The Morning After...

[walkerl]

After doing some instense research. I feel alot better about this draft. Say what you will, but DJ was a first team ALL-American, and recoginized as the best PG in the NCAA. We didn't needa combo guard or a shoot 1st PG. Also if you look at his numbers compared to Rose, they are almost identical.

I really think Aljinca can be a player, opposing teams will have to respect his outside shot. because he can shot from the outside, it will free up the paint some, making it easier for Emeka and Wallace ot work. Looking at his video, he reminds me of KG when he was a rookie. Athletic, Tall, Skinny, pretty good on both ends. I'm satisfied with the draft. I would give the Bobcats a grade of "B"

[Mustachio]

thats a fair write up i'd say. DJ will be the backup and if hes better then he will start. HOW IS THAT A PROBLEM! If Raymond Felton becomes our backup PG.... we should be so lucky.

and the Ajinca/KG reference isn't far off i dont think. KG didnt even have the shot that Ajinca has now. Hes got a huge wingspan and can basically get his shot off against anyone. Loves defense, and most importantly loves that he got drafted and is excited to be here. hes mobile for 7 foot and has room to add weight as his frame is wider than say Randolph or KG even.
Look he wont be KG next season and he may never be KG, hell he may never play for us (highly doubtful as i think he is on the roster next season)... but if KG or LMA is even a realistic talking point... we could have done worse.


I think this roster is better than it was last year. and isnt that what is supposed to happen. As a huge Green Bay Packers fan I can tell you something about the draft. Give it time. The Packers have gotten no better than an average C grade since about the year 2003. Now they are the youngest team in the NFL and played in the NFC Championship game last season. The picks might not seem like the best hyped players coming into the draft.... but the coaches got guys they liked and saw potential in. Larry Brown knows what hes doing (I hope)... lets see what hes done before we jump off the bridge into I-77 traffic.

[Proudiddy]

After doing some instense research. I feel alot better about this draft. Say what you will, but DJ was a first team ALL-American, and recoginized as the best PG in the NCAA. We didn't needa combo guard or a shoot 1st PG. Also if you look at his numbers compared to Rose, they are almost identical.

I really think Aljinca can be a player, opposing teams will have to respect his outside shot. because he can shot from the outside, it will free up the paint some, making it easier for Emeka and Wallace ot work. Looking at his video, he reminds me of KG when he was a rookie. Athletic, Tall, Skinny, pretty good on both ends. I'm satisfied with the draft. I would give the Bobcats a grade of "B"

I was actually secretly pulling for us to take Augustin the whole time if we stayed at 9. So I'm happy with that pick. But the other two kind of casted a shadow over my short-lived happiness with this draft. The Ajinca guy averaged 5 ppg in the French league!?!?! KG would've averaged at least 15 in the French League coming out of high school. He may be athletic, but that doesn't make you a basketball player. I really hope we pull off another SIGNIFICANT move or I will be extremely unhappy with the looks of next year's team.

[Mustachio]

I was actually secretly pulling for us to take Augustin the whole time if we stayed at 9. So I'm happy with that pick. But the other two kind of casted a shadow over my short-lived happiness with this draft. The Ajinca guy averaged 5 ppg in the French league!?!?! KG would've averaged at least 15 in the French League coming out of high school. He may be athletic, but that doesn't make you a basketball player. I really hope we pull off another SIGNIFICANT move or I will be extremely unhappy with the looks of next year's team.


check out MathHBZ's post in the other thread. gives more insight into the playing time and point averages of his French career. and i for one don't think KG would have done well in any Euro league. His game isn't Euro at all... so give the French kid a break. we may have gotten a winner.

[Proudiddy]

check out MathHBZ's post in the other thread. gives more insight into the playing time and point averages of his French career. and i for one don't think KG would have done well in any Euro league. His game isn't Euro at all... so give the French kid a break. we may have gotten a winner.


I hope you're right... I don't put a lot into stats themselves, because being a basketball player (through the college level thus far), I understand that situations can deter or limit a players ability, and thus statistics. But, I'm also speaking on what I've seen. I wasn't impressed with the videos and highlights I've seen of him.

