PG Situation???

[ALong13]

Hey guys, haven't heard anything of McInnis lately, and Charlotte Observer has pulled it off the main page for the Bobcats, does anyone know if negotiations are still going on? Also What about John Lucas from Houston as a back-up? Houston is trying to trade him, and we shouldn't have to give up much...

Just wanted to know if you guys had heard anything more on the Bobcats PG situation for those who live near Charlotte or whatever...

[ziggy]

I haven't heard a peep on the PG situation, If anyone else has any info on Mcinnis or any other point that they may be negotiating with, it would be greatly appreciated.

[ALong13]

Any check at n Stoudamire out of Memphis, he wants wants out...or is he going to cost too much?

http://www.memphisflyer.com/memphis/Content?oid=oid%3A32428

[dav7z]

Any check at n Stoudamire out of Memphis, he wants wants out...or is he going to cost too much?

http://www.memphisflyer.com/memphis/Content?oid=oid%3A32428



I think he would cost way to much to play point for us . Any way he wants to go to a cotender.This years Bobcats dont say a thing til they do it . No talk or rumors at all.The pickins are geting slim .
Right now Jeff dont look that bad nither does D.Anderson

We might wait til training camp to fill the roster this year. It kinda looks that way now. I look for us to invite Bobby Brown and Dee Brown if he dont get signed. With two roster spots open camp should atract some good talent...

[Slam]

Will Conroy was just waived by the Clipps (they have Sam, BK, Diaz, Jordan and Livingston so another PG wouldn't make sense).

He had a great season in the D last season - maybe he is another Hammer in the making?

I'd like to add him or Dee Brown while bringing back DA to mentor them on the court along with Rose off the court.

[spectre]

Looks like we want a cheap vet...the Orlando Sentinel is reporting we're interested in Darrel Armstrong:

Orlando Sentinel (http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/basketball/magic/orl-nbainsider19a07aug19,0,5037388.column?track=rss)

His age bothers me. I think Touche' could pull a couple of games of 40 minutes if Felts went down...not so sure about Armtrong. Maybe if we brought in a rookie like Bobby Brown too.

Dee Brown didn't get picked up by the Euro team...I'd really like to give him a shot.


I'd like to add him or Dee Brown while bringing back DA to mentor them on the court along with Rose off the court.

That's EXACTLY what I'd like to see happen too.

[ziggy]

Isn't Darrell Armstrong 57 years old?

[Keetch]

Heh born June 22, 1968. He's officially 39. Just reaching his prime.

[dvdbumpus]

with two spots I'd get a veteran PG (armstrong) and a young backup (conroy). We were seriously looking into Conroy last year, and was with our summer league team, if I'm not mistaken.

[qchoops]

Considering that I've been against resigning McInnis since I first heard the rumors, I have to say that I'm glad they've died down a bit. I just finished up a player efficiency breakdown on my site at http://www.queencityhoops.com/PlayerEff0607.php and let's just say that McInnis was not at the top of the list of Bobcats point guards last year. In fact, he was 4th...of the 4 who played there. Derek Anderson, on the other hand? First and it wasn't even close.

[dvdbumpus]

In response to Brett,

1. How can you want Brevin back, when you state this: "I know that injuries kept him out too often, and I've read that there may have been issues about playing time"

Basically telling me he was injured like he is every year, and was a locker room problem most likely. It's well known he wasn't a great lock room guy. He also was too expensive(although he should instead have been traded). I like him for the fact that he brought hustle and leadership to the expansion team, but Felton has generated more wins.


2. Derek Anderson as being the highest efficiency rating: his number is skewed because he played a large number of minutes while Felton was on the floor. When he was @ the 2 he played with excellent efficiency. From everything I saw, I'd like to point out that Mcinnis was a better manager of the offense, evidenced by more wins with Mcinnis as the starter, and a higher shooting % from the team while he played point, rather than DA. DA played well as a shooting guard that can play the point, not vice versa.

3. Mcinnis also had about 1/2 the minutes of DA, and then I can even point out that Mcinnis was out for nearly a season and probably had some rust.

4. DA : 5 more minutes average/game, 1/2 less of an assist. Yet another indication of him being more of a shooting guard with the ball in his hands less. Edit: DA also started 10 games as a forward, thus yet again playing less with the ball in his hands, and not affecting the rest of the teams offense as much.

5. DA as a starting forward: 51%; DA as a starting guard: 41%. Numbers skewed slightly. Time as a forward helped him overall.

