Trade Up or Trade Out

[LB4President]

I think Bonnell had the right idea. We won't find much to help our team at the twelve spot. Either package the pick with some for the Wizards number 5 pick or package it with Nazr just to dump his salary. What do you guys think?

[spectre]

Hard to say. Either way we have to address depth, so if we did move Nazr with the 12th and took no salary back most likely we'd turn around and use the MLE.

The MLE guy might contribute more right now, but the 12th will most likely contribute more in a year or two AND he'd still be on a rookie deal after Nazr's gone.

I'm against moving any asset to dump only 13 million...so personally I'd just stand pat and draft BPA.

[ohara831]

I'd rather trade with Minn. They have #6, #18 and #28. I'd trade #12 for #18 and #28. We also have 2 2nd rounders and might be able to combine them to grab a 3rd 1st rounder at the end of the round or a very early 2nd rounder. I think I'd rather trust LB to find us 3 quality players in the 1st round rather than trade the pick to get someone to take Nazr's contract off our hands. I dont see the need to get all that cap space for 2010 as I dont think there are any major players who will be FA's that year wanting to come to Charlotte until we establish ourselves as a serious contender for a few years.

[SWedd523]

I wouldn't mind trading up to get the #5 spot and taking Harden. They're actively shopping that pick so its possible. And I really think LB is planning on bringing in a big time guy considering how close we are

[Slam]

I'd love to package something like Raja and the #12 to move up to the #5 spot and get Harden from the Wizards.

Other than that, stick with the #12 and see who's on the board when we pick.

[teej]

I like your thinking on the whole Slam, but I fear LB would be too stubborn to trade "his guy" for a rookie. Remember how hard he is on rookies. And its not like this is a great draft to trade up and risk assets in.

[Slam]

I don't think he is hard on rookies at all.

[Slam]

I wouldn't mind trading up to get the #5 spot and taking Harden. They're actively shopping that pick so its possible. And I really think LB is planning on bringing in a big time guy considering how close we are

Great minds thinking alike - 1 minute apart?!?!

;)

[teej]

I don't think he is hard on rookies at all.

He's notoriously hard on rookies. He probably ruined any chance for Cartier. And he yelled at DJ all the time, he just had a thick skin. Dontell just ignored him.

Anyways, I just don't think he's going to trade a proven commodity that he likes and is a leader for an untested rooike that might or might not be just as good.

[SWedd523]

Great minds thinking alike - 1 minute apart?!?!

;)
haha yeah ;)

I wouldn't trade Raja and the 12 for the 5. We'd get younger, but we wouldn't get any deeper.

I would consider trading DJ and the 12 for a higher pick, I think Memphis would consider it if they really want a PG but are scared about Rubio holding back.


12 + Nazr/May + one of our seconds to move up?

[teej]

haha yeah ;)

I wouldn't trade Raja and the 12 for the 5. We'd get younger, but we wouldn't get any deeper.

I would consider trading DJ and the 12 for a higher pick, I think Memphis would consider it if they really want a PG but are scared about Rubio holding back.


12 + Nazr/May + one of our seconds to move up?

I suggested that and added Dontell since he's some wonderboy among coaches now, but Spectre said that was for moving down :p

[BETCATS]

you guys all know i am a huge advocate of bringing in Allen Iverson, but if we could trade up and get James Harden or Demar Derozan, i would like that even more. I think both Harden and Derozan have great chances at being star players, Iverson is a star already, but is on the decline (arguably)

[spectre]

I suggested that and added Dontell since he's some wonderboy among coaches now, but Spectre said that was for moving down :p

LOL!

Ok, in your best Rod Higgins' voice pretend I'm the Wiz GM and explain to me why I would want Nazr and May (and the Great Dontell!!) so badly I'd be willing to drop back 7 spots in the draft. :biggrin:

[teej]

LOL!

