View Full Version : i think it is time for us to consider moving dj
i usually resist the flavor of the week trades that flood these threads, as evidenced by my consistency from month to month on my overall opinions of this team, but due to the most recent slump it is time to think about shopping dj. perhaps using him to unload diop or just getting back someone like jason thompson or a mid-first.
the reason i say this is because i think he has shown that he is very inconsistent and extremely susceptible to hot/cold streaks. this is great for a 6th man but we can't have that at the starting point guard. when he is hot, he is great but not great enough to endure his disappearing act when he is not. i love his play when he is hot and i absolutely love his production/salary ratio, but i think if we could get a team in need of his play to take on diop, it is time to pull that trigger.
Chef...not sure what value he would have "while cold"...and there is realistic concern about Livingston and his knees...I'd like to have Jason but we could also put ourselves in a hole at PG if Livingston went down with his knees...
GoBobs
02-12-2011, 10:42 PM
I am pretty much committed to moving DJ. He is never going to be great on D and I agree he is too streaky on the other end. I don't want to give him a big contract and I don't want to see him leave for nothing so trade is the best option. I would try and target maybe Ty Lawson, Darren Collison, or Devin Harris. I would also do a deal for Nash if I thought a lockout was coming next year because I would want to maximize the basketball we have left from a selfish perspective. Nash is a better DJ that also sets up everyone else and doesn't go into slumps.
G Wuh Wuh Wuh Wallace
02-13-2011, 12:44 PM
Completely agree.... watching DJ this week and throughout the season I never see him stepping up the way we need him to for this team. If we can dump him for a good return I am all for it. He would be a valuable piece to include in a gerald/jax/ or Boris trade that could actually bring us back some young talent. Realistically I think DJ's stock would be higher than some of our veteran guys like Jax/Gerald anyways because he is young. I am just worried about livingston starting, we would need to pick up another decent point guard for sure if we get rid of DJ. Livingston has been great as of late but i don't see the offense running as well with him in starter minutes every night, plus the knee.....
Chef...not sure what value he would have "while cold"...and there is realistic concern about Livingston and his knees...I'd like to have Jason but we could also put ourselves in a hole at PG if Livingston went down with his knees...
i don't think gm's fly the same way as fans as far as hot and cold. they tend to look at body of work and i am sure most see him as a 6th man and excellent back up pg who could also fill in as a starter. i am also cautious about liv's knees and see him as a back up also (unless he could prove healthy knees because he is a perfect point guard as far as getting the ball to players when and where they need it as well as picking his spots for shots and posts). i am sure could do a combination of moves that would get us back a starting caliber point. i like beno udrich but i know most on here are vehemently against him because of his contract.
Chef...you touched on my problem with our PG situation as it stands...I view us as having two capable/very good back-up PGs but no starter...and it is a sound argument about GMs and their view...but this years trades (lack of) strike as "no one wanting to pull the trigger" or "waiting to see what happens with Melo" or "we're terrified about the CBA so we don't know what to do"...or a combo of all three...
I'm not sure we'll see much activity this time...
Chef...you touched on my problem with our PG situation as it stands...I view us as having two capable/very good back-up PGs but no starter...and it is a sound argument about GMs and their view...but this years trades (lack of) strike as "no one wanting to pull the trigger" or "waiting to see what happens with Melo" or "we're terrified about the CBA so we don't know what to do"...or a combo of all three...
I'm not sure we'll see much activity this time...
as soon as it is clear that melo will be moved (he is traded to nets or knicks) or won't be, the rest of the teams will trade. dj is the perfect trade candidate this year because of his contract situation. i think we see chicago, dallas, memphis, atlanta, pacers, maybe lakers, magic and okc making deals this year. i don't think there will be any blockbuster type trades outside of melo ie nash, iggy staying put but there will be alot of solidifying rotations type trades which is good for us because all of our team are rotation type guys outside of jax and crash.
I agree chef...I think there will be small moves but because of the CBA I doubt they'll be anything like the moves made in years past...but certainly (as you mentioned) I expect some of the playoff teams to make moves...
