Did The Bobcats Re-Sign Dontell Jefferson?

[WhatTheHeel74]

I was looking at the Bobcats roster and I noticed that #2 Dontell Jefferson was still on it. I remember him from the end of last season but I don't remember hearing anything about us re-signing him. Is this just a mistake by the Bobcats website people or did we re-sign him and I just didn't hear about it? I aslo noticed that Juwan Howard, Cartier Martin and Sean Singletary are also on the roster but have (FA) beside their names so are they like restricted free agents and still on the team or what? Sorry I went a few months after the season without following the team except for the draft. Thanks

[Muttley]

I was looking at the Bobcats roster and I noticed that #2 Dontell Jefferson was still on it. I remember him from the end of last season but I don't remember hearing anything about us re-signing him. Is this just a mistake by the Bobcats website people or did we re-sign him and I just didn't hear about it? I aslo noticed that Juwan Howard, Cartier Martin and Sean Singletary are also on the roster but have (FA) beside their names so are they like restricted free agents and still on the team or what? Sorry I went a few months after the season without following the team except for the draft. Thanks

I think he's got a guaranteed minimum contract. Can't find any literature on it, though.

[teej]

Rod confirmed right around the draft I think that we had picked up his option for the league minimum.

[WhatTheHeel74]

Rod confirmed right around the draft I think that we had picked up his option for the league minimum.

Okay thanks, I would think they would release him if we do sign McCants.

[teej]

Okay thanks, I would think they would release him if we do sign McCants.

I doubt it, maybe trade him with someone else, but he's a project LB is high on, and McCants shores up any Raja injury issues.

[WhatTheHeel74]

I doubt it, maybe trade him with someone else, but he's a project LB is high on, and McCants shores up any Raja injury issues.

Who would we trade him with? Mohammed?

[teej]

Who would we trade him with? Mohammed?

Nazzy, Diop, Radman, Raja, DJ, etc.

[WhatTheHeel74]

Nazzy, Diop, Radman, Raja, DJ, etc.

What is it witht he NBA, we just drafted D.J. Augustin and we would trade him a year later?

This is why I don't buy NBA jersey's, I have 1 and it's an Iverson and I never thought he would be traded from Philly.

[teej]

What is it witht he NBA, we just drafted D.J. Augustin and we would trade him a year later?

This is why I don't buy NBA jersey's, I have 1 and it's an Iverson and I never thought he would be traded from Philly.

Only the best are safe. LeBron, Kobe, D-Wade, Bosh, etc. won't be traded. Other than that, anyone's fair game if it helps improve your team. Isn't that the goal?

And it's not like the MLB is any better, and NFL players just leave via free agency instead. NHL has trades, soccer has buyouts or whatever...find me a sport without a ton of player movement...even NASCAR does!

[ammofan]

as far as the other guys you wanted to know about here is there situation.....

Cartier Martin: Plays in Italy now.....but played for GSW in Summer League and looked great!
Singletary: He's gone....a FA
Howard: also a FA.....

[dav7z]

as far as the other guys you wanted to know about here is there situation.....

Cartier Martin: Plays in Italy now.....but played for GSW in Summer League and looked great!
Singletary: He's gone....a FA
Howard: also a FA.....

Hear is a list of free agents left .[ Jefferson is on that list] I don't think hes got any garnteed money.

I say hell we shoud just sign McCants and G Green . Both have skills . Both have pop off the beanch, Both have a lot of up side .
Im ready to get this season started , That means management get off your ass all ready and try and make the best of this season.
http://hoopshype.com/free_agency.htm

Knowing side show BOB we wont add no one else and play the season with 13 players????????????

[teej]

Knowing side show BOB we wont add no one else and play the season with 13 players????????????

Most of the rest of the NBA is doing the same exact thing, it's not like we're any exception to a rule...

[dav7z]

Most of the rest of the NBA is doing the same exact thing, it's not like we're any exception to a rule...