6. "Does it concern anyone else that the Bobcats are trying to bring back the two lowest performers of the point guards for the coming season? I actually expect continued improvement from Raymond and have no complaint about the team being in his hands. But the more information I look at from last year, and the trio of Brevin, Jeff, and Derek, the more puzzled I am by the Bobcats decision on this one."

-- If you're referring to Raymond as one of the two lowest performers as a point guard is laughable. As you pointed out, playing so many minutes on a losing team is bound to hurt his overall rating. I do agree that Raymond will be better this year.

7. "and another year older." from the Mcinnis column. DA is just as old (6 months older) and has had surgery on both his knees. Does that bother you at all?

8. Saying that Brevin was one of the top two performers in efficiency rating; I'd like to point out that Brevin was 7 - 21 before injury.

All in all, I'd like to keep in mind that DA is individually much better defensively, much better offensively, as well as more versatile being able to play Guard and Forward. IMO jeff is the better distributor and more deserving of the backup point guard spot.

All in all, I think that DA should be brought back, but purely as a backup for the SG and SF spots, with short spurts of being the point, but it'd be a mistake for him the be the primary backup at the point guard spot. Others are better choices @ the point guard spot then Mcinnis or Derek, from old (Darrel Armstrong) to young (Dee Brown, Wil Conroy, etc etc).

[tamburello]

All in all, I think that DA should be brought back, but purely as a backup for the SG and SF spots, with short spurts of being the point, but it'd be a mistake for him the be the primary backup at the point guard spot. Others are better choices @ the point guard spot then Mcinnis or Derek, from old (Darrel Armstrong) to young (Dee Brown, Wil Conroy, etc etc).

This is the breakdown of our situation. These are almost all choices that we have at the moment. Also we can add Junior Harrington or Bobby Brown.

I heard rumors that Will Conroy will play in Italy. I believe Darrell Armstrong is too old to contribute on the court. Derek Anderson has never been a pure point guard. I do not know what you'd expect of Harrington and B. Brown.

So I come down to two candidates: Jeff McInnis and Dee Brown. Brown is a young and non-problematic one. McInnis is an experienced one and potentially a virus in the locker room. If we could sign any of these players, I'd select Dee Brown. If he decides to stay in the NBA, then Will Conroy. But most likely we'll sign McInnis. I don't think there will be any team that is willing to sign him except us in the NBA nor in Europe. He'll definitely come to our terms.

[ALong13]

These were Armstrong's stats last year...
PPG 5.6 | APG 2.4 | SPG 0.9

Not bad considering he averaged 15 minutes a game, but at almost 40 years old, my main question is can he run like we need him to in the fast paced offense? He'd be a nice veteran who could help the younger guys I believe, Vet min. is about the max I would offer him though, so I don't know if he would take it in Charlotte, when he could go to another team more likely to be a contender....I'm not sold on Conroy, don't know enough about him, but he's young and if he's got good potential why not? I still wouldn't mind Harrington or Dee Brown, but I'm not against McInnis either...

[qchoops]

In response to Bumpus in response to me:

1. Because when he did play, he was still pretty good. But, since he has signed with the Clips, he is no longer an option and that eliminates that source of contention.

2. Good point: I'll run some queries when I get home this evening as my tables and find out the breakdown of time spent on the court with other pg's for Derek (as well as the other point guards).

3. Does the reason McInnis was out for nearly a season and a half not give you pause about wanting him back?

4. It's true that Derek is not a pure point, and is not going to put up the same type of assists numbers, but overall efficiency counts for something, should it not? Again, I'll run the numbers tonight and get a breakdown of when he was playing point versus off the ball.

5. Even 41% is better than what McInnis shot for the season (39%).

6. It was intended to be laughable: I don't think anyone questions that Raymond is far and away the best pg the Bobcats had last season. In my notes about Raymond, I mentioned that due to the number of minutes he played, it would be nearly impossible for his efficiency to be much different than the team's overall. Mainly, I wanted to draw attention to the other 3.

7. Their age does concern, as do the knee injuries. The two are practically equals at outside shooting (34% for DA to 33% for JM) despite brutal numbers for McInnis the past 2 years, probably due to his layoff) and similarly sized, both above average height for a point guard. So, their games should age similarly, so there is no real advantage for either there. So, mainly I made that comment in hopes that the Bobcats would look outside the organization for a backup, but the options are dwindling.

8. And I'd like to point out that a lot of those losses came early in the season, when the whole team was struggling, thanks in large part to Crash's injury and subsequent poor performance.

