Philadelphia/others providing a model for Bobcat winning?

[Veteran_Picksetter]

There has been talk that a star player will never voluntarily come to Charlotte...and that stars will only choose to team with other stars, helping the rich get richer while many small market teams suffer.

But perhaps some teams are showing us another way.

The highest-scoring starter in Philly averages only 13.9 points a game. Yet they stand at 18-7, thanks in large part to excellent overall defense. Louis Williams leads them in scoring off the bench with 15.5 ppg.

Indiana is 16-7 with a leading scorer(Granger) at 18.2. Roy Hibbert follows at 13.7 ppg.

Then you have Denver at 15-10 with leading scorers at 17 and 15.5 points per game.

Yes, it is early in the season, and perhaps in due time the star system will prevail once again.

But these teams are showing us that we can put together a team of merely "good" players with the right chemistry and get back to winning at the Cable Box again.....

[DY_nasty]

Those teams all have talent.

We can't even put together a solid starting lineup

[Veteran_Picksetter]

Those teams all have talent.

We can't even put together a solid starting lineup

We DID. We just dismantled it. And we can again.

[Chef]

There has been talk that a star player will never voluntarily come to Charlotte...and that stars will only choose to team with other stars, helping the rich get richer while many small market teams suffer.

But perhaps some teams are showing us another way.

The highest-scoring starter in Philly averages only 13.9 points a game. Yet they stand at 18-7, thanks in large part to excellent overall defense. Louis Williams leads them in scoring off the bench with 15.5 ppg.

Indiana is 16-7 with a leading scorer(Granger) at 18.2. Roy Hibbert follows at 13.7 ppg.

Then you have Denver at 15-10 with leading scorers at 17 and 15.5 points per game.

Yes, it is early in the season, and perhaps in due time the star system will prevail once again.

But these teams are showing us that we can put together a team of merely "good" players with the right chemistry and get back to winning at the Cable Box again.....

teams like these usually do well in the regular season when defense isn't as intense and the stakes are lower, but when the pressure and intensity ratchets up in the playoffs they can't hang. this season is also unique in that each of the three teams you mentioned aren't crazy talented but are crazy deep. this is huge with the compressed season.

they all also have an all star on the team (granger, iggy, nene), a few potential all stars (lawson, gallinari, paul george, etc) and bunch of other talented guys, but i would not bet on them winning it all or even making it past the second round of the playoffs. of course that is infinitely better than winning 8 games total.

[spectre]

We DID. We just dismantled it. And we can again.

I was going to point to our 2009/2010 squad, but then I got to looking into Philly's salary situation. I know they're around halfway between the cap & the LT...are they losing money? Can their owner afford it? How soon will Holliday be up for an extension? Do they have an equal number of expirings to account for the future increase in salary?

I'd almost think that Philly was the model we were following before we decided to blow it up.

[bes628]

The "Philly Model" is the only way we're gonna get good.

[Toocool]

Indy has Granger and Hibbert.
Granger is a great scorer, and Hibbert has improved each year he's been in the league.

Denver has Nene and Lawson (and the Birdman)
Nene is a beast, and Lawson has improved tremendously.

Philly has some great young pieces (inc. #2 pick Turner who hasn't had the impact they had probably hoped for).
Brand, although old can also still score in the post. And they have players that can put points on the board.

[Veteran_Picksetter]

teams like these usually do well in the regular season when defense isn't as intense and the stakes are lower, but when the pressure and intensity ratchets up in the playoffs they can't hang. this season is also unique in that each of the three teams you mentioned aren't crazy talented but are crazy deep. this is huge with the compressed season.

they all also have an all star on the team (granger, iggy, nene), a few potential all stars (lawson, gallinari, paul george, etc) and bunch of other talented guys, but i would not bet on them winning it all or even making it past the second round of the playoffs. of course that is infinitely better than winning 8 games total.

I hear ya on most of that, BUT:

Nene has never averaged more than 14.6 points a game or double-digit rebounds. If he ever made the all-star team it must have been a weak year at his position.

Iggy is not even close to putting up all-star numbers at this point.

Granger is good, but the point is he's not a superstar.

[superb1]

I thought we were following a Seattle/Okla City model. I would rather us model ourselves after them.

Oklahoma City 19 5 .792 Present two 20+ stars
Oklahoma City 55 27 .671 10/11
Oklahoma City 50 32 .610 09/10
Oklahoma City 23 59 .280 08/09 Russell Westbrook rookie year
Oklahoma City 20 62 .244 07/08 Kevin Durant era
Oklahoma City 31 51 .378 06/07 last season of Ray Allen
Oklahoma City 35 47 .427
Oklahoma City 52 30 .634
Oklahoma City 37 45 .451
Oklahoma City 40 42 .488 02/03 Ray Allen era
Oklahoma City 45 37 .549 01/02 Vin Baker and Gary Payton

This is just an illustration of the Seattle/Okla City history for the last 10 yrs. After reaching the height, they blew up their team and sucked a few years before present leading the West. Now saying our path will be the same but I like what they did do there.

