1o protected
Wallace and Carroll

I think Rip just has 1 more year guarnteeded the 2nd year is a dust chip.

Pistons want Rip gone

[BRNC]

Dav...I just checked and it appears two years (after this) are both guaranteed....

Rip also makes more than Crash or Jax so I really don't view him as an "asset" to us unless he brings a quality-young player with him...and we do not have to send said/same back to the Pistons....doubt that happens...

[Chef]

What do you guys think about

Rip and Daye and a first top 1o protected
Wallace and Carroll

I think Rip just has 1 more year guarnteeded the 2nd year is a dust chip.

Pistons want Rip gone

you won't even sniff a 1st with that deal. if rips deal is that good (and by that good i mean not that horrid) he has more value than essentially carroll and a first for him. daye is too valuable for them to just give away.

how about
rip, maxiell and 2012 first for wallace, najera, collins

or (if they value maxiell too much)
rip and 2012 for wallace and carroll

[CrazyCarl139]

I think if Larry Brown was still here, the Bobcats would absolutely be looking to acquire Rip Hamilton, however, with him being gone I'm not so sure that'll happen.

If we do get him, we're doing Detroit a HUGE favor. We would have to get back Daye, Monroe (god, I wish) or a first round pick.

[Boomer]

Can we please not acquire Richard Hamilton? thanks

[ammofan]

I would take Rip here.......You guys do realize that we will be a way better team with anyone other than Gerald because whoever we can acquire that is starter quality can produce more than Wallace.

[Chef]

Can we please not acquire Richard Hamilton? thanks

i agree. my post was assuming he was a DUST type contract. we don't need yet another lifeless contract.

[Weezy21]

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1086647

Bobs trade: Wallace, Henderson, Nazr
Bobs get: Kaman, Mayo, Tony Allen

[ammofan]

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1086647

bobs trade: Wallace, henderson, nazr
bobs get: Kaman, mayo, tony allen

do it now! Fast

[dav7z]

i agree. my post was assuming he was a DUST type contract. we don't need yet another lifeless contract.

I read Rips second year wasn't guarnteeded a while back.
Either way if we could get a first and Rip for Wallace , We not tanking and not taking on long term money.

Salis likes Jax better at the three. Rip could start at the two. All so i think he would help Hendo in a lot of ways with his experiance.

[Chef]

I read Rips second year wasn't guarnteeded a while back.
Either way if we could get a first and Rip for Wallace , We not tanking and not taking on long term money.

Salis likes Jax better at the three. Rip could start at the two. All so i think he would help Hendo in a lot of ways with his experiance.

i hate writing this next phrase because it is a passive aggressive insult in most occasions, but i really do it mean to ask the following question.

have you watched rip this season? he is terrible. and i am not talking about the disgruntled rip of late. the gruntled rip of early season was just atrocious. no legs on his jumpers, 3 pointers sprayed all over the place. he is just bad at this point. i love the fact he doesn't need the ball to do his thing, but he hasn't "done his thing" for 2 years now.

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

Rips contract next year is fully guaranteed, the year after next his contract has 9 million guaranteed, so even that doesn't help you much. I'm not a HUGE Rip fan, but i will say this. As bad as Rip has been, and i agree with everything Chef said, but as bad as he has been, he has still been better than what we have seen from Wallace of late. IF we could dump a contract like Diop and Carroll on them, then I would consider it. But I think there are better options out there. The only reason I would consider it is because I really do think that a change of scenery and a starting role for Rip would do him wonders. I think he could add some much needed shooting to this lineup, and him and Jack could have success. However it does not fix the problem of us having aging guys in which the window is closing and were at best a 7th seed team.

[dav7z]

i hate writing this next phrase because it is a passive aggressive insult in most occasions, but i really do it mean to ask the following question.

have you watched rip this season? he is terrible. and i am not talking about the disgruntled rip of late. the gruntled rip of early season was just atrocious. no legs on his jumpers, 3 pointers sprayed all over the place. he is just bad at this point. i love the fact he doesn't need the ball to do his thing, but he hasn't "done his thing" for 2 years now.

I agree Rip is just servicable. But from what im gathering Walace don't have much value either. Though he is my favorite player . My wife and i sport his number #3 AT EVER GAME. But we are coming to a rebuilding period like it or not . I don;t think any big name free agent is going to sign with us . So the draft is our best shot. The 1st round pick would be the only reason i would consider it at all.