And I always figured, if you're good, you're going to get the playing time somewhere. But, I know in some situations that's not the case; some coaches can be douchebags... Hopefully, you're right and this is the case. I still hope we solidify with a veteran pick-up though.

[dav7z]

The kid is growing and has come into his own . If May don't start and we don't trade this kid could start at the four . And in his first year i think hes at least a 10ppg and 10 rpg rookie. Alot of people will be eating crow at this time next year about this pick.

[walkerl]

If if makes you feel any better. On ESPN top 100 prospects. Aljinca was ranked at 20 (right where we got him). And all of the mock drafts I say (CNNSI, ESPN, Draft Xpress, & NBAdraft.net) they all had him going mid 20's. People fear the unknown. 99% of NBA fans know zero about this kid. I'm sure Spurs fans were skepical about Tony Parker. And they thought Don Nelson was insane for getting Dirk. Give it some time.

[Mustachio]

I hope you're right... I don't put a lot into stats themselves, because being a basketball player (through the college level thus far), I understand that situations can deter or limit a players ability, and thus statistics. But, I'm also speaking on what I've seen. I wasn't impressed with the videos and highlights I've seen of him.

And I always figured, if you're good, you're going to get the playing time somewhere. But, I know in some situations that's not the case; some coaches can be douchebags... Hopefully, you're right and this is the case. I still hope we solidify with a veteran pick-up though.


i do agree that talent rises to the top and that if he was good he would have been starting no matter what.

but i think in this situation its a coming into his own deal. He is putting on weight and honing his skills. and maybe was a late bloomer as far as BBIQ goes. hes a prospect so I mean its a gamble pick. I just have a good feeling about him.

[Wallace15]

Augustine will be great competition for Felton, and will push him to work even harder which will only make him better. And now we finally have 2 PG's that can actually play.

I really think Ajinca will turn out to be a pretty good player. He only got around 11 minutes of playing time in France and still was able to get 5 and 5. If he would've have gotten 20-25 muinutes over there, then who knows what he could have been capable of.

[dav7z]

Brown says the kid can play the four and will give us a defencive advantage.

http://www.nba.com/bobcats/index_main.html

[Icky Thump]

I'm still not really in the mood to be rationalizing this draft. We came into the draft with a good lineup and coach and 3 picks overall. We come out of the draft with a backup pg in smurf, a guy we aren't sure what he's capable of in frenchy, and a 3rd string guard.

I'm just disappointed most in that we had the ability to really improve our team and I think we just added players. Thats it and thats all. I don't think we took advantage of our situation.

[Slam]

I love the DJ pick. I love the Weaver pick. I am more than ok with the Ajinca pick.

I might have liked to find a way to trade the #20 with the GSW to land Randolph, but other than that, it's all good in the hood.

The only better outcome would have been landing Beasley or Mayo. Considering that didn't happen, I think we have come out with a B+

Considering we could have ended up with a Crash for TJ trade and which would have given us a D ranking IMO, I think we did well.

[ohara831]

http://www.news-record.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080627/NRSTAFF/806270308/

LB is happy. He is working his plan!

[Mustachio]

I love the DJ pick. I love the Weaver pick. I am more than ok with the Ajinca pick.

I might have liked to find a way to trade the #20 with the GSW to land Randolph, but other than that, it's all good in the hood.

The only better outcome would have been landing Beasley or Mayo. Considering that didn't happen, I think we have come out with a B+

Considering we could have ended up with a Crash for TJ trade and which would have given us a D ranking IMO, I think we did well.


I agree... we didn't go out and land the killer blockbuster trade (yet). But we did pick up 3 good prospects. Which is what I always thought the draft was about anyway.

about trading 20 to GSW for Randolph. don't you feel like Ajinca has just as much upside if not more, and will probably contribute on an equal level in year 1 as Randolph? or am I crazy.

[TheBeagle]

Oh, yeah, things could've been much worse than they turned out. I'm learning to like the Smurf pick, although Raymond MUST stay in order for that learning process to continue. Frenchy appears to be a few years away, but has a much higher ceiling than any other project big we've drafted before, so I'm okay with that pick I think. For a second rounder, I guess Weaver is okay, but he's got very little to offer offensively and is turnover prone from what I've seen of him, though he rebounds well, and can play good man defense at the collegiate level, though his defensive prowess is still exaggerated.