Ok, in your best Rod Higgins' voice pretend I'm the Wiz GM and explain to me why I would want Nazr and May (and the Great Dontell!!) so badly I'd be willing to drop back 7 spots in the draft. :biggrin:

Ok, I'm trying this for the fourth time. I'm just going to make it short and sweet, instead of typing it all out

1: Washington needs big men badly. And none are going to fall in the draft.
2: Whenever Nazzy has a defined role he has success, just look to his Ham Biscuit days, or when he was the starter for the Spurs when they won the title.
3: Ed Tapscott is in the Front Office for the Wiz, and helped draft May. If we can convince them he's fine now and has been hinderend by injury, then Tapscott should be the man to convince them the'yre getting a free lottery pick.
4: Dontell is a practice wonder of LB's, and we all know how those have worked out (see Raja Bell), and the Wiz could use a yound combo guard. He's iffy on being traded because WE need him. But he was good when we used him last year. And LB loves him. And LB has a great track record with talent.
5: Give em both 2nd rounders if thats what it takes.
6: Nothing they need is going to be there at 5 that wont be there at 12.

[spectre]

Wow...you do have an argument!

Thing is man WAS is already way over the salary cap and we can't give them any relief. They also have Haywood (whom they love...esp. at his salary), Etan Thomas and Blatche.

They need to dump salary...mainly Stevenson & James...and from what I've heard they're looking for a vet SG (don't even suggest Raja!).

As weak as I think this draft is I still don't think that package has any value. Money is going to play a part this offseason and both those guys would have to be taken on with faith.

[teej]

Wow...you do have an argument!

Thing is man WAS is already way over the salary cap and we can't give them any relief. They also have Haywood (whom they love...esp. at his salary), Etan Thomas and Blatche.

They need to dump salary...mainly Stevenson & James...and from what I've heard they're looking for a vet SG (don't even suggest Raja!).

As weak as I think this draft is I still don't think that package has any value. Money is going to play a part this offseason and both those guys would have to be taken on with faith.

Well we might be able to take out Nazzy then, just give them May and the two seconds and a future number two? Or we could take back a wing?

[Slam]

I wouldn't trade Raja and the 12 for the 5. We'd get younger, but we wouldn't get any deeper.
I would totally make that trade - then sign someone like Anthony Parker or Marquis Daniels to a MLE type contract.

Even better, sign Josh Childress.

[BETCATS]

crazy idea sign and trade (for later on in offseason since i dont think you can do sign and trades on draft night) Iverson + whatever we take at 12 for Wizards #5 pick and Deshawn Stevenson. Its absurd, but it might happen, maybe, in some parralel universe.

[SWedd523]

I would totally make that trade - then sign someone like Anthony Parker or Marquis Daniels to a MLE type contract.

Even better, sign Josh Childress.
Sure Parker or Daniels would be nice, but there's no way to know that we would be able to acquire him. There's going to be lots of nice SG's later in the first round/beginning of the second that we could pick up to back Raja.

[SWedd523]

crazy idea sign and trade (for later on in offseason since i dont think you can do sign and trades on draft night) Iverson + whatever we take at 12 for Wizards #5 pick and Deshawn Stevenson. Its absurd, but it might happen, maybe, in some parralel universe.
We could also try packaging our 12 and a young talent or cheap contract for Stevenson and the 5. That way we avoid being possibly stuck with AI ;)

[Slam]

Sure Parker or Daniels would be nice, but there's no way to know that we would be able to acquire him. There's going to be lots of nice SG's later in the first round/beginning of the second that we could pick up to back Raja.
By "him" do you mean Harden?

If so, for me the only way I would pull the trigger on the deal would be if Harden was there at #5.

No Harden, no deal.

If that was the case I would love to keep Raja and take Will or Hendo at #12.

[SWedd523]

By "him" do you mean Harden?

If so, for me the only way I would pull the trigger on the deal would be if Harden was there at #5.

No Harden, no deal.