I cut and pasted, so ESPN did not acct for the Seattle name

[Veteran_Picksetter]

Indy has Granger and Hibbert.
Granger is a great scorer, and Hibbert has improved each year he's been in the league.

Denver has Nene and Lawson (and the Birdman)
Nene is a beast, and Lawson has improved tremendously.

Philly has some great young pieces (inc. #2 pick Turner who hasn't had the impact they had probably hoped for).
Brand, although old can also still score in the post. And they have players that can put points on the board.

Yeah, they have GOOD(but not awesome) players, and they are winning. Hopefully we will be able to have that caliber of talent someday. Kemba or Gerald could still get there. Biyombo could get there as an all-defensive type. And if we actually get a future star in the draft, even better! At the very least, Davis, Barnes, and Drummond should be "almost all-star" players at some point.....barring unforeseen circumstances.

[Veteran_Picksetter]

I thought we were following a Seattle/Okla City model. I would rather us model ourselves after them.

Oklahoma City 19 5 .792 Present two 20+ stars
Oklahoma City 55 27 .671 10/11
Oklahoma City 50 32 .610 09/10
Oklahoma City 23 59 .280 08/09 Russell Westbrook rookie year
Oklahoma City 20 62 .244 07/08 Kevin Durant era
Oklahoma City 31 51 .378 06/07 last season of Ray Allen
Oklahoma City 35 47 .427
Oklahoma City 52 30 .634
Oklahoma City 37 45 .451
Oklahoma City 40 42 .488 02/03 Ray Allen era
Oklahoma City 45 37 .549 01/02 Vin Baker and Gary Payton

This is just an illustration of the Seattle/Okla City history for the last 10 yrs. After reaching the height, they blew up their team and sucked a few years before present leading the West. Now saying our path will be the same but I like what they did do there.

I cut and pasted, so ESPN did not acct for the Seattle name



Everything at OKC hinges on the fact that the greatest scorer of our generation fell into their laps at #2. If Portland had taken Durant, no one would be talking about OKC right now. In addition to being smart, they were extremely lucky.

Following the OKC "model" sounds especially great for us if there is a Kevin Durant or equal talent on the horizon. Anybody know of any Kevin Durants set to appear in any nba draft anytime soon??

Note: Edited it a bit to tone down my attitude. Sorry.

[Veteran_Picksetter]

I like what Dell and Steve pointed out about Philly when they destroyed us. They showed tremendous overall quickness on the defensive end. They didn't get much worse when they went to their bench.

Perhaps, as a small market team, we can collect a group of players who excel in underrated, complimentary ways.....instead of grabbing high profile, high-scoring stars who command the millions and don't want to be here anyway.

[Mustachio]

I reject the idea that Charlotte can't get a star player.

[Chef]

I hear ya on most of that, BUT:

Nene has never averaged more than 14.6 points a game or double-digit rebounds. If he ever made the all-star team it must have been a weak year at his position.

Iggy is not even close to putting up all-star numbers at this point.

Granger is good, but the point is he's not a superstar.

all three would be better than the best bobcat at the position with the exception that iggy MAY not be as a good as gerald wallace. point is they are players, but i get your point.

philly just got dusted by miami in what was billed as a meaningful game for both teams. denver has lost 5 out of their last 6 after they started getting "this team is good" consideration and looking at their schedule have benefited from a rather easy beginning. indy's losses miami, phil, sac, orl x2, bos. but they do have some quality wins bos, dal, atl, orl, lakers.

it will be interesting to see especially with the tight schedule how these teams fair as the season goes on.

[dav7z]

Yeah, they have GOOD(but not awesome) players, and they are winning. Hopefully we will be able to have that caliber of talent someday. Kemba or Gerald could still get there. Biyombo could get there as an all-defensive type. And if we actually get a future star in the draft, even better! At the very least, Davis, Barnes, and Drummond should be "almost all-star" players at some point.....barring unforeseen circumstances.

Like ive said befor, add a quility free agent and a top three pick and let the chemristy and draft picks build from thair. This team is much closer than most think .

Just all stars by its self doesn't seem to be the forumla , Time and chemristy seem to be more important, Look at NY its starting to look like a big cluster . Would three good players be as much value to the Heat as Bosh? I think one or two stars are great but you still need good role players to fillin the gaps. Is it any truth to ,Two much talent for just one ball?

[Veteran_Picksetter]

all three would be better than the best bobcat at the position with the exception that iggy MAY not be as a good as gerald wallace. point is they are players, but i get your point.

philly just got dusted by miami in what was billed as a meaningful game for both teams. denver has lost 5 out of their last 6 after they started getting "this team is good" consideration and looking at their schedule have benefited from a rather easy beginning. indy's losses miami, phil, sac, orl x2, bos. but they do have some quality wins bos, dal, atl, orl, lakers.

it will be interesting to see especially with the tight schedule how these teams fair as the season goes on.

Yes, it will definitely be interesting.

[ND22]

I reject the idea that Charlotte can't get a star player.

Only through the draft.