Looking at the longterm goal of generating interest in the team locally, that didn't come close to happening last night. I emailed Michael Thompson and vented to him a bit, and he emailed me back that he too was thinking a bigger splash should've been made by the MJ/LB monster, and that all fans have a right to be upset with how things went down last night. He was in agreement with most of us that Smurf has the potential to be a really good pick, but that Raymond has to stay in order for that to happen. Michael is the man!! Why can't we kick MJ to the curb and put MT in charge?

Overall, I say B- draft right now, but they've yet to put on a Bobcats jersey and play, so that's a tenuous grade, obviously. Just disappointing that the chance was there to do something big, and we have 3 guys on our roster that no casual/aspiring Bobcats fan gives a shit about, and in that sense, it was a wasted opportunity, but ultimately if we win, that's what's going to do it.

[Mustachio]

Oh, yeah, things could've been much worse than they turned out. I'm learning to like the Smurf pick, although Raymond MUST stay in order for that learning process to continue. Frenchy appears to be a few years away, but has a much higher ceiling than any other project big we've drafted before, so I'm okay with that pick I think. For a second rounder, I guess Weaver is okay, but he's got very little to offer offensively and is turnover prone from what I've seen of him, though he rebounds well, and can play good man defense at the collegiate level, though his defensive prowess is still exaggerated.

Looking at the longterm goal of generating interest in the team locally, that didn't come close to happening last night. I emailed Michael Thompson and vented to him a bit, and he emailed me back that he too was thinking a bigger splash should've been made by the MJ/LB monster, and that all fans have a right to be upset with how things went down last night. He was in agreement with most of us that Smurf has the potential to be a really good pick, but that Raymond has to stay in order for that to happen. Michael is the man!! Why can't we kick MJ to the curb and put MT in charge?

Overall, I say B- draft right now, but they've yet to put on a Bobcats jersey and play, so that's a tenuous grade, obviously. Just disappointing that the chance was there to do something big, and we have 3 guys on our roster that no casual/aspiring Bobcats fan gives a shit about, and in that sense, it was a wasted opportunity, but ultimately if we win, that's what's going to do it.



Beagle, as far as eye catching moves... I don't know what else the Bobcats can do. If 2 tarheels, Emeka, Adam Morrison, Jason Richardson, Larry Brown and Michael Freakin Jordan aren't enough splash and local flavor to bring new fans in the area in.... what the hell is Mayo or Beasley gonna bring. Both guys played further west than most any player we have now. I'm not sure most casual fans in North Carolina even knew who Beasley was, and the only thing they know about OJ is that he took some money in college and may or may not have killed his wife and her boyfriend.

I just think at some point, you have to say screw the headlines and go for wins. Not that these picks make us championship contenders, but I'm getting excited about the openness and options this roster brings us. Larry can "coach this team up" because I believe that everyone of these players wants to learn and get better. I think we have the chance to be a pretty good ball club.

We have drafted guys every single year that the media thought were good picks, and they still trash us constantly. Stuart Scott stated that we didn't make the playoffs at least 12 times last night. I personally don't think it was even feasible for a franchise that came into the NBA while it was slumping (attendance and tv deals) could have made the playoffs in under 5 years. So it's pretty clear to me that the only way to bring in fans, get the media and keep diehard fans happy is to win. Just win baby.

I like you and Keetch and I hope that you guys wont really sell your tickets... or at least wait until this team is an utter failure ON THE COURT. Then I might be right behind you haha.

[ohara831]

Honestly, I think a move of Felton is coming along with someone else. I think we are going to grab our starting PF there and also a proven vet PG who could start for a short time while DJ gets his feet wet. But DJ would start probably by mid season. That is how I see it coming down.

[Slam]

Isn't Brevin Knight a UFA this summer? Wouldn't it be "funny" if we brought him back and traded Felts!!

I know someone who would Spontaneously orgasm if that happened!!

[ohara831]

Smush Parker and Al Thorton? Maybe can get kinda cheap?

[Hormel]

New Here, and just wanted to start off and say thank you for the draft chat last night, it was a blast :biggrin:!