Most other teams are carring any where from 13 to 17 right now . The Rockets have 17 under contract . Its only three or four teams thet only have 13. Besides if Jefferson is not commited we siting at twelve . Less than the league minium.


You seem to be happy with this do nothing management . Surely you don't have season tickets///// Our only off season move was giving our center with a number 25th ranking in the NBA for a center with a ranking of 146th ranking .

To me thats not great strides to get better?
L Brown or MJ can't spend a thing because of side show . If they could have we would have AI right now . Explain how you can defend Side show BOB JOHNSON. He would sell his left nut if he thought it would make him a dollar.


BTW ,AI has about sold out the GRIZZ arena for the season . And jerseys with his number have run out and can't be found???????

All i can say again is good move BOB????

How can thease off season moves or no moves be defended??????????????????

How do you get the number 13 when ever other other team has 14 to 18 players under contract??????????

http://www.nba.com/teams/teamIndividualLinks.html?title=Team%20Roster&file=roster

Show how this average is 13

[spectre]

I think a lot of people are underestimating what we already have and potentially how much better we'll be with an offseason to work with.

Remember...our starting 5 was 6th in the league in plus/minus and at one point 3rd in defense. Considering the group we had up until that Phoenix trade IMO that's a heck of an accomplishiment.

All we lacked really was depth at the 2 and it certainly sounds like Henderson will cover that...and we might also add McCants for deep firepower (the only weakness left at the guard spots). A strong backup 4 would be nice, but with our new more versatile Center I think we'll have that more covered than last year...plus I expect Nazr to demand more PT, thus giving us that midrange threat.

I'm very optimistic about this season.

Not that I'm a fan of Johnson, but I've always maintained that I wouldn't want to pay the luxury tax for a non-playoff team either...so IMO he's not been cheap at all.

I still feel strongly that not getting AI was a Larry Brown decision, not Johnson's.

[dav7z]

I think a lot of people are underestimating what we already have and potentially how much better we'll be with an offseason to work with.

Remember...our starting 5 was 6th in the league in plus/minus and at one point 3rd in defense. Considering the group we had up until that Phoenix trade IMO that's a heck of an accomplishiment.

All we lacked really was depth at the 2 and it certainly sounds like Henderson will cover that...and we might also add McCants for deep firepower (the only weakness left at the guard spots). A strong backup 4 would be nice, but with our new more versatile Center I think we'll have that more covered than last year...plus I expect Nazr to demand more PT, thus giving us that midrange threat.

I'm very optimistic about this season.

Not that I'm a fan of Johnson, but I've always maintained that I wouldn't want to pay the luxury tax for a non-playoff team either...so IMO he's not been cheap at all.

I still feel strongly that not getting AI was a Larry Brown decision, not Johnson's.

You can't say TC inproves the team?? MEK was ranked the 25th best player in the league last year . TC was ranked 146th . We got no other compansation out of it not even a pick.
Its was just a long term savings for BOB.
It wouldn't take luxury tax to sign McCants and G Green about all thets left.
BOB don't give a damn if we lose. He proved that by not signing AI.
Most rosters are set by now but BOB is to cheap to sign even a minium contract[McCANTS]

I am looking for a trade , a trade like Bunkner and a scrub for Bell any thing thet would save BOB a dollar.
Spectre you can't really belive L Brown or MJ are making desisions any more.Im thinking Brown is gone if MJ don't buy this team by the start of next season.
Henderson is a unproven rookie and Bob isn't spending for a p/f . Even S May thinks it's stupid .
What about Felton , We really havn't offered him a damn thing . I can't even find where we have offered him any thing . And if the quilifing offer wasn't offered so early BOB would not have offered that to Felton.
How do feel well in the direction Bob is taking this too??

[spectre]

When has Larry Brown NOT bitched to the media when his FO does something against his wishes? Since he hasn't by now I have to think HE was the deciding factor in this and not Johnson.