If that was the case I would love to keep Raja and take Will or Hendo at #12.
Sorry, by "him" I meant "them" as in Daniels or Parker. Realistically speaking, we could trade Raja + 12 for Harden. But I wouldn't do that unless I was assured we'd get Parker also.

[teej]

Sorry, by "him" I meant "them" as in Daniels or Parker. Realistically speaking, we could trade Raja + 12 for Harden. But I wouldn't do that unless I was assured we'd get Parker also.

Even then I'd have to have LB's vote of confidence in both Harden and the backup 2 we would be getting, because Raja fits very well here, and Harden has shown that he might not be there when it counts...

[BETCATS]

We could also try packaging our 12 and a young talent or cheap contract for Stevenson and the 5. That way we avoid being possibly stuck with AI ;)
It would be nice, but if we are talking about 'cancers', Deshawn that has a active beef with Lebron. Lebron already plays really really good against us, we add Deshawn to the team and he will murder us every single time he sees us.

[teej]

It would be nice, but if we are talking about 'cancers', Deshawn that has a active beef with Lebron. Lebron already plays really really good against us, we add Deshawn to the team and he will murder us every single time he sees us.

And I thought half the argument with AI was he was a bad apple. You want this knucklehead?

[Slam]

Sorry, by "him" I meant "them" as in Daniels or Parker. Realistically speaking, we could trade Raja + 12 for Harden. But I wouldn't do that unless I was assured we'd get Parker also.
Gotcha. IT would be a risk, but I also think there would be other options outside of Parker and Daniels.

SG's who are UFA's:
Wally Szczerbiak
Gerald Green
Dahntay Jones
Marquis Daniels
Desmond Mason
Jarvis Hayes
Matt Barnes
Ime Udoko
Anthony Parker

SG's who are RFA's:
Jamario Moon
Rashad McCants
Ricky Davis
Josh Childress

I would think that amongst those guys we could find someone? And if worst came to worst, we could try and trade someone like Nazzy for MoPete?

[SWedd523]

SG's who are UFA's:
Wally Szczerbiak
Gerald Green
Dahntay Jones
Marquis Daniels
Desmond Mason
Jarvis Hayes
Matt Barnes
Ime Udoko
Anthony Parker

SG's who are RFA's:
Jamario Moon
Rashad McCants
Ricky Davis
Josh Childress


The bolded are the only ones I'd consider. Parker is the only one, in my mind, that would provide Rajaesque defense.


Slam, you of all people should know how much I want Harden. I just don't want that to overshadow what Raja brings to the table.


(I would love to do MoPete for Nazz regardless:p)

[Slam]

Slam, you of all people should know how much I want Harden. I just don't want that to overshadow what Raja brings to the table.
Oh man, I agree. I don't want to see Raja go either. I think he's important to our mind set as a team and the way we carry ourselves on the court and the way we go about things.'

But if trading him out got us Harden back, I would take it and run.

No knock on Raja, just the price of doing business.

[SWedd523]

Oh man, I agree. I don't want to see Raja go either. I think he's important to our mind set as a team and the way we carry ourselves on the court and the way we go about things.'

But if trading him out got us Harden back, I would take it and run.

No knock on Raja, just the price of doing business.
Just as long as we get a good backup (insurance) in the process, then I'd be okay with it.



Something else I happened onto this morning:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2009/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=DraftWatch-090521&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnba %2fdraft2009%2finsider%2fcolumns%2fstory%3fcolumni st%3dford_chad%26page%3dDraftWatch-090521

Thoughts?

[spectre]

I know you guys think Harden is "the shit" :p...but remember LB's charge is to win now. Because we're so young Raja is an integral part in that and none of those guys you listed can bring the leadership he does.

Not saying you guys don't value him as your last posts reassure that...but I don't think that you're valuing him enough for what he actually does for our other guys on the court.

We put another "body" like Parker, MoPete, etc. on the court in Raja's place I'll guarantee you our chance of making the playoffs will get slimmer.

I appreciate wanting Harden for the future, but the focus is on now.