BlockParty
02-13-2011, 10:17 PM
The value we would receive for DJ is still significantly less than what he's worth to the Cats while he's on his rookie contract. With DJ's recent slump there are number of unanswered questions with regards to what his NBA fate will be. Let's face it, it has been 2 years since he showed he is an effective 'off the bench' player, which is what he would be if he was traded this late in the season (barring a season ending injury for the PG of a playoff team).
His recent slump is due to one of 2 things (injury-saw the other thread and I really doubt this IF DJ has been honest with the medical staff-xray's and broken bones are easy to identify to the untrained eye) and/or opposing NBA teams have shown an ability to play him differently. Either way, it's time for DJ to step up, if you have a stress reaction, you should've come clean with the medical staff and started a rehab routine already. If you are frustrated with how other teams are defending you, talk to your coaches. From what multiple reports have shown, Stephen Silas is incredibly effective in helping undersized guards with their offensive game (see Steph Curry and Monta Ellis).
He's already used up the "coach is killing my mojo" excuse with Larry Brown, he's shown his ability to be incredibly effective under a Silas run team, so his decline is either because of injury or not having a winner's heart. My hope is...it's just a shooter's slump, but it's time to break-out of it and bounce back to 15 ppg and 8 assists with 3 or less turnovers.
SWedd523
02-14-2011, 09:17 AM
First Crash is a shell of himself and will never regain his all-star form and needs to be traded.
Then, Jack is crazy and a chucker and destroys all ball movement and needs to be traded.
Now, DJ is too streaky and doesn't play good defense so he needs to be moved.
Knee, meet jerk.
TheLegend
02-14-2011, 09:33 AM
I don't think we should move DJ. I thought that he hurt his wrist that's why he wasn't playing well.
First Crash is a shell of himself and will never regain his all-star form and needs to be traded.
Then, Jack is crazy and a chucker and destroys all ball movement and needs to be traded.
Now, DJ is too streaky and doesn't play good defense so he needs to be moved.
Knee, meet jerk.
i have said none of those things that absolutely. i have maintained all season that jax and wallace don't play well together and we should move one or the other and if it were my decision it would be jax. i have said we should consider moving everyone and rebuilding. i have never said crash is over the hill. my initial post for the thread specifically spells out why i don't think he will be the future starting point for this team based on our needs and we should CONSIDER moving him IF the offers we got were worthy. very much not a knee jerk reaction. also, i wrote this before ballwhore mentioned his injury so that could explain alot of his performance issues, but the fact that livingston can come in and substitute very nicely does not speak too highly of dj's overall impact as a starting point guard for us.
SWedd523
02-14-2011, 09:55 AM
I didn't quote you directly, chef. This thread is two pages thick already on "I agree" posts. The same people who agreed with the quotes in my above post.
I didn't quote you directly, chef. This thread is two pages thick already on "I agree" posts. The same people who agreed with the quotes in my above post.
i am just overly defensive today. i am also bloated. i could be menstruating.
spectre
02-14-2011, 12:54 PM
I agree.
Seriously...Jordan is dumber than I thought if he doesn't consider moving ANYONE if the price is right.
On a side note...if DJ has a sprained/possibly broken hand why would Silas call him out or "put him on notice"?
Edit:
I guess Silas is an idiot:
D.J. Augustin (hand) likely out on Monday (http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/33060715/ns/sports-player_news/)
spectre...unless DJ (for some unknown reason) was keeping this from the staff...agree it does not make sense but glad it is finally coming to be known...
stun704
02-15-2011, 05:38 AM
God reactionary threads FTL, remember when everyone wanted to trade crash??? HE was INJURED, SO IS DJ, NBA Players just don't lose their talent for no reasons, USUALLY its an injury that is effecting their game, LET DJ HEAL, before u advocate trading him, we aren't gonna find a better PG then him on a rookie contract, horrible thread.