Why wouldn't Johnson want to increase revenue? Everyone knew AI would add more to the bottom line in tix sales & jersies, so it makes no sense that he wouldn't want to sign AI for 1 year at a paltry 3 million give or take.

It wouldn't surprise me if Johnson was the guy PUSHING to get AI, Brown wasn't and Brown won.

Forget the rankings (Mek vs. Chandler) and think about "fit". It's the exact same thing (hopefully) that the PHO trade did for us. Overall Richardson was the better player, but there's no arguing that the trade did much more for us than it did for them.

Mek's contract was an albatross and it was going to hurt us eventually, esp. since Larry Brown wasn't happy with him anyway. I think we got someone Larry wanted in TC...so in that respect yes, I think we got better from the trade.

Just like with the PHO deal though, "value wise" we should have gotten more.

[dav7z]

Larry stated he like AI and would love to have him , But feared we didn't have the funds . Again tight ass BOB . TC might be decent and Mek wasn't Browns favorite . But Brown is to smart to get raped like that . We would have got more but the dollar signs flashed in BOBS eyes.
If Brown was in charge he would have signed a p/f and a s/g at a minium contract while it was a few decent players left. Tight asss BoB isn't signing any one.

BOB is running this team and he expects to run it into the ground . Cutting any money he can be for he sells. I would not be supprized to see Wallace moved be for season end for expirings . Diaw is another contract i might expect to see moved. Bell he can cut ties next season so we might keep him .
I hope somthing changes but i don't see much hope for the Cats in the near fucture unless a sale is made be for season starts.

[spectre]

That was just Brown being polite.

We went after Bass and we went after Warrick. From what Warrick said he made his decision based on PT...which insinuates we were at least close to what he got from the Bucks, around 3.5 million.

Appears we were willing to spend the money on Warrick...why not AI?

I don't think Brown is negotiating the trades, only signing off on the players involved.

Hence my lollipop avatar.

[dav7z]

Spectre im not so sure we went after those guys that had if at all ? Sure it states we did but i have a feeling we gave a late low ball bid for those guys?

Rosters states Jefferson is NOT a guarnteed contract. But we still sitting back doing nothing to sign guys like McCants and Green or a dozen other free agents left .
Help me explain that one?


http://www.nba.com/teams/teamIndividualLinks.html?title=Team%20Roster&file=roster

[spectre]

:shrug:

Dunno what to tell you...reports say that we did go after Warrick along with Milwuakee, Philly & the Cavs. The Cavs have only their BAE (around 1.9 million) and Philly won't spend any money as they're pushing the tax limit too (HEH, you think we're cheap!). The ONLY competition money wise to the Bucks had to have been us.


But we still sitting back doing nothing to sign guys like McCants and Green or a dozen other free agents left .
Help me explain that one?Cuz they're pretty much crap?

There's a reason those guys aren't signed yet.

[Scottley Crue]

Just making moves to make moves is rarely a good thing. Just because other teams make moves don't guarentee they'll work. Remeber, historically, Brown's teams take a leap in the second year. With most of the main players coming back for round 2, that make me optimistic about the upcoming season.

Also, I really don't like defending Bob, but I will say this...most teams in the selling situation dump talent for salary like crazy and try to stay barely above the salary floor. Bob's not doing that. He just doesn't want to pay the luxury tax.

[dav7z]

:shrug:

Dunno what to tell you...reports say that we did go after Warrick along with Milwuakee, Philly & the Cavs. The Cavs have only their BAE (around 1.9 million) and Philly won't spend any money as they're pushing the tax limit too (HEH, you think we're cheap!). The ONLY competition money wise to the Bucks had to have been us.

Cuz they're pretty much crap?

There's a reason those guys aren't signed yet.

Agreeded whats out thair is getting close to crap. But Jefferson is not even in the same league as McCants a Green.
Most teams have between 14 and 18 players on thair roster. 15 being about average.We have 12 if Jefferson is not guarnteed. Whitch he is stated a free agent on our roster.
Does any one think we should keep Jefferson over McCants and Green.