[Chef]

here is a trade that i think allows us to try and rebuild on the fly. it involves us taking on one of the top 4 worst contracts in the league and we don't get rid of diop. i know most of you are going to absolutely hate it. here it goes:

two trades because of rules:
trade 1
out: crash, tyrus, s. collins
in: rashard lewis, 2011 top 5 protected (2012 top 1 protected) and right to switch 2013 picks

trade 2
out: carroll
in: kevin seraphin, josh howard

why: lets jax slide to sf with expiring josh howard backing him up and hendo starting, start lewis or diaw depending on matchup, or slide jax back to sg, lewis at sf and diaw at pf. either way adds versatility. yes we lose tyrus, but as i have said before i hate his contract down the road. we pick up a project pf and at least 1 really good pick that could give us a high pick in a strong 2012 draft. plus, lewis last year is only partially guaranteed up to 17 mil in the last year unless he really over performs which in that case isn't horrible.

why for washington: crash is a great fit with wall and nick young. tyrus adds length and makes blatche really expendable. a front court of crash, tyrus and mcgee is crazy on the shotblocking side. plus it gets them out of a terrible contract.

[CrazyCarl139]

I kind of like that trade.

I feel it will be hard to sign a solid free agent, so who cares if we don't have money. I'm willing to take on bad contracts if we can net a first round pick with it too.

Why not try to acquire Rip Hamilton (and their pick) too then if we are going to add Rashard Lewis. I'd much rather see Henderson come off the bench. A starting five of Kwame, Lewis, Jax, Hamilton, Augustin with Nazr, Diaw, Henderson and Livingston coming off the bench should be able to get us in the playoffs and maybe we could have 3 first round picks...

[Chef]

I kind of like that trade.

I feel it will be hard to sign a solid free agent, so who cares if we don't have money. I'm willing to take on bad contracts if we can net a first round pick with it too.

Why not try to acquire Rip Hamilton (and their pick) too then if we are going to add Rashard Lewis. I'd much rather see Henderson come off the bench. A starting five of Kwame, Lewis, Jax, Hamilton, Augustin with Nazr, Diaw, Henderson and Livingston coming off the bench should be able to get us in the playoffs and maybe we could have 3 first round picks...

i see diop is missing from the line up but don't see anything else for rip. it would have to be jax or diaw + diop for rip. it won't be jax. detroit can't bring in jax for brawl related reasons. can't aggrevate the lower bowl STH PTSD. i think if diop goes to detroit for rip no pick would come back, that is an either or. i definitely wouldn't want a diaw for rip deal because of diaw's current value to the team and his value next year as a 9 mil expiring.

[CrazyCarl139]

I really think Detroit would trade Rip for a 2nd round pick at this point. The only problem would be giving Detroit back 12.5 million in salary. We could give them Najera, Diop and Carroll plus a future 2nd rd pick in exchange for Rip and a protected 1st rounder...

I don't know if this is realistic, just thinking aloud

[ALuhrs704]

i want no part of rashard lewis...... or rip. stop trying so hard to get gerald out of town. and i know silas likes jackson because he creates his own shot, but he creates bad shots..... we need to build around tyrus and dj though

[GoBobs]

What would you guys think about Stephen Jackson for Carl Landry straight up? We save a little money, clear some more minutes for Hendo and get help at PF with TT out.

[WrxErik]

I swear some of you must get high and drunk then come up with these trade ideas.

[Chef]

i want no part of rashard lewis...... or rip. stop trying so hard to get gerald out of town. and i know silas likes jackson because he creates his own shot, but he creates bad shots..... we need to build around tyrus and dj though

i'm not trying so hard to get him out of town. i am just making conversation with do-able trades. on second thought, i don't think the wiz would want tyrus for the same reasons i don't want him. but they would do a crash and boris deal to save money. if we got a top 5 out of it, i would definitely do it. i think lewis is a better fit for our team assuming we don't get rid of jax. for the record, i would take crash all day and night over jax.

[spectre]

i want no part of rashard lewis...... or rip. stop trying so hard to get gerald out of town. and i know silas likes jackson because he creates his own shot, but he creates bad shots.....

Ditto that.

Don't see Jordan taking any of those high dollar guys. Salary is going to play a part in whatever we do unlike in years past IMO.


What would you guys think about Stephen Jackson for Carl Landry straight up? We save a little money, clear some more minutes for Hendo and get help at PF with TT out.

All day long. What's their incentive tho? I've not followed SAC, but I thought the question in their back court was can Reke be a PG or is he really an off guard? Since they've leaned more towards playing Udrih with him I think they're going with the latter.

Besides...Jax for a quality player who's also an expiring? Don't see it happening.


I swear some of you must get high and drunk then come up with these trade ideas.

You mean there's another way?

[WrxErik]

Who are you going to take with a top 5 pick? There are no real superstar talents in College right now. I have a feeling there won't really be next year either.

[WrxErik]

Oh and also I would have liked to see us try and bring T-Mac here in the off season. I think he is making Vet min and he would have been solid off the bench for us at either the 2 or 3. I always like cheap players with a lot of experience. That is why I liked the Kwame signing.

[Chef]

Ditto that.