As far as the draft goes, I think this draft is actually going to get a B+ in my books, and I don't think there were much better moves we could of have made. I'm just a fan, and I think Larry Brown knows more about point guards then I will ever know my whole life, and if he thinks D.J was worth the #9 pick then so do I.

I think with last nights moves, it basically states that we are tired of waiting on Sean May, and Felton, and I believe one, if not both of them are going to be on the move before the season starts to get our starting #4. Now the person I am hoping for is David Lee, I know many don't like the kid, esp the people in the draft last night, but I really like David Lee, and having him on our roster would be a great pick up. Now If we could get any PF better the David Lee I would be even happier, esp if we walk out of this with Lamar Odom.

I think a line up of DJ/JRich/GForce/Lee Or Better PF/Okafor with a Healthy Morrison and Dudley and others coming off of the bench would get us in the playoffs. The East is getting better and better, but I still think with that line up we can look to get a #6-8 seed, and hey we saw what Atlanta did with Boston , and took them to 7 Games, all you gotta do is get in the dance.

[Mustachio]

New Here, and just wanted to start off and say thank you for the draft chat last night, it was a blast :biggrin:!

As far as the draft goes, I think this draft is actually going to get a B+ in my books, and I don't think there were much better moves we could of have made. I'm just a fan, and I think Larry Brown knows more about point guards then I will ever know my whole life, and if he thinks D.J was worth the #9 pick then so do I.

I think with last nights moves, it basically states that we are tired of waiting on Sean May, and Felton, and I believe one, if not both of them are going to be on the move before the season starts to get our starting #4. Now the person I am hoping for is David Lee, I know many don't like the kid, esp the people in the draft last night, but I really like David Lee, and having him on our roster would be a great pick up. Now If we could get any PF better the David Lee I would be even happier, esp if we walk out of this with Lamar Odom.

I think a line up of DJ/JRich/GForce/Lee Or Better PF/Okafor with a Healthy Morrison and Dudley and others coming off of the bench would get us in the playoffs. The East is getting better and better, but I still think with that line up we can look to get a #6-8 seed, and hey we saw what Atlanta did with Boston , and took them to 7 Games, all you gotta do is get in the dance.


welcome Hormel, draft chat was fun last night. unfortunately, I'm gonna have to ask you to remove your signature. Ziggy has rules, and one of them is no pornographic images as signatures. and you sir have a gigantic prick as your signature. we can't allow that.

nah but seriously welcome and stick around for awhile.

[Dunk]

I don't feel as bad about the draft as I did last night. The thing I'm probably disappointed the most with is the Ajinca pick. I just don't think he's going to do anything for us now, when we need it most. We can't wait 2-3 years for him to develop. We need a PF today. If the best trade we can come up with is Crash for TJ Ford, we're kinda screwed in bringing in anyone good.

[Alex]

I'm just feeling indifferent right now. Not excited, not disappointed, just indifferent about the draft. I just want to season to roll around to see what these guys can do.

[spectre]

The Crash for TJ rumor has me seriously doubting the "brain trust" we have in Charlotte. MJ coming out and actually saying that was like a cold bucket of water being dumped on me while asleep.

And the "combo" line he threw out about Felts was pretty crappy too, esp. since Brown has bent over backwards since he's been hired to say Felts was a PG and that's the only position he'll play him.

Jordon should have kept his mout shut.

The draft was ok in that I think they did the best they could while staying at 9th and 20th. I was hoping for something better though.

[Keetch]

Yeah like Bayless and Arthur. Hell at 9 I would have been happy with Lopez; at least he's funny. That's entertainment!

...and OK...Felton's not going to be traded; its all rumors. DJ will be our PG backup. That's his ceiling anyway.

But...if for any reason I start seeing Felton starting at the 2 next year, and I don't care who is coach; I am going to sell the house, move my business and start pawning off my lower level tickets for $10 upper level end zone seats to Portland Blazers games.

[Icky Thump]

Again what is depressing is the potential we held coming into this draft and to come out of it yielding little. We got a backup PG and 3rd string SG. I think Ajinca was a desperation pick on part of LB as Im sure he thought Hibbert would be there at 20.

You can say well we did the best with what we were left with... that is the point. We can't sit idly by while other teams make the moves around us to get the talent. Look at Portland as a Grand example of just that. They may not be in the playoffs next season but that lineup is a winner down the road and soon.