[SWedd523]

I know you guys think Harden is "the shit" :p...but remember LB's charge is to win now. Because we're so young Raja is an integral part in that and none of those guys you listed can bring the leadership he does.

Not saying you guys don't value him as your last posts reassure that...but I don't think that you're valuing him enough for what he actually does for our other guys on the court.

We put another "body" like Parker, MoPete, etc. on the court in Raja's place I'll guarantee you our chance of making the playoffs will get slimmer.

I appreciate wanting Harden for the future, but the focus is on now.

I only think it would work with bringing in someone else to play behind him. With the growth of Ray and Boris, I can see them providing enough leadership. Plus, Parker in particular is a very solid defender and wouldn't leave much of a drop off as far as on court performance goes.

[hbk999]

Ok, I'm trying this for the fourth time. I'm just going to make it short and sweet, instead of typing it all out

1: Washington needs big men badly. And none are going to fall in the draft.
2: Whenever Nazzy has a defined role he has success, just look to his Ham Biscuit days, or when he was the starter for the Spurs when they won the title.
3: Ed Tapscott is in the Front Office for the Wiz, and helped draft May. If we can convince them he's fine now and has been hinderend by injury, then Tapscott should be the man to convince them the'yre getting a free lottery pick.
4: Dontell is a practice wonder of LB's, and we all know how those have worked out (see Raja Bell), and the Wiz could use a yound combo guard. He's iffy on being traded because WE need him. But he was good when we used him last year. And LB loves him. And LB has a great track record with talent.
5: Give em both 2nd rounders if thats what it takes.
6: Nothing they need is going to be there at 5 that wont be there at 12.

Heres a better one: We give them #12 and Raymond Felton for Gilbert Arenas....thats about as possible as this idea :). Seriously though, trading up to #5 may have to include Felton (RFA) or DJ and our #12. The talk is that the Wiz may want to move Arenas to SG and with Butler,Jamison,and Arenas all locked into big contracts,a young cheap option would probably appeal to them. No matter what happens in the top 5, we would then be in position to get either Jordan Hill that fills a need in the frontcourt..or Harden,who fills a need in the backcourt.

[Slam]

I know you guys think Harden is "the shit" :p...but remember LB's charge is to win now. Because we're so young Raja is an integral part in that and none of those guys you listed can bring the leadership he does.

Not saying you guys don't value him as your last posts reassure that...but I don't think that you're valuing him enough for what he actually does for our other guys on the court.

We put another "body" like Parker, MoPete, etc. on the court in Raja's place I'll guarantee you our chance of making the playoffs will get slimmer.

I appreciate wanting Harden for the future, but the focus is on now.
Harden and a "body" backing him up would help us win a lot more than Raja and a "body" will.

You were right into Mayo last draft? I think that Harden is better than Mayo FWIW.

[Dead_Real]

Strong statement right now I take Mayo I just see him being one of the future greats (if he stays healthy) along with , Roy, Durant & Roes he reminds me of young Kobe.

[spectre]

Harden and a "body" backing him up would help us win a lot more than Raja and a "body" will.

You were right into Mayo last draft? I think that Harden is better than Mayo FWIW.

Only because I wanted a star and I figured he had the best shot as anyone. Besides, we had Crash & Richardson and there was thinking they didn't really compliment one another; we don't have that type of combo now. Jordan wanted to trade the farm for Westbrook too. Maybe that would have panned out, but right now and in the next couple of years at least Crash is going to be better so I'm happy we didn't do that one too.

I haven't seen this guy, so maybe he is the Second Coming...but really if he was all that wouldn't he be contending for the top spot instead of the 4/5?

I know how people fall in love with college kids in the draft.


I only think it would work with bringing in someone else to play behind him. With the growth of Ray and Boris, I can see them providing enough leadership. Plus, Parker in particular is a very solid defender and wouldn't leave much of a drop off as far as on court performance goes.