Don't see Jordan taking any of those high dollar guys. Salary is going to play a part in whatever we do unlike in years past IMO.


if we did do my trade we would be paying crash and thomas 18 mil next year and 19.5 mil in 2012-13. we would pay lewis 22 mil next year and between 10-17 mil in 2012-13. so it is really 6 mil difference which we lose most of by dealing carroll in the second trade. and we don't have to pay tyrus 19 million in the 13-15 seasons. plus we get a top 5 pick out of it and lewis compliments our team better if we are keeping jax. if i am jordan, i am not dismissing that right off. not saying i would do it but i am not just throwing it out without a second look.

[Chef]

Who are you going to take with a top 5 pick? There are no real superstar talents in College right now. I have a feeling there won't really be next year either.

kyrie, austin rivers, trade it, i don't care it gives two things 1. a future 2. options. we have neither right now.

[BRNC]

Chef...I'm not convinced a top 5 is worth much this draft...the owners and players are gearing towards a lock-out so what's the point...and if that indeed happens (lock-out) a top 5 will be like the dust-chip...attractive on the surface but not really worth much...

If we end up trading Crash or Jax I'd rather bring back a player/pick combo that helps us now...I'm not against getting a 1st in the next draft but IMO the #15 could be as valuable as the #5....I'm more for a young player that frees Hendo to play now so we (and the FO) can see if he has a future here and it also gives us a clue to team needs going forward...

I've never really cared when people take the opportunity to take "cheap shots" or personal attacks we are starting to come up with some fairly unrealistic trade ideas in the thread...we've heard of no "major" interest concerning any of our players outside of a possible salary dump with the Mavs/Jax/Butler...and a couple of sources have indicated that we're turning down teams that are calling to get a better idea of what the team can do with Silas at the helm...

IMO if we do something it will be later (closer to the dead-line) rather than sooner...

[Absinthe]

Kyrie Irving is legit. He'll be ten times the player Wall ever will be. And in his rookie season, too.

I'd rather go forward with DJ and Kwame rather than DJ and Thomas. Tyrus Thomas has problems mentally off and on the court. There's a reason why Chicago didn't want to develop him. He's athletic, but a complete idiot. Kwame is cheaper, too.

[BRNC]

It's doubtful Irving will make himself eligible...and no way if there is a lock-out...but I'd like to see us get him whenever he is available...

[Absinthe]

It's doubtful Irving will make himself eligible...and no way if there is a lock-out...but I'd like to see us get him whenever he is available...

Absolutely. I'm just saying that is is 100% legit and he could potentially be an NBA all star.

[Chef]

Chef...I'm not convinced a top 5 is worth much this draft...the owners and players are gearing towards a lock-out so what's the point...and if that indeed happens (lock-out) a top 5 will be like the dust-chip...attractive on the surface but not really worth much...

If we end up trading Crash or Jax I'd rather bring back a player/pick combo that helps us now...I'm not against getting a 1st in the next draft but IMO the #15 could be as valuable as the #5....I'm more for a young player that frees Hendo to play now so we (and the FO) can see if he has a future here and it also gives us a clue to team needs going forward...

I've never really cared when people take the opportunity to take "cheap shots" or personal attacks we are starting to come up with some fairly unrealistic trade ideas in the thread...we've heard of no "major" interest concerning any of our players outside of a possible salary dump with the Mavs/Jax/Butler...and a couple of sources have indicated that we're turning down teams that are calling to get a better idea of what the team can do with Silas at the helm...

IMO if we do something it will be later (closer to the dead-line) rather than sooner...

all good points. i agree our deals will be closer or at the deadline. for once i am glad to hear we are turning teams down. they are probably trying to low ball us anyway. it would be nice to adopt a hold or wait for good offers approach. it is times when we don't hear anything (buzz wise) that we actually do make moves. just out of curiosity, on a scale of 1-10 (10 being most) how unrealistic is the lewis trade?

[Weezy21]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4qhuq27

Bobcats trade:Wallace, Diaw, D Brown
Bobcats get: Josh Smith, Dorell Wright, Dan Gadzuric

Can you imagine how awesome it will be when we get tyrus back?? haha

[SCBobcat]

just out of curiosity, on a scale of 1-10 (10 being most) how unrealistic is the lewis trade?

I like that you are thinking and I even like that it is possible for Rashard to equal savings (never thought that would be possible). However, Tyrus is BYC, so remember he counts half salary and full salary at the same time and with both teams being over the cap it just wouldn't work without more salary/players being swapped.

[Chef]

I like that you are thinking and I even like that it is possible for Rashard to equal savings (never thought that would be possible). However, Tyrus is BYC, so remember he counts half salary and full salary at the same time and with both teams being over the cap it just wouldn't work without more salary/players being swapped.

it works in the trade machine. i just didn't add the links.

