Do We Need Another Trade/Acquitition?

[wil]

I know we have had a lot of move this year than any year we've had, but with the bulls, hawks, nets climbing the standings and gaining leads, should we make one last "Big" move or just forget this season???... I know its risky to make a bold move but if we don't move now, we lost another good year of j-rich and GW. that's another one full season of waste and milage to our core players.. and we all know in general that players has 10 years of good years in a career, and for j-rich & GW this is year 7. i think for us not to waste these contracts and talents we must put the final piece of these puzzle for this ball club to rip some benefits out of these players and maximize these contracts. it's ALL IN TIME!!!.. :afro:

Is there still a chance to salvage this season and make the playoffs??? :g:

[ohara831]

I would say that if we fail to make up ground or actually lose ground in the next 7-10 days, and we clearly are out of the Playoff hunt, then you may see us move a man or two for draft picks. On the other hand, if we start to make up ground over that time, play well and win, then we may make a move to bring someone in to help with the Playoff push. If we stay on the pace we have already set, the team will likely do nothing.

Our next 4 games are crucial. We can win against the Nets and Atlanta, but will have a very tough time with Detroit and the Lakers. I can see this being anywhere from a 2-2 split to a 0-4 wipeout. These 4 games will go a long way towards determining what the front office may do.

[spectre]

Need? Nah. We've added players already and IMO they just need gel time playing with a consistent lineup and SET roles. If an opportunity comes along before the deadline to help a contender make a move I'd like to think we'd entertain it.

Ohara...how/who do you think we'd move for a draft pick, esp. in the next 2 weeks? We snubbed Phoenix for Mek, and I doubt we trade our only starter calibre PG right now (remember the 2 backups are on vet min deals expiring this season). Crash & JSwish I'd guess are pretty nigh untouchable unless it's ridiculous.

[ammofan]

I think we do need to make some moves. The Bobcats thought that they were going to make the playoffs this year and as of right now they wont. I would almost EXPECT a deal coming before the deadline because Jordan doesn't want to get on anyone else's bad side....
I dont think any of us expect a BIG deal like for Bibby or someone like him but I dont think the Suns or Lakers fans expected the trades their teams made either.

[BIGCatBobcat]

no trades but we need to aquire one guy: a new coach!
In all seriousness, we are what we are right now. I don't think we should go after anyone but if we are offered something we should take a listen.

[Muttley]

no trades but we need to aquire one guy: a new coach!


A finer, hammier biscuit?

[CrazyNucksFan44]

I agree with ohara831 if we do real crappy in the next couple of days we might just need to move the odd man or two who haven't been playing there best with some guys who have!

[bobcat4life]

I say we make a move for a flexible pf like villanueva. He is a good player that will help in points and most of rebounds. That wouldn't be to much of a big splash but could help us to make a run at the playoffs. Why sit back and waste years when you can make a push now. Next year we could be sidelined again with injures or someother short coming. Besides look at the lineup we would have for a couple of years after we let harrington or mcinnis or both go in a trade or after the year just let them go and let d anderson become part of the coaching staff.

felton / boykins / draft pick
jrich / carrol
gdub / morrison / dudley or reversed
okafor / c ville / may
muhamm / hollis / davidson /draft pick

Morrison, May, and Dudley could move up for more playing time but either way you set a rotation and this mix of youth and experience could take u places expecially if those draft picks become (rose, mayo, beasley, or either gordon) :afro:

[ohara831]

Need? Nah. We've added players already and IMO they just need gel time playing with a consistent lineup and SET roles. If an opportunity comes along before the deadline to help a contender make a move I'd like to think we'd entertain it.

Ohara...how/who do you think we'd move for a draft pick, esp. in the next 2 weeks? We snubbed Phoenix for Mek, and I doubt we trade our only starter calibre PG right now (remember the 2 backups are on vet min deals expiring this season). Crash & JSwish I'd guess are pretty nigh untouchable unless it's ridiculous.
__________________________________________________ ____

If we make a move, it will be moving either Ray or Okafor to a contender who really needs them. The ONLY way I do that is for a solid player and their 1st rounder. I must say that Okafor has been playing his ass off the last month and I am happy with him. Ray - well, he showed tonight why when we turn the reins over to him, he cannot handle the PG job on a night in night out basis. He just cant cut it.