We looked pretty clueless to me at the end of the season when Raja went down...we only won one game. I don't think Felton has grown enough nor do I think Boris has made that great leap. Maybe they can during the next season (we'd better hope or we need to rethink them both).

We still need Raja Bell.

[SWedd523]

I haven't seen this guy, so maybe he is the Second Coming...but really if he was all that wouldn't he be contending for the top spot instead of the 4/5?
He was the number 2 up until the NCAA tournament where he had a less than stellar performance. He also plays for a team that isn't that great and doesn't get much attention.

[Slam]

I haven't seen this guy, so maybe he is the Second Coming...but really if he was all that wouldn't he be contending for the top spot instead of the 4/5?
He had a couple of bad games in the tourney and a lot of folks started bashing him seemingly forgetting about the 20/6/4/2 he put all all season on 49/36/76% shooting. He did the same thing his rookie season so you can tell it was no fluke.

All of a sudden people started saying he was fat and slow and his body type/motor would be a liability at the NBA level. I've said from day #1 that I think that's hog wash and he'll blow people away at the combines.

In saying that, we all know that bigs are a hot commodity in the NBA so guys like Griffin and Thabeet are almost a default to go ahead of him. Add in the sexy pick of an 18 year old Euro PG and Harden moves down a little.

Either way, he's a top tier talent and PERFECT for what we need.

Totally hear what you are saying about the Mayo love you had last year. I was in the same boat. He would have been great. But we aren't that different this year. Raja is a great pairing to have with Crash, but Harden would be THAT much better.

[Slam]

Strong statement right now I take Mayo I just see him being one of the future greats (if he stays healthy) along with , Roy, Durant & Roes he reminds me of young Kobe.
I really like Mayo and my comment wasn't a knock on him at all, I just think that Harden is a better team and system player than Mayo is. That actually might end up meaning Mayo is better than Harden because he has that attitude, but for what we are building and the way I think LB will have us playing, Harden will be better.

[spectre]

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft/2009/

DX now has Harden at 3 ahead of Rubio. They still have us taking Henderson.

DX is also saying that Milwaukee is taking Flynn and that their management is thinking they'll have to let Sessions walk due to "excessive" contract demands.

Thank God we aren't Milwaukee.

[Keetch]

49% FG% for Harden is pretty nice; reminds me of Brandon Roy when he was in the draft. Roy is bigger though and more athletic(?). Man I love efficient players like that.

Trade the 12 and Raja for Harden? Man, you better be a believer like Slam to do that one though. I just don't know enough about Harden.

If Anthony Parker is a UFA; I'd be surprised if LB didn't go after him. The main problem with that may be that Parker will want to go to a team where he starts and the Bobcats are capped out. We'd have to find a way to drop salary first.

Mayo...you know I just don't care for him; didn't last year and still don't. Here's my impressions: he just seems to be another one of those over-hyped types who can never live up to his persona. He peeked in the 11th grade :). He's a tweener between SG and PG; but really can't play the point. Isn't THAT great of a shooter to be a great SG; streaky at best. All that plus I fear that like AI; he's a guy that the team must rotate around and feed constantly for him to be at all effective. Good for him; bad for the team.

Now before you all go off on me; I'll ADMIT right here that Mayo wasn't near as greedy as I thought he might be and he DID put up very nice rookie numbers. Still I'll wait a bit more before I believe. I don't think he'll age well or that it'll all end well.

[BobCatsFanInTx]

People keep talking like Harden is going to be a top five pick but most mocks actually have him falling as far as 12 to our Bobcats so I wouldn't jump the gun about trading up to five to get him.

[Slam]

People keep talking like Harden is going to be a top five pick but most mocks actually have him falling as far as 12 to our Bobcats so I wouldn't jump the gun about trading up to five to get him.
Where have you seen him mocked going #12 or lower?

Post the links.

[SWedd523]

People keep talking like Harden is going to be a top five pick but most mocks actually have him falling as far as 12 to our Bobcats so I wouldn't jump the gun about trading up to five to get him.
You will not see Harden go lower than 6. He's a steal anywhere below 3.