stun704
02-15-2011, 05:41 AM
i have said none of those things that absolutely. i have maintained all season that jax and wallace don't play well together and we should move one or the other and if it were my decision it would be jax. i have said we should consider moving everyone and rebuilding. i have never said crash is over the hill. my initial post for the thread specifically spells out why i don't think he will be the future starting point for this team based on our needs and we should CONSIDER moving him IF the offers we got were worthy. very much not a knee jerk reaction. also, i wrote this before ballwhore mentioned his injury so that could explain alot of his performance issues, but the fact that livingston can come in and substitute very nicely does not speak too highly of dj's overall impact as a starting point guard for us. do you even watch the games? Livingston will only be a good back up pointguard unless he learns to distribute the ball better.. when hes on the court he looks for his shot FIRST and everybody else 2nd, and by 2nd i mean A FAR behind 2nd, thats not a starting PG we need. DJ is fine. So Liv, has one 20 point scoring game, and we are ready to crown DJ replaceable, reactionary threads FTL. When Liv has one game with 10 assists or more then we can talk.
do you even watch the games? Livingston will only be a good back up pointguard unless he learns to distribute the ball better.. when hes on the court he looks for his shot FIRST and everybody else 2nd, and by 2nd i mean A FAR behind 2nd, thats not a starting PG we need. DJ is fine. So Liv, has one 20 point scoring game, and we are ready to crown DJ replaceable, reactionary threads FTL. When Liv has one game with 10 assists or more then we can talk.
yup, you got me. i have been posting away on here just trying to convince you, stun, that i am one of the cool kids. looks like the schtick is up for me thanks to some great insight on your part. obviously you have not actually read the posts i have been contributing to this site. at no point did i say liv can be a starting point guard for us right now. i seem to remember a healthy livingston tearing it up in LA pre-knee injury and not as a score first point guard, but i may not have been watching games then either, so i am not sure. also pretty sure that if i were a coach and my 6'7" point guard with a great turn around post jumper had a man 5" shorter guarding him i would be telling him to back him down into the post and score all day, but that is just me. and if i did have any basketball knowledge (good thing that myth has been exposed by you) i would probably argue that an injury does take away athleticism and forces some minor changes to your game but doesn't turn a good point guard into a score first chucker.
and as far as i have been concerned for the past two years, DJ has never had the "replaceable" crown removed from his head.
SWedd523
02-15-2011, 10:48 AM
Stun, we know you love DJ to a fault, but there's no need to make the "Do you watch the games argument". People wouldn't be here if they didn't.
Jets, cool them.
stun704
02-15-2011, 04:33 PM
Stun, we know you love DJ to a fault, but there's no need to make the "Do you watch the games argument". People wouldn't be here if they didn't.
Jets, cool them.
I apologize for getting pissy, but i don't agree with the premise of the thread, for DJ's contract we have a steal, we aren't gonna find a better player on a rookie contract, point blank period.
SWedd523
02-15-2011, 04:40 PM
I said as much in my first post in the thread. I just don't want the thread to get turned into a pissing match. The knee-jerk reactionary trade him threads do go too far, but for the sake of discussion, we allow them. The only thing I can say is make your counter-point with some good evidence (there is plenty of it) and prove to them that DJ is a high value player instead of going at the poster.
I apologize for getting pissy, but i don't agree with the premise of the thread, for DJ's contract we have a steal, we aren't gonna find a better player on a rookie contract, point blank period.
very good point and i agree completely. but what i said in the OP was if we moving him got us rid of diop and got something of value back like jason thompson, i would consider it given his shaky play. of course, this was posted before i knew he had the injured wrist. even so, i don't think i would want to commit to dj long term.
ALuhrs704
02-16-2011, 12:20 PM
if livingston stays healthy, id be willing to trade DJ regardless if he was playing as good as he was earlier in the yr when silas first took over or bad. livingston is a matchup nightmare at the point and has the best mid range jumper on the team. and he makes up his speed differential with his size. i wouldnt trade DJ unless we did get someone like jason thompson or along those lines though and we'd definitely need to find a backup pg to livingston. i doubt he gets traded though, mj loves him too much. and i wont be mad if he does or doesnt i just dont see him being a top 10-15 pg in the league.
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