There are only a few teams really looking to make a trade to enhance their playoff odds as they are already good teams. That would be Phoenix (they would want Ray), Utah (they want Okafor to play with Boozer) and Denver (they would take either). There has been talk over the past 48 hours that these 3 are strongly considering moves to make a big push into the Playoffs.

I am feeling more and more like Ray is the one we trade, to a contender like Phoenix for their Atlanta pick and a player or the Atlanta pick and their own pick. Ray is an OK combo guard coming off the bench, but he just proves he is unable to handle the NBA PG role on a night in night out basis.

We are going downhill quickly. We are getting passed within a week by the Clippers and maybe even the Knicks! The next 2 games are pretty much sure losses, and then Atlanta is proving to be a pretty good team. They have a tight grip on the 7th spot so far. If we land a top 3 pick, we may get Rose; however, I would be happy with Augustin or Bayless around the 10th pick. If we dont get Rose but it is too early to get the other 2, I'd love DeAndre Jordan with our first. Then, with one of the ones we trade for, I'd try to get either Bayless, Augustin with Ty Lawson as my safety net. I have a little more faith in Lawson than I had in Ray. Hopefully, he will prove to be better.

Anyway Spectre, this is just my thinking. But I really dont think management is going to do anything. If they decided to make a major overhaul, I'd support that move, but I dont think they have the ability to get it done not the guts to try it. If they dont do something soon to fix this team, the only people who watch will be those of us at BobcatsPlanet, cause they will lose everyone else. People wont pay good money to watch a bad product.

[amour217]

While I really love Raymond Felton, how about if we explore moving him to the Lakers in a package for Odom? Even though they've aquired Pau Gasol, I know Kobe's always been wanting a backcourt partner out there and maybe Felton will be good at picking up the Triangle. It'll also give us some options with a versatile PF like Odom, who can handle the ball and rebound and allow Okafor to stay at the 5 with Nazr backing him up. And if we let Okafor walk in the off-season, Nazr can start with Odom at the 4.

Then we can look into drafting a PG or having a sign-and-trade in the offseason, maybe dangling Okafor.

[dnbman]

I'd trade Felton for Odom in a minute. But their salaries are way far apart. I don't think it could happen.

[amour217]

I'd trade Felton for Odom in a minute. But their salaries are way far apart. I don't think it could happen.


There's always this deal:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=617~2789~18~2211~307~2399&teams=30~30~13~13~13~13&te=&cash=

:g:

[ohara831]

amour217: Interesting trade there. Honestly, what I want more that several players is Draft Picks. I know some people think that the draft is too much of a crap shoot. But it is not. it just takes the right people doing the evaluation of the talent to pick the right person(s). Look at how great the Spurs, Mavs and Suns have done with late 1st round picks. They just evaluate talent better than most. We have to get the right people selecting. If we did, then 3 first rounders, (one in the Lottery, one in the late Teens and another late 1st) can become 2 starters and one terrific 6th man off the bench.

The Suns are looking for a PG to spell Nash. If we could get their Atlanta 1st and their own 1st, I'd give them Ray. Then, I might consider keeping Okafor. But Okafor can bring something to the table as Utah is looking for a big to go with Boozer. I just would not do that for their 1st alone as it will be a late 1st. The same thing with Denver. But they will pick late so there must be more than just their 1st rounder. Finally, we might get someone to take Carroll from us and give us a Mid-Round 1st for him. I think we gave Detroit the wrong person. i wish we would have kept Herrmann.

There is a lot which can happen in the next 10 days, so we will have to see what people offer us to see if it is enticing enough to make a move.

[amour217]

amour217: Interesting trade there. Honestly, what I want more that several players is Draft Picks. I know some people think that the draft is too much of a crap shoot. But it is not. it just takes the right people doing the evaluation of the talent to pick the right person(s). Look at how great the Spurs, Mavs and Suns have done with late 1st round picks. They just evaluate talent better than most. We have to get the right people selecting. If we did, then 3 first rounders, (one in the Lottery, one in the late Teens and another late 1st) can become 2 starters and one terrific 6th man off the bench.

The Suns are looking for a PG to spell Nash. If we could get their Atlanta 1st and their own 1st, I'd give them Ray. Then, I might consider keeping Okafor. But Okafor can bring something to the table as Utah is looking for a big to go with Boozer. I just would not do that for their 1st alone as it will be a late 1st. The same thing with Denver. But they will pick late so there must be more than just their 1st rounder. Finally, we might get someone to take Carroll from us and give us a Mid-Round 1st for him. I think we gave Detroit the wrong person. i wish we would have kept Herrmann.