[ohara831]

Where have you seen him mocked going #12 or lower?

Post the links.

On the mock drafts I've seen, I've seen him go as high as #3, but no later than #6 to Minny. If there is one who may drop to us at #12, it's Tyreke Evans. And I would be thrilled if he fell to #12. But that is a long shot.

[Dead_Real]

I really like Mayo and my comment wasn't a knock on him at all, I just think that Harden is a better team and system player than Mayo is. That actually might end up meaning Mayo is better than Harden because he has that attitude, but for what we are building and the way I think LB will have us playing, Harden will be better.
See that Kobe like attitude is what we need more of imo we have a couple of unselfish guys already were not hurting for system players compared to a takeover guy which is hard to find I'm hoping it's DJ14. Felts has that killer instinct & GW at times but questionable jumpers hurt them.

I haven't seen Harden lower than the Knicks pick Evans & Derozen have falling to us on a realgm mock & NBADraft.net.

[teej]

See that Kobe like attitude is what we need more of imo we have a couple of unselfish guys already were not hurting for system players compared to a takeover guy which is hard to find I'm hoping it's DJ14. Felts has that killer instinct & GW at times but questionable jumpers hurt them.

I haven't seen Harden lower than the Knicks pick Evans & Derozen have falling to us on a realgm mock & NBADraft.net.

Yeah, that's why I'm not too high on guys like Harden for us, I'd be thrilled if we got him at 12, but it's not happening. What you said is why I was calling for AI, or out of the draft maybe Tyreke Evans, but other than him I haven't seen really any "selfish" guys, gerald Henderson probably is one, but there isn't really much.

[Dead_Real]

Yeah, that's why I'm not too high on guys like Harden for us, I'd be thrilled if we got him at 12, but it's not happening. What you said is why I was calling for AI, or out of the draft maybe Tyreke Evans, but other than him I haven't seen really any "selfish" guys, gerald Henderson probably is one, but there isn't really much.
I think he could develop that quality overtime just needs to show it more.

[BRNC]

Lowest I've seen him is 6...I'd be shocked if he dropped to us but I would not trade up to get him...at this point if I make a trade for a 2 it would be for a vet....IMO none of the SGs is a lock (even as a starter) in the draft this year...the only way I'd trade up is if he goes below 6 and we can package the #12 with our second(s)...then (for me ) it would be worth it and possibly doable...

[ELEVATION]

Maybe the Bobcats are trading there 1st round pick because if you go to the website there is no draft central about workouts or players..all the other teams in the lottery have a draft central on their site..just a thought??

[Slam]

Maybe the Bobcats are trading there 1st round pick because if you go to the website there is no draft central about workouts or players..all the other teams in the lottery have a draft central on their site..just a thought??
Really? What teams have their workout schedules up? I've been checking and haven't seen any?

[spectre]

As I mentioned on another thread there's a lot of stuff that hasn't been updated on their site. Player descriptions of Raja still have the Suns' uniform on, and they just updated Boris' profile to a Bobcats' jersey.

Most likely the employee cuts are the cause.

[ohara831]

ESPN Rumors has on it that NO Hornets are looking to trade out of the #21 spot so as not to add another guaranteed Contract. If we landed #21 to go with #12, could prove to get two solid players.

[SWedd523]

ESPN Rumors has on it that NO Hornets are looking to trade out of the #21 spot so as not to add another guaranteed Contract. If we landed #21 to go with #12, could prove to get two solid players.
DX has Eric Maynor going in that spot. I've been very high on him for a couple of years now. Biggger, more physical guard that LB would like. Might make DJ expendable... ;)

[Dead_Real]

NBADraft.net rumors


Washington to Trade Out of 5th Pick?There is speculation that the Wizards will look to move their 5th pick and trade down looking to dump a salary in the process. Washington has a ton of money locked up in Gilbert Arenas, Antawn Jamison and Caron Butler and would like to improve their cap situation in any way possible. They don't see this as being a strong draft or a player worthy of the 5th selection being available.