We never really had a need to look to trade Felton. He is perfectly fine for our team. What we need is some presence in the F'n POST. A team that has been in the lottery every year to this point doesn't have the luxury of drafting backups IMO. We should have made a move to get our guy... we had a little trade bait to work with coming into the draft and three picks.... and ONE, TWO, THREE Strikes we're out.

[spectre]

Well said. I don't know yet about Ajinca, but I can't disagree with the rest. I wanted Beasley or Mayo, and we do see teams like Portland making these type of moves every year.

We're still young though. I'd have hated to give up 2-3 core pieces for what I hope will turn out as an all star. Not saying we shouldn't and it's hard to know for sure as we didn't see what was required to get in that position...but you have to think the costs would have been very high.

[peapod]

Yeah like Bayless and Arthur. Hell at 9 I would have been happy with Lopez; at least he's funny. That's entertainment!

...and OK...Felton's not going to be traded; its all rumors. DJ will be our PG backup. That's his ceiling anyway.

But...if for any reason I start seeing Felton starting at the 2 next year, and I don't care who is coach; I am going to sell the house, move my business and start pawning off my lower level tickets for $10 upper level end zone seats to Portland Blazers games.

Exactly !!

A second team of Nazr/Arthur/Dudley-Morrison/CDR/Bayless would have kept the pedal to the metal, and either extended our lead, or cut into the deficit. A coach would have to be concerned about defending that lineup.

Or Lopez/Davidson/Dudley-Morrison/Chris Douglas-Roberts/Mario Chalmers would have also been a solid second unit. Either of these would have been an upgrade for years to come, over what we can throw out there now.

While I agree that DJ is a terrific point, Raymond is our point, who needs 12-15 minutes off to be most effective. To give minutes to DJ, by definition= moving Raymond to the 2 for some minutes. If we had selected Bayless, he could back up Raymond 12-15 minutes, and back up J Rich a few minutes. DJ cannot back up J Rich, and giving him only 12-15 minutes is a waste of the 9th pick.

David Lee is a nice PF. Combine him with Chris Bosh, Tim Duncan, Kevin Garnett, or any mobile offensive big, and you've got an effective tandem. But Okafor has a similar skill set, that would clog up the middle with Lee. IMHO, Charlie V or Odom would work better with Okafor.

All of this assumes that we are going to keep our core, and let Larry Brown work his magic.
IMHO, he can lead us to 40+ victories/playoffs next year. But I also think he could win more with the above line ups, than with what we have now.

[Mustachio]

Exactly !!

A second team of Nazr/Arthur/Dudley-Morrison/CDR/Bayless would have kept the pedal to the metal, and either extended our lead, or cut into the deficit. A coach would have to be concerned about defending that lineup.

Or Lopez/Davidson/Dudley-Morrison/Chris Douglas-Roberts/Mario Chalmers would have also been a solid second unit. Either of these would have been an upgrade for years to come, over what we can throw out there now.

While I agree that DJ is a terrific point, Raymond is our point, who needs 12-15 minutes off to be most effective. To give minutes to DJ, by definition= moving Raymond to the 2 for some minutes. If we had selected Bayless, he could back up Raymond 12-15 minutes, and back up J Rich a few minutes. DJ cannot back up J Rich, and giving him only 12-15 minutes is a waste of the 9th pick.
.


doesn't a second team of Ajinca/ Davidson/ Dudley-Morrison/ Matt Carroll-Weaver / Dj Augustine do the exact same thing as both of the lineups above you just mentioned??? It fills all the exact holes your saying that CDR/Lopez/Bayless/Chalmers can fill...

It does... its just different personnel. personnel that a NCAA and NBA title holder picked. Im not saying your wrong that those guys will be good NBA players.... Im just saying we don't know. Im trusting Larry Brown though.

[dnbman]

doesn't a second team of Ajinca/ Davidson/ Dudley-Morrison/ Matt Carroll-Weaver / Dj Augustine do the exact same thing as both of the lineups above you just mentioned??? It fills all the exact holes your saying that CDR/Lopez/Bayless/Chalmers can fill...