Do any of you guys really think LB or MJ is in control of and personal moves this season.
If i hadn't all ready paid for my season tickets . I would not buy them now the way this off season has been. I can handle loseing but i can't stand management not giving a damn.

[dav7z]

Just making moves to make moves is rarely a good thing. Just because other teams make moves don't guarentee they'll work. Remeber, historically, Brown's teams take a leap in the second year. With most of the main players coming back for round 2, that make me optimistic about the upcoming season.

Also, I really don't like defending Bob, but I will say this...most teams in the selling situation dump talent for salary like crazy and try to stay barely above the salary floor. Bob's not doing that. He just doesn't want to pay the luxury tax.


Adding minium contracts is not making big moves . Its just adding debth at positions of need , Green could be a insurance chip be hind Wallace . We have no idea how good UPS will be. If Bell goes down McCants would be good insurance. Filling our roster be for ALL the decent players are gone ony makes sence.

[spectre]

It's been a long time, but I don't think McCants' handles are all that good? Remember we're talking pure SG vs. PG here. Either way though, I doubt we're so tied to Jefferson that we wouldn't just eat his minimum deal if something better came along.

Hard to say though...I think LB can fall pretty deeply in love with players (and just as much "out" too!).

I understand the frustration, just saying give the guys we have a chance; for the most part this is LB's picked team. FWIW I think we will add McCants unless a better opportunity comes along, and knowing LB we'll most likely make another trade to bring in another of "his" guys...thinking VladRad out for a backup PF most likely. Esp. if UPS can steal his minutes.

Maybe even for Warrick? Come December after Redd & Bogut goes down again...maybe something like VladRad for Warrick/Bell? I'm not really a fan of either of those guys, but I think I'd like them over Vlad.

Nazr's my dark horse. I'm thinking all that work this summer is going to pay off and hopefully we won't move him until we see if it actually did.

[Muttley]

Nazr's my dark horse. I'm thinking all that work this summer is going to pay off and hopefully we won't move him until we see if it actually did.
I have the same feelings.
I think Nazr could be an impact with the second unit this season (if he wants to be bad enough - I think after riding pine last season he does).

[dav7z]

It's been a long time, but I don't think McCants' handles are all that good? Remember we're talking pure SG vs. PG here. Either way though, I doubt we're so tied to Jefferson that we wouldn't just eat his minimum deal if something better came along.

Hard to say though...I think LB can fall pretty deeply in love with players (and just as much "out" too!).

I understand the frustration, just saying give the guys we have a chance; for the most part this is LB's picked team. FWIW I think we will add McCants unless a better opportunity comes along, and knowing LB we'll most likely make another trade to bring in another of "his" guys...thinking VladRad out for a backup PF most likely. Esp. if UPS can steal his minutes.

Maybe even for Warrick? Come December after Redd & Bogut goes down again...maybe something like VladRad for Warrick/Bell? I'm not really a fan of either of those guys, but I think I'd like them over Vlad.

Nazr's my dark horse. I'm thinking all that work this summer is going to pay off and hopefully we won't move him until we see if it actually did.

That what im trying to say . We should not have to eat any thing at all for Jefferson. According to the rosters i posted earlier Jefferson ia a unrestricted free agent. So we owe him nothing.
And what i see left unsigned it's a lot better choices than Jefferson

[spectre]

Probably so...but remember LB will want a 3rd PG (preferably on the tall side). An SG such as McCants isn't going to fill that role.

Since we're talking about a guy who's going to get virtually no PT I don't have a problem with it being Jefferson. He's 6'4", known for his D and he's passed the "Brown 1st year test".

Like you said though...we only have like 13 guaranteed with Jefferson. I don't think he's in the way of signing guys like McCants.

[teej]

Doug, man, I love you bud, but I think you've jumped a little off the deep end...if you can be rational for a minute I'll try to address some of your worries.