And with all that said, I agree to an extent: Derek Anderson is not who should be the backup point guard, but I'm just not convinced that McInnis should be either. I would argue that Brevin was a far superior pg, and he was the backup for last year's team. If the Bobcats want to continue to improve, should we really take a drastic step backward at such an important position? My main reason for bringing this up is that I thought too many people seemed content for the team to bring McInnis back and I at least wanted everyone to think a bit more about that decision.

This is good though, to get some real debate going, and I hope others will join in with their thoughts. Looking forward to the next time.

[Mustachio]

very good points from both of you guys...

The thing with McInnis is... hes a backup. he knows Raymond is the starter and will tailor his game to that. so he fits if your comfortable with Felton and i think we all are. as far as locker room cancer, i havent even seen the slightest problem yet... in fact i think hes been a big asset to Ray and Adam Morrison (at least it looks like it to me)

Bobby Brown i think deserves a chance just as much as Dee Brown, Conroy or McInnis.

While its not a perfect situation id like the point guards to go into the season like this.
Ray Felton
Jeff McInnis
Bobby Brown.
Like i said its not perfect, and it could even be considered weak... but what i like about it is this. You got your starter. you got your reliable backup. and then you got your young blossoming potential. its looking to the future while making sure the present is at least shored up... all while spending very little cash.

[dav7z]

Yesterday the Charlotte Observer stated in a perfect world we would sign thease three.

http://blogs.charlotte.com/inside_the_nba/2007/08/no-bobcats-move.html

Thoughts about the big im not sure about him.

SORRY some of that is posted on another thread.

[qchoops]

The promised follow up about Derek Anderson:
I ran a query against my tables for all of the lineups the Bobcats used last season, searching for lineups where Derek Anderson was on the court, and none of the other 3 point guards were. The numbers generated are seen here:
Time: 113 mins 48 secs
Bobcats Points: 222
Bobcats Possessions: 220
Offensive Efficiency: 1.0091
Opponent Points: 218
Opponent Possessions: 211
Defensive Efficiency: 1.0332
Adjusted +/-: -0.0241

These numbers are not as good as his overall numbers, but they are still better than the team averages and they're better than McInnis' numbers (when he was the only one of the 4 point guards on the court), which are listed here for comparison's sake:
Time: 291 mins 52 secs
Bobcats Points: 580
Bobcats Possessions: 556
Offensive Efficiency: 1.0432
Opponent Points: 619
Opponent Possessions: 562
Defensive Efficiency: 1.1014
Adjusted +/-: -0.0583

[qchoops]

Follow up to the follow up: I've broken this down in greater detail at http://www.queencityhoops.com/PGEff0607.php. I look at each of the four point guards when they were the only one of the four on the court and then at each of the possible pairs of the four. For those who don't care to read it, the best pairing was Derek Anderson and Jeff McInnis, followed by Brevin Knight and Raymond Felton, and both of those pairings were better than any of the players on the court without one of the back court brethren.
What's my point? I don't know that I had one, I just thought the information was interesting and wanted to give Bumpus something to respond to.

[ziggy]

Any interest in Dan Dickau?
It appears that the Knicks are going to cut him soon (http://www.nypost.com/seven/08222007/sports/knicks/knicks_mull_nichols_future.htm).

Rookie shooting guard Demetris Nichols refused the Knicks' request to play this season in Italy to solve their roster crunch - a denial that could shorten his Knicks career. However, the Knicks will improve Nichols' chances of making the club by releasing point guard Dan Dickau in the next three weeks to reduce their roster to 16, according to sources.

[jamesmoye42]

He can shoot and runs a team pretty well... I don't know about his D but he would be a good option as a back up

[qchoops]

Pretty cool toy on basketball-reference.com lets you compare individual seasons of players. So, I did McInnis for last year and Dickau for last year: http://basketball-reference.com/fc/pcm.cgi?req=1&cum=0&p1=dickada01&y1=2007&p2=mcinnje01&y2=2007
Dickau was certainly better, but again, McInnis' layoff was a probably a big part of that. At this point in Dickau's career, his peak years are well below what McInnis' were, and he is not a young player anymore, as he will be 29 this season. Dickau is another small point guard at only 6', who is not a great distributor, with a peak of 6.8 assists per 40 minutes, and career averages of 6.5 assists and 3.0 turnovers per 40 minutes. 6 of one and half dozen of another with him and McInnis, maybe?

[dvdbumpus]

He can shoot and runs a team pretty well... I don't know about his D but he would be a good option as a back up


His D is more like "D". It's pretty bad. He can run the offense and that's what we need, however. He's also younger and has less potential to be a locker room disruption. He'd be acceptable. Unfortunately, he's not the most athletic guy in the world so it's not the perfect fit.