It does... its just different personnel. personnel that a NCAA and NBA title holder picked. Im not saying your wrong that those guys will be good NBA players.... Im just saying we don't know. Im trusting Larry Brown though.

Until we know what Ajinca brings, we can't really compare those lines. The Ajinca line has potentially no post presence other than athleticism and wingspan. The guards wouldn't be as successful because teams wouldn't have to focus down low at all. So, Augustine has less room to facilitate. With Lopez or Nazr, you have skilled, if less athletic players, that can demand a person pay attention to them inside, spreading the floor for the others to operate. Plus, Bayless would be an electric scorer on that second unit, which none of those guys really are.

I just wrote in another thread that I'm happy with our draft for now. However, I also pointed out that there are many ways we could have been more successful immediately than how the draft played out.

I still think we'll be in good shape next year, and hopefully this all looks like genius in three years.

[Mustachio]

Until we know what Ajinca brings, we can't really compare those lines. The Ajinca line has potentially no post presence other than athleticism and wingspan. The guards wouldn't be as successful because teams wouldn't have to focus down low at all. So, Augustine has less room to facilitate. With Lopez or Nazr, you have skilled, if less athletic players, that can demand a person pay attention to them inside, spreading the floor for the others to operate. Plus, Bayless would be an electric scorer on that second unit, which none of those guys really are.

I just wrote in another thread that I'm happy with our draft for now. However, I also pointed out that there are many ways we could have been more successful immediately than how the draft played out.

I still think we'll be in good shape next year, and hopefully this all looks like genius in three years.


thats my point. we can't trash our current lineup because we really have no idea what it can bring.

I also know that Bayless fell beyond us. theres a reason guys fall. hes kind of a black hole on offense. and i dont think theres any question that we got the better Point Guard in DJ over Chalmers. I also think that an Ajinca/Davidson lineup is better than a Lopez/Davidson lineup because it could turn into a Nazr/Ajinca lineup. where as Lopez is "skilled" but has absolutely no shot ever in the world of succesfully playing PF in the NBA. With the guys we brought in this draft... we are more versatile all around. and with this teams injury history... the more guys you have with the ability to play other positions the better.

I am not saying this draft couldn't have been better on paper. im just saying that in theory...it could turn out to be the best possible scenario for the Bobcats.

[peapod]

thats my point. we can't trash our current lineup because we really have no idea what it can bring.

I also know that Bayless fell beyond us. theres a reason guys fall. hes kind of a black hole on offense. and i dont think theres any question that we got the better Point Guard in DJ over Chalmers. I also think that an Ajinca/Davidson lineup is better than a Lopez/Davidson lineup because it could turn into a Nazr/Ajinca lineup. where as Lopez is "skilled" but has absolutely no shot ever in the world of succesfully playing PF in the NBA. With the guys we brought in this draft... we are more versatile all around. and with this teams injury history... the more guys you have with the ability to play other positions the better.

I am not saying this draft couldn't have been better on paper. im just saying that in theory...it could turn out to be the best possible scenario for the Bobcats.

What dnbman said.....

Also, with Ajinca, we have another athletic, thin, potential at big to go with guys that could be the same thing with Hollins/Davidson. None of those guys would command a double team next year, like Lopez would. And Lopez is not without shot blocking value-because of his reach. Down the road-this could translate into less fouls in the post.

And we all saw what happened in the playoffs this year-pretty much any year-where the team doesn't have to guard one of the other teams players. The other team begins to be less efficient/effective.

I hear what you're saying Mustachio, about versatility and potential, and maybe you're right...I sure hope so-REALLY. :)

I also trust LB's coaching ability, but wasn't he on board in Detroit-although not the trigger man - when they selected Darko, instead of Bosh, Wade, or Carmello? Just saying...;>)

Maybe there is a plan to detonate the team, but I would like to see what LB can do with the guys we have first. And if he does, then I think adding Bayless/Lopez, Arthur/Chalmers, and CDR would have given the team a better chance to win next year-and the next several years as well.

[Mustachio]

Lopez will absolutely not demand a double team in the NBA.

[dvdbumpus]

Alexis was the #20 pick, not like Darko - who happened to be a high potential big man. Can't compare a #20 pick to a #2 pick.