First, AI: I would have loved nothing more than to have AI on the roster. But I think LB, MJ, and Rod all together decided it wasn't in the best interests of the team on the court to go ahead and do that, ticket sales be damned.

Second, Guaranteed contracts: I think once training camp is over and trades are finished, very few teams will have more than 14 players on the roster, and a lot will be at 13. Houston can't keep those 17 can they? Didn't think so.

Third, Dontell: LB was VERY high on him last year, and despite Dontell's attitude, went out and backed him up and played him in the last few games (where he performed well). LB said he sees a ton of potential on Dontell and could see him starting in the NBA.

Fourth, BOB JOHNSON: You hate Bob. I understand. But tell me how many other owners would commit just under the luxury tax to a team they knew was going to be bad, and has never made the playoffs? Not many. Bob has spent a ton of money for little return, and whether you like him as a person or not, you have to respect his spending habits.

Fifth, TC: Yes, Tyson is ranked worse than Mek. Yes, everyone thinks it's a salary dump. And that certainly played into it. But guess what? TC is a Larry Brown player: he hustles, gives effort every play, never gives up, and has game-changing plays with his energy. THe PHO trade analogy spectre made was perfect. J-Rich is a better rated player than Diaw and Bell. But when you put them in our lineup, it works better. Just wait and see.

Sixth, Who's in control: If LB and MJ weren't in control, are there any two other people you'd trust to scream and kick and yell more about it? No, I think they're still calling the shots, and Rod is still initiating trades. Don't worry.

Anything else I missed? And no, I'm not a STH, I'm a High School student. But I attend as many games as my schedule lets me. And my wallet.

[dav7z]

Doug, man, I love you bud, but I think you've jumped a little off the deep end...if you can be rational for a minute I'll try to address some of your worries.

First, AI: I would have loved nothing more than to have AI on the roster. But I think LB, MJ, and Rod all together decided it wasn't in the best interests of the team on the court to go ahead and do that, ticket sales be damned.

Second, Guaranteed contracts: I think once training camp is over and trades are finished, very few teams will have more than 14 players on the roster, and a lot will be at 13. Houston can't keep those 17 can they? Didn't think so.

Third, Dontell: LB was VERY high on him last year, and despite Dontell's attitude, went out and backed him up and played him in the last few games (where he performed well). LB said he sees a ton of potential on Dontell and could see him starting in the NBA.

Fourth, BOB JOHNSON: You hate Bob. I understand. But tell me how many other owners would commit just under the luxury tax to a team they knew was going to be bad, and has never made the playoffs? Not many. Bob has spent a ton of money for little return, and whether you like him as a person or not, you have to respect his spending habits.

Fifth, TC: Yes, Tyson is ranked worse than Mek. Yes, everyone thinks it's a salary dump. And that certainly played into it. But guess what? TC is a Larry Brown player: he hustles, gives effort every play, never gives up, and has game-changing plays with his energy. THe PHO trade analogy spectre made was perfect. J-Rich is a better rated player than Diaw and Bell. But when you put them in our lineup, it works better. Just wait and see.

Sixth, Who's in control: If LB and MJ weren't in control, are there any two other people you'd trust to scream and kick and yell more about it? No, I think they're still calling the shots, and Rod is still initiating trades. Don't worry.

Anything else I missed? And no, I'm not a STH, I'm a High School student. But I attend as many games as my schedule lets me. And my wallet.

1st The AI thing , Brown said he wanted AI but we didn't have the cap space. Stupid move by BOB, Look at the Grizz ticket sales after the signing.
2nd If you look at the rosters i posted about all the teams have at least 15 gurenteed contracts. Im sure those teams will carry 15 players
3rd I don't think Jefferson has scored 10 points in a game much less average 10 ppg
McCants or Green is not even the same league as Jefferson
4th If he had any balls at all he would have signed AI and he would have come out much better than doing nothing. He all so give up a core player for some one who may just be decent .
5th TC is and was just a plain salery dump. Have you not read on a lot of other sites we the laughing stock of the NBA.
6th Have you heard MJ say or do ANY THING this off season . Any artical at all about the well being of the team. any thing?
I all so think Brown is still hoping MJ buys the team.
Johnson is calling the shots and Higgins is his yes man'.