There is a lot which can happen in the next 10 days, so we will have to see what people offer us to see if it is enticing enough to make a move.


I did the trade thing just to see what it would take to get Odom and have it fit within our budget. That being said, I do agree with your take on draft picks...they make the most sense for us so far, ESPECIALLY since we can't afford to sign any free agents of any significance. Draft picks are our best bet at obtaining and developing solid talent at a low cost over time...we just need to be smart about drafting: look at our team's needs, NO hype players just because they're popular (Morrison), NO we-drafted-him-because-he-was-best-available (unless we're gonna trade him), etc etc.

[dnbman]

I'd trade Felton for Odom in a minute. But their salaries are way far apart. I don't think it could happen.


There's always this deal:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=617~2789~18~2211~307~2399&teams=30~30~13~13~13~13&te=&cash=

:g:


Big for big doesn't really help us. The only reason I'd go for Felton for Odom is I think Odom's passing could compensate for us having a mediocre pg. We could then pick up whatever moderate pg is available or draft one.

[spectre]

I think the Suns' pick is owed to Seattle...and the ATL pick is currently 16th. Felton is worth more than that.

We'd also have NO PG after the end of the season; McInnis is a FA and Boykins is going to want to get paid. Remember he turned down 3 million...he's going to want the full MLE, which is going to be near 6 million bucks. He's not starter quality nor is he a "pass first"...which is the common knock against Felton.

[amour217]

I'd trade Felton for Odom in a minute. But their salaries are way far apart. I don't think it could happen.


There's always this deal:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=617~2789~18~2211~307~2399&teams=30~30~13~13~13~13&te=&cash=

:g:


Big for big doesn't really help us. The only reason I'd go for Felton for Odom is I think Odom's passing could compensate for us having a mediocre pg. We could then pick up whatever moderate pg is available or draft one.


Well the only reason I went with Okafor was because it was difficult to make the salaries match up without including half the team.

There's always this option:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=617~2789~2211~2753~307~3016~55 7&teams=30~30~20~20~13~13~13&te=&cash=

[ohara831]

I did not know that Phoenix had optioned its own 1st to Seattle. I was thinking of that in conjunction with the Atlanta 1st. The Atlanta alone would not do the trick unless we got a player whom we know can contribute as well.

I just checked and you're correct. The Phoenix late 1st belongs to Seattle. Crap. There went my idea down the toilet!

[Muttley]

I'm not all about trading... but I gave it some thought, if we're really looking to move some people, what do you guys think about this one:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=3002~617~2789~2211~2753~307~53 5~2399&teams=30~30~30~13~13~13~13~13&te=&cash=

[amour217]

I'm not all about trading... but I gave it some thought, if we're really looking to move some people, what do you guys think about this one:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=3002~617~2789~2211~2753~307~53 5~2399&teams=30~30~30~13~13~13~13~13&te=&cash=


Interesting deal with A LOT of players moving around, but the Lakers definitely don't need Okafor now that they have Gasol and Bynum is looking to become quite a good player

[dnbman]

I'm not all about trading... but I gave it some thought, if we're really looking to move some people, what do you guys think about this one:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=3002~617~2789~2211~2753~307~53 5~2399&teams=30~30~30~13~13~13~13~13&te=&cash=


Interesting deal with A LOT of players moving around, but the Lakers definitely don't need Okafor now that they have Gasol and Bynum is looking to become quite a good player


Again, that's pretty terrible for us. Okafor for Odom talent wise is a wash, but it would leave us with thin depth in the middle. The rest of the trade is then Carroll and Felton for Turiaf, which doesn't exactly make gitty for the second half of the season.

[spectre]

I'm not all about trading... but I gave it some thought, if we're really looking to move some people, what do you guys think about this one:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=3002~617~2789~2211~2753~307~53 5~2399&teams=30~30~30~13~13~13~13~13&te=&cash=


Interesting deal with A LOT of players moving around, but the Lakers definitely don't need Okafor now that they have Gasol and Bynum is looking to become quite a good player


Agreed...I think that with the Lakers having Bynum their motivation for going after Mek would be pretty low...esp. since he'll want to get paid this year.

I'm also with DNB on losing our force in the paint unless the idea is to bring in someone via the draft to take that role. Farmar is a good choice to bring in if Felton's going out however.