A number of teams could potentially look to move up to the 5th pick targeting players such as Jordan Hill, Stephen Curry or Tyreke Evans.
http://www.nbadraft.net/node/6571

[jpf_v2.0]

I read this on Hoopshype a few minutes ago. It'd be interesting to get #5 (Jordan Hill) but I can't see us being able to take any salary.

[BRNC]

I read this on Hoopshype a few minutes ago. It'd be interesting to get #5 (Jordan Hill) but I can't see us being able to take any salary.

Salary...that was the problem I had with the Dallas (Diop) and Lakers (Vlad) trades last year...we simply killed any wiggle room we had...:hypo:

[Slam]

I have read that the Bulls are high on Henderson. Wonder if we could draft him and trade him for #16 and Tyrus (providing T-Will is still there at #16)?

[spectre]

I have read that the Bulls are high on Henderson. Wonder if we could draft him and trade him for #16 and Tyrus (providing T-Will is still there at #16)?

I dare you to put that on the trade board. Personally I think it's fair but I'm not a huge fan of TT, mainly because I think he has a low BBIQ. Thing is tho Chicago fans have suddenly come to the conclusion that all their assets are golden because of that one playoff series.

The majority thinks they should be able to get Minny's 6th pick straight up for Hinrich.

[Ghost Kat]

I have read that the Bulls are high on Henderson. Wonder if we could draft him and trade him for #16 and Tyrus (providing T-Will is still there at #16)?

Personally I think this is a great idea, I doubt we could pull it off. But It's still fills our major needs. Thomas is a good player, Probably not a reliable stater at crunch time but still add's alot on defense and low post. As long as we still get a SG. I don't think Williams will make it past the top 15 though.

[Slam]

I dare you to put that on the trade board. Personally I think it's fair but I'm not a huge fan of TT, mainly because I think he has a low BBIQ. Thing is tho Chicago fans have suddenly come to the conclusion that all their assets are golden because of that one playoff series.

The majority thinks they should be able to get Minny's 6th pick straight up for Hinrich.
Really? I haven't been following the trade board that closely. Typical though. They were all calling for TT and Noah's heads and now they love them?

How about perfect world sort of stuff?

Felts or DJ for Harden
#12 (Henderson) for #16 (T-Will) and #26 (best PG left on the board)

DJ - Collison? - TMNT
Raja - Harden
Crash - T-Will
Boris - Lexy - McMay
EO50 - Gana - Nazzy

[spectre]

I'm starting to worry about you and your attempts to include Felton in a trade. Just won't face reality eh? :p

I can see them doing the 12th for their two 1sts if they're really high on someone like Henderson though. Thing is, if he really is a Raja clone I'd bet LB would have a very hard time letting lose of him.

[Slam]

I'm starting to worry about you and your attempts to include Felton in a trade. Just won't face reality eh? :p
It's more just looking for the right combination at the 1&2. I want two guys that will compliment each other. I think that DJ (because of his shooting) would compliment T-Will more at the 2. I also think that DJ would compliment Henderson more at the 2.

On the other hand, I think that Felts would be great with Harden at the two and with someone like Ben Gordon (not saying we should get Gordon, just using him as an example) at the 2.

Know what I mean?

Can't Felts be traded after 30 days of re-signing? Couldn't he be traded at a later date for someone that was drafted...........like Artest was in the deal that involved Donte Greene going from the Rockets to the Kings last year?

[spectre]

Can't Felts be traded after 30 days of re-signing? Couldn't he be traded at a later date for someone that was drafted...........like Artest was in the deal that involved Donte Greene going from the Rockets to the Kings last year?

A re-signed FA (or RFA) can't be traded for 3 months or around Dec. 15...which ever is later from the time he signs a contract. He'd then be BYC, and that's why most rookies after they sign their next contract after their rookie deal seldom gets traded until a year has elapsed.