What part of the truth is off the deep end. Yes im a season holded and have seen us lose time after time and year after year. That don't piss me off BUT the lack of our FO trying to win does piss me off. If you paided over 2500 dollars for tickets . And the owner basicly says screw the team would piss you off two. Hell lie to me at least make me think you trying. What part of that is off the deep end......

[teej]

1st The AI thing , Brown said he wanted AI but we didn't have the cap space. Stupid move by BOB, Look at the Grizz ticket sales after the signing.
2nd If you look at the rosters i posted about all the teams have at least 15 gurenteed contracts. Im sure those teams will carry 15 players
3rd I don't think Jefferson has scored 10 points in a game much less average 10 ppg
McCants or Green is not even the same league as Jefferson
4th If he had any balls at all he would have signed AI and he would have come out much better than doing nothing. He all so give up a core player for some one who may just be decent .
5th TC is and was just a plain salery dump. Have you not read on a lot of other sites we the laughing stock of the NBA.
6th Have you heard MJ say or do ANY THING this off season . Any artical at all about the well being of the team. any thing?
I all so think Brown is still hoping MJ buys the team.
Johnson is calling the shots and Higgins is his yes man'.

What part of the truth is off the deep end. Yes im a season holded and have seen us lose time after time and year after year. That don't piss me off BUT the lack of our FO trying to win does piss me off. If you paided over 2500 dollars for tickets . And the owner basicly says screw the team would piss you off two. Hell lie to me at least make me think you trying. What part of that is off the deep end......

Dav, Dav, Dav.

I don't think Bob was even presented with a contract for AI. I think LB and MJ decided that AI wasn't worth the trouble for a team trying to go to the playoffs, which isn't Memphis's goal right now. Their goal is to make $$$.

Guaranteed contracts can become unguaranteed if certain things happen. Just watch.

Dontell also hasn't played in nearly as many games as Rashad or Gerald.

In LB's system, Mek was not a core player.

Dav, we've been the laughing stock of the NBA since our inception. Only winning will change that. Not trades or signings.

LB and MJ were both very vocal about the TC trade being a basketball move, not a financial move. I disagree with that somewhat, but you said you'd like them to lie at least, so there's that. LB has been talking the whole time about how he's been trying to make the team better.

Higgins is MJ's yes man, not Bob J's.

If you want to believe what you do, go ahead. I have no proof that I'm right or you're wrong (except the quotes from LB and MJ), but I firmly believe what I do.

[spectre]

Brown: 2 obstacles to signing Iverson (http://blogs.charlotte.com/inside_the_nba/2009/08/brown-2-obstacles-to-signing-iverson.html)


Larry Brown says he'd favor coaching Allen Iverson again, but says the Bobcats' current salary-cap and roster issues would make it difficult to sign Iverson right now.

"We've got a couple of issues -- major issues. One is the money; we wouldn't want to make him an offer that would insult him. And with three small guards (Raymond Felton, Raja Bell and D.J. Augustin) already on the roster, he wouldn't get to play the minutes he deserves. Until one or both of those things changes, I don't see it'' happening.
Notice that line..."that would insult him". Kind of insinuates that LB thinks AI was going to get at least the full MLE doesn't it? Remember AI held Memphis off for a week after they made their final offer of 3.5 million (give or take)...and you know darn well he brought that back to us hoping we'd match.

Brown also mentioned PT, and word has it (think I got this out of Bill Ingram in a Hoopsworld chat) that LB didn't want to hurt DJ & Henderson's development...that's the issue with the minutes thing.

I don't think money was the issue at all.

[Demon DeaCat]

Whosever decision it was, and whatever the reason, it absolutely sickens me that Iverson wanted to be here