[ohara831]

Yeah, Lakers dont need another big now. Bynum will be back soon. I think that is us giving up too much for too little in return. Ray, Okafor a Carroll could go in separate deals and bring us more value, I would think.

[ohara831]

Interesting. I went over to RealGM to see about the Trade Talks, and saw one that I thought was good for us but BigSlam shot it down. Toronto trades Kapono (back up SF) Calderon (starting PG who avg 12.3 pts and 8.8 assts) and Bargnani (PF/C avg 10 pts and 4 reb) and we send them J-Rich and Dudley.

I have to say, I kinda like that trade. I'd start Calderon at 1, Ray at 2, Crash at 3, Okafor/Bargnani at 4/5. I think that starting 5 would prove better for us. Ray could focus just on scoring, and he is s much better defender than J-Rich. Also, that gets us out of a long term big Contract.

[dvdbumpus]

Interesting. I went over to RealGM to see about the Trade Talks, and saw one that I thought was good for us but BigSlam shot it down. Toronto trades Kapono (back up SF) Calderon (starting PG who avg 12.3 pts and 8.8 assts) and Bargnani (PF/C avg 10 pts and 4 reb) and we send them J-Rich and Dudley.

I have to say, I kinda like that trade. I'd start Calderon at 1, Ray at 2, Crash at 3, Okafor/Bargnani at 4/5. I think that starting 5 would prove better for us. Ray could focus just on scoring, and he is s much better defender than J-Rich. Also, that gets us out of a long term big Contract.


I'd consider it cuz Calderon is a stud. Also clears up a lot of salary. However, please no more 2 pg sets, ever. Matt, Crash, Kapono if we got him, or morrison next year please. Have Felton backup and play 20-25 minutes a game behind calderon. I'm not a fan of Bargnani.

[wil]

Yes, i also like the toronto trade... it would be mutually benefitting.. :wink:

[amour217]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2753~307~3008~3006~1711&teams=5~5~5~30~30&te=&cash=30:5

[spectre]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2753~307~3008~3006~1711&teams=5~5~5~30~30&te=&cash=30:5


I like that for us a lot, but I don't know that Cleveland would value Felton that highly. If only he'd have another game like he did against them in his first season (of course if he did that we wouldn't think about doing this deal).

[amour217]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2753~307~3008~3006~1711&teams=5~5~5~30~30&te=&cash=30:5


I like that for us a lot, but I don't know that Cleveland would value Felton that highly. If only he'd have another game like he did against them in his first season (of course if he did that we wouldn't think about doing this deal).


Well I've read Cleveland has been looking to deal Gooden and you know they've needed a semi-legit PG for awhile now...if they can't get takers, it would be a nice deal for us: it would bump up our front-line rebounding and interior toughness a notch and could allow us the freedom to draft another PG

[spectre]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2753~307~3008~3006~1711&teams=5~5~5~30~30&te=&cash=30:5


I like that for us a lot, but I don't know that Cleveland would value Felton that highly. If only he'd have another game like he did against them in his first season (of course if he did that we wouldn't think about doing this deal).


Well I've read Cleveland has been looking to deal Gooden and you know they've needed a semi-legit PG for awhile now...if they can't get takers, it would be a nice deal for us: it would bump up our front-line rebounding and interior toughness a notch and could allow us the freedom to draft another PG


Gibson will be the piece they won't want to let loose of. How about if we sub in Dwayne Jones for him and ask for Cleveland's draft pick, currently 18th? Jones has a trade restriction where he has to approve the trade...but we can cross that bridge when Jordan calls Ferry.

Felton/Harrington/Hollins for Gooden/Jones/18th pick

Cleveland would have to cut a player (Hollins I assume), but they save more than his salary in this deal...so they shouldn't have a problem with that.

The question I have is do we want to go into next season with no PG on the roster? Do we HAVE to have a PG coming back in any Felton trade? I'm thinking we do. Amour I think I'd have to at least try your trade first...my suggestion I'd have to think on.

[amour217]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2753~307~3008~3006~1711&teams=5~5~5~30~30&te=&cash=30:5


I like that for us a lot, but I don't know that Cleveland would value Felton that highly. If only he'd have another game like he did against them in his first season (of course if he did that we wouldn't think about doing this deal).