[BRNC]

Chef...my comment on "unrealistic" really did not apply to your proposal...but IMO not sure how motivated the Wizards would be to move their pick...they seem (again IMO) more inclined to go young at this point...but for my part Hinrich is the only vet I'd be interested acquiring from the Wizards...

[Absinthe]

Captain Jackass must be traded. He is a blackhole on offense and a cancer to the team. He's the type of player that flourishes around a lot of talent, but I would never want him being a number one option on any team.

[stun704]

Captain Jackass must be traded. He is a blackhole on offense and a cancer to the team. He's the type of player that flourishes around a lot of talent, but I would never want him being a number one option on any team.

I dunno bout Cancer, but hes def a Jack ass, I actually think hes good for team chemistry. say what you want, dude is an alpha dog, and is sort of a "big brother" to the other players in the team

[DJ_2_Hendo_4theWIN]

I think MJ is really fond of Jack. If MJ has any say in it, which obviously he would, Jack would be the last one to be traded. Just the feeling I get. IF Jack and Wallace can play like they have of late, then we will be perfectly fine. And I agree, I think Jack is good for chemistry. He is by far the best leader we have, Wallace is not a leader at all.

[teej]

I think MJ is really fond of Jack. If MJ has any say in it, which obviously he would, Jack would be the last one to be traded. Just the feeling I get. IF Jack and Wallace can play like they have of late, then we will be perfectly fine. And I agree, I think Jack is good for chemistry. He is by far the best leader we have, Wallace is not a leader at all.

Co-sign with this whole post. Part of Jack's antics that drive you all up a wall is what makes his teammates love him. Tim Duncan called him the "best teammate" for a reason.

[Chef]

Co-sign with this whole post. Part of Jack's antics that drive you all up a wall is what makes his teammates love him. Tim Duncan called him the "best teammate" for a reason.

i also agree but if we are going to keep him and obviously play him as the first option he needs to be corralled or at the very least punished for hurting the team with his poor decisions and play. case in point, the pass out of bounds to obviously covered gerald wallace cutting back door followed by not one but two attempted behind the back post entry passes on the same possession.

[davcbow]

I say dont trade no one and lets just play some basketball... :)

[TheLegend]

Danny Granger is on the trade block. I would love to try and trade him with Jack but I don't know how the Pacers will feel about that.

[Chef]

Danny Granger is on the trade block. I would love to try and trade him with Jack but I don't know how the Pacers will feel about that.

they would feel like you slept with their mother if you insulted them like that.

[ziggy]

they would feel like you slept with their mother if you insulted them like that.

But what if their mother is really hot? :g:

[Weezy21]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6ahatua

Wallace/Brown for Battier/Hill

Gives us another young big man to fill in for tyrus...moves gerald's contract for an expiring in Battier who can still help us out this year and is a good leader...i know we are on a roll right now, but looking forward to future, this could be a great move...this allows diaw to become more expendable as well

New Line-Up
C-Kwame/Naz
PF-Diaw/Tyrus/Hill
SF-Jack/Battier
SG-Hendo
PG-DJ/Liv

OR

C-Kwame/Naz
PF-Diaw/Tyrus/Hill
SF-Battier
SG-JAck/Hendo
PG-DJ/Liv

[teej]

Yes please. Houston would never do that though.

[Talent]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6ahatua

Wallace/Brown for Battier/Hill

Gives us another young big man to fill in for tyrus...moves gerald's contract for an expiring in Battier who can still help us out this year and is a good leader...i know we are on a roll right now, but looking forward to future, this could be a great move...this allows diaw to become more expendable as well

New Line-Up
C-Kwame/Naz
PF-Diaw/Tyrus/Hill
SF-Jack/Battier
SG-Hendo
PG-DJ/Liv

OR

C-Kwame/Naz
PF-Diaw/Tyrus/Hill
SF-Battier
SG-JAck/Hendo
PG-DJ/Liv

I like the trade, but it leaves us thin at the 3. I would still do this trade though, not sure Houston would.

[Weezy21]

I like the trade, but it leaves us thin at the 3. I would still do this trade though, not sure Houston would.

Once Tyrus comes back, we could start him at PF and move Diaw to SF, with Battier coming off the bench...we wouldnt be too thin at SF...Jack, Diaw, Battier, McGuire...the same as we would be if we had Wallace

[Weezy21]

Yes please. Houston would never do that though.

people on RealGM are saying we should ask for a 1st or courtney lee as well...i would love to add Lee to the trade...then you have Henderson/Lee at SG and Jack/Battier at SF...MJ i hope ur reading!

[rsxnova]

people on RealGM are saying we should ask for a 1st or courtney lee as well...i would love to add Lee to the trade...then you have Henderson/Lee at SG and Jack/Battier at SF...MJ i hope ur reading!

Or maybe TWill!