So under your scenario, the team that drafted the player would have to hold onto him for a third of the season, be willing to move him for a 5th year player who most say is around average who won't be on a great contract (tho hopefully a decent one) AND have the capspace to absorb the difference.

It ain't happening.

[Slam]

I must be confusing the Rox/Kings trade last year. Maybe it was because they had to wait a period of time after Greene signed his rookie contract before they could make the trade official? Remember - everyone knew about it for about a month before it could be announced?

[jpf_v2.0]

Draft picks can't be traded for 30 days after signing their contract.

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q85

Gotta love Larry Coon!

[spectre]

Heh, and what I was referencing to was right above that:



For three months or until December 15th of that season (whichever is later) after signing a contract as a free agent. This obviously does not apply to the trade completing a sign-and-trade transaction (see question number 76 (http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q76)). Interestingly, however, it is unclear whether this rule prevents a player who has been signed-and-traded from being traded agiain prior to three months/December 15 (see question number 80 (http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q80)).
For 30 days after signing as a draft pick.


I must be confusing the Rox/Kings trade last year. Maybe it was because they had to wait a period of time after Greene signed his rookie contract before they could make the trade official? Remember - everyone knew about it for about a month before it could be announced?Are you confused about the rookie contract (Greene) or Artest? In your scenario it isn't the draftee that's making it difficult, it's Felton and his RFA status.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3510261

Ah, here's the thing; Artest had an opt out but didn't excercise it...so he was still under contract. Not a FA. Wasn't he threatening to opt out and that was why the Kings traded him?

[BRNC]

spectre...he decided not to opt and then got pissed because he did not opt...Kings decided to trade him because they did not want to extend him and he wanted an extension...

[spectre]

spectre...he decided not to opt and then got pissed because he did not opt...Kings decided to trade him because they did not want to extend him and he wanted an extension...

That's right...I remember now. Thanks BRNC.

Slam, just remember how difficult Mek was to deal in regards to trade last season. Same thing. The difference after December 15th will be their salaries. Because Mek is near to 10 million you'd only have to add another contract in the 4-5 range to get within the 125% spread. Since Felton will probably only make around 6 million a lot would have to be added to get to the 125%.

[Slam]

Ah, here's the thing; Artest had an opt out but didn't excercise it...so he was still under contract. Not a FA. Wasn't he threatening to opt out and that was why the Kings traded him?
BINGO!!

That was it. I knew I wasn't going nutty! I knew there were a couple of factors and that was one and as jpf_v2.0 pointed out, the 30 days rookie rule is the other.

If Felts re-signs over the summer, is his next years salary in a trade:

Equal to his QO
Equal to the 1st year of his extension
A portion of either?

(hope that makes sense)

[spectre]

BINGO!!

That was it. I knew I wasn't going nutty! I knew there were a couple of factors and that was one and as jpf_v2.0 pointed out, the 30 days rookie rule is the other.

If Felts re-signs over the summer, is his next years salary in a trade:

Equal to his QO
Equal to the 1st year of his extension
A portion of either?

(hope that makes sense)

Yeah, that's why that particular trade had to wait a month. In our situation it'd have to be put off for 3 months...and I don't know if that's ever happened.

Do you mean what salary do we base BYC on? If he signs a contract this summer it will be last year's salary of 4,148,715 (per ESPN's trade machine). Figure the 20% increase and that means anything over 4,978,458 and he becomes BYC.

I can't imagine him starting out over a half million less than his QO his first year on a new deal.

[jpf_v2.0]

A player remains a base year player for six months, or until June 30, whichever comes later. When trading a base year player, the salary used for comparison is the player's previous salary, or 50% of the first-year salary in his new contract, whichever is greater.

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q73

[spectre]

^ Isn't it wild how they throw out that 6 months, slip in June 30th and as an after thought put in that "later" word? Since you can't even TALK to FAs until after July 1st it's almost guaranteed the date will be June 30th, which will be almost a full year.