Well I've read Cleveland has been looking to deal Gooden and you know they've needed a semi-legit PG for awhile now...if they can't get takers, it would be a nice deal for us: it would bump up our front-line rebounding and interior toughness a notch and could allow us the freedom to draft another PG


Gibson will be the piece they won't want to let loose of. How about if we sub in Dwayne Jones for him and ask for Cleveland's draft pick, currently 18th? Jones has a trade restriction where he has to approve the trade...but we can cross that bridge when Jordan calls Ferry.

Felton/Harrington/Hollins for Gooden/Jones/18th pick

Cleveland would have to cut a player (Hollins I assume), but they save more than his salary in this deal...so they shouldn't have a problem with that.

The question I have is do we want to go into next season with no PG on the roster? Do we HAVE to have a PG coming back in any Felton trade? I'm thinking we do. Amour I think I'd have to at least try your trade first...my suggestion I'd have to think on.


I actually like your re-working of the deal: and not getting a PG back in return can be a gamble...if we do get one, great...if not, that can be great too. We can be in a good position to draft a PG like Bayless from Arizona, or we can use our 1st rounder plus the Cleveland pick for some leverage to move up in the draft or scour the market for a PG to aquire. Options are always good.

Either way, I like Drew Gooden for this team...he's not a perfect player by any means, but he can board and has shown the talent to blow up in games (though he looks bonkers with that beard)

[BIGCatBobcat]

There are very few players that I truly dispise in the NBA and most of them are on Cleveland's team. Drew Gooden is the leader of the pack. Did everyone see him try and walk out on the court with no jersey on?

[spectre]

Options are always good

Bears repeating.

I think it's a good idea Amour and something that should be looked into.

[davcbow]

Does anyone really think that more trades will help our coach win games? :g:

[Muttley]

Does anyone really think that more trades will help our coach win games? :g:


No, but we're just fans. All we can do is speculate, and there's no speculation about what must be done with Vincent!




Options are always good

Bears repeating.

I think it's a good idea Amour and something that should be looked into.


I was looking at some trade options with Cleveland the other day. Really, I was trying to find a way that Cedric Simmons could magically become a Bobcat - it didn't work out all that well. I did notice, though that while the Cavs have 4 PGs listed on their Depth Chart, I don't really want any of them.

We'd have to really give them something special to take Boobie from them. I'm not sure I would want to rely on Boykins for the remaining games of the season. Although, it would give him the chance to earn the back-up role for next year if he wants it. It also allow our scouts to focus on one position and one only. PG. With Gooden coming in with Dwayne Jones (I thought you said "Damon" the first time I read it) and the 18th pick, we could even roll the dice on two Guards, and have them battle for supremacy.

Hell, why not? We've gotten this far with Jeff McInnis at the helm, what's another 31?

[dav7z]

To be truthful i don't think trading is the answer til we work out the inturnal problems we have. I don't think it's any fair way to know how good our players really are with thease problems.
M.J. had a diferent after just one practice. So i hate to trade possable quility away for for as best average . A true evaluation needs to be done befor we go to far in the trade market.
The influance M.J had with very little time makes me think this.
I would love M.J to step in some way . To get a true feel for the players we got and decide what derection we need to go. Weather it's just watching practice lending a
hand coaching ,or coaching. This year is about shot we got to start to look ahead. Right now prepareing for next year is more important to me than getting lucky and land a eight seed. I n the long run the lotio pick would be better.

[ohara831]

I like the Amour217 trade. Gooden and Jones are sure to add depth this season. Then, we have two decent picks in this o8 Draft. Spend the 1st (ours) on a PG. Spend Cavs pick on a quality big like Love from UCLA.

Regarding Vincent: Too many brilliant minds have spoken out, and I am beginnng to believe that he will be canned at the end of the season. It is not just the Wins and Losses. This team just is uninspired by him. That just wont work.

[spectre]

I wouldn't count on Boykins staying past this season. He wants MLE money (6 million) and I don't know that I'd want to pay him that...rather toss it to Duhon if we have to go that route.

Have you guys noticed that Boykins just doesn't seem real happy? Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but he's never smiling and I've seen him just give up a few times on the court...esp. after he makes a turnover. I'm not so sure he'd stay even if we paid him what he wants...might just toss us for a contender if he can get one to bite.

Muttley agreed, the Cavs won't give up Boobie (and I don't blame them).

Dav I think most of us are looking beyond Vincent, but no...I don't think a trade (barring something fantastic) would really help this year.