Lakers, Magic show that small lineups no way to go

[spectre]

Daily Herald (http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=299041)


No matter which team wins the championship, the two NBA Finals participants already have sent a clear message about team makeup - taller is definitely better. Smaller lineups might give opponents some problems and lead to modest playoff success. But to win big in the NBA, teams need to play big.

Look at how the Lakers, Orlando and last year's champs, the Boston Celtics, line up. All three teams are big on the inside and tall on the perimeter. There is room for an undersized player (Derek Fisher, Rafer Alston), but the count should stop at one.

The players taking the majority of late-game shots for those teams can shoot over the top of most defenders. The Lakers have 6-foot-6 Kobe Bryant, Orlando has 6-8 Hedo Turkoglu and 6-10 Rashard Lewis, while Boston's 6-7 Paul Pierce and 6-5 Ray Allen did plenty of damage against the Bulls in this year's playoffs.


All three teams also have or had a taller defensive specialist - Trevor Ariza, Mickael Pietrus and ex-Celtic James Posey - not that those guys are ever expected to shut down an opposing scorer completely.


Other recent NBA champs, such as San Antonio and Detroit, fit the same mold. The '06 Heat had a smaller two guard, but Dwyane Wade was good enough to make it work.
Mismatches. Taller guards.


Though we've not been following this criteria one thing I did notice last night...both the Lakers & the Magic played the 4th quarter with point/forwards vs. utilizing PGs to set the plays.


We have that piece anyway.

[jstar5]

I originally posted this yesterday, or so I thought I did! So, here goes rd 2.

I believe that if we continue to successully use Diaw as a facilitator/point forward then DJ will ultimately be the best fit for this team.

With Diaw thriving in that role you need a pg that can work well off the ball AND consistently knock down 46-48% of open jumpers and 40-42% from 3. To me, DJ truly has that potential. With running this type of offense it's also crucial to have a pg that's effective running the pick-and-roll/pop, the edge goes to DJ here too.

That's why I would give up anything outside of DJ, Bell, Diaw, and Oak to get a re-signed Bosh (I know, I'm only asking for the impossible right?!?). Bosh and DJ running pick-and-rolls, Diaw allowing Bell and DJ to spread the floor, all while maintaining our defensive integrity, sounds like playoffs to me!

The questions I would have w/ that team would be how much less effective would Diaw be at sf, and how to beef up the bench w/ so much salary tied up btwn the sf-c positions? But getting Bosh is a pipe dream, I know.

[spectre]

I originally posted this yesterday, or so I thought I did! So, here goes rd 2.

Wow, my apologies. I didn't see it. Maybe someone can merge the two?


I believe that if we continue to successully use Diaw as a facilitator/point forward then DJ will ultimately be the best fit for this team.

With Diaw thriving in that role you need a pg that can work well off the ball AND consistently knock down 46-48% of open jumpers and 40-42% from 3. To me, DJ truly has that potential. With running this type of offense it's also crucial to have a pg that's effective running the pick-and-roll/pop, the edge goes to DJ here too.That's somewhat similar to how the Lakers and the Magic are utilizing their guards...shooters instead of facilitators. Same with Cleveland. The one difference between them and us however is that DJ would be one of (if not the) primary scorers for us; Alston, Fish & West are more in a supportive role in regards to scoring.

In your scenario where we add in Bosh it would certainly help as he'd be the #1 offensive threat. The problem as I see it however is we'd be moving Boris to the 3, and that's not his best position at all. His defense drops off dramatically vs. the 4 and it puts him out along the perimeter offensively (Bosh's offense is pretty much right where Boris' is). We could switch out Crash for Boris, but then we'd lose the point/forward advantage that most successful teams seem to be utilizing.

I think our "star" player has to be at either the 2, 3 or the 5 (assuming Chris Paul isn't coming to Charlotte anytime soon). I like Crash's skill set and I think it compliments Boris at the 4 very well, so my 1st line of untouchables would be Crash & Boris. I like the PG rotation we have, so I'm putting Felton & DJ in my 2nd group. Regardless of who starts, I think they have different skill sets that combine to make that spot superior to a lot of other teams.

Mek is a different animal, mainly because of his contract. However, since we're talking about forming a contending team I'd put him just below tier 2 because he such a great defender.

Felton/DJ

Crash
Boris
Mek

A star 2 would do it I think, esp. if we address the depth issue.

Of course this doesn't even touch on "bigger" players as the article is pointing at. I think the above scenario gets us near, but having an advantage (or two) we could exploit would probably be what makes us a true contender.

[GoBobs]

pg Diaw
sg Wallace
sf Ajinca
pf Mek
c Diop

that would be plenty big

[jstar5]

Sorry for the confusion Spectre, when I said I originally posted this I was referring to my post. I posted a response yesterday but it didn't actually post for some reason, so I typed it out again this morning.

I understand getting a star 2 guard. And that was my main concern in my lineup, moving Diaw to the 3 spot. Honestly, though, I just don't see Crash as being a necessity or untouchable for this team's success, or Okafor for that matter. Now, granted you would have to get star quality back in any scenario where those two would be lost.

I guess what I'm saying is I just don't see the team being truly successful while those two are our anchors. Playoffs maybe, deep in the playoffs no.

[spectre]

You could be right. Like you I do think we can at least get into the playoffs, and with some depth can probably push into the 2nd round. It's a process though; we get as far as we can as is (core) and then we start tweaking/possibly making a bigger move.

In regards to Crash I put him in the first tier because he compliments Boris so well. Ying to his Yang. Boris isn't the best rebounder...Crash was the best SF rebounder in the NBA. So long as we have Boris at the 4 I think we have to have someone like Crash at the 3.

I do think Mek is the most expendable.

[teej]

In regards to Crash I put him in the first tier because he compliments Boris so well. Ying to his Yang. Boris isn't the best rebounder...Crash was the best SF rebounder in the NBA. So long as we have Boris at the 4 I think we have to have someone like Crash at the 3.

I do think Mek is the most expendable.

Amen, but I think for us that's the only way to go for us. Crash really can't play the two. and for us, Boris wasn't effective at the three. We're not like the Magic or Lakers, and that gives us a matchup advantage with them.

[110oldeast]

This writer only got PART of the equation. Sure size is nice, but VERSATILITY and guys who can knock down the shots from the wing and SPREAD THE FLOOR are more important than simply being big. If it were simply about being big, you would see many more minutes with Gortat and Howard going against Gasol and Bynum. However, as those lineups clog things, you won't see much of that.

Heck, Boston ran Posey at the 4 a bunch last year vs. the Lakers b/c he could knock down the outside jumper and spread the floor while being defensively versatile is important. Guys like Pietrus and Ariza can defend multiple players but also shoot the ball. So can guys like Odom and Posey for the Celtics last year. Add in the shooting ability of big men like Gasol and KG to go along with wing shooters like Allen, Pierce, and House, Lewis Turkoglu, Lee, etc. from Orlando, and LA's various players that includes almost everyone they put on the floor outside of Bynum.

People can keep talking down the jumper all they want, but there is a reason the teams that have made it to the last 2 finals have, while teams of athletes with mediocre shooting like Philly and Atlanta go home.

Guys like Diaw and Vlad actually help us. If Gerald could learn to knock down the corner or wing 3 it would add to things. Outside of that, the main missing component is a guy who can post and draw double teams. Crash and Diaw are our closest options, but a true post offensive player would go a ways.

All that said, I agree with spectre that a big time 2 guard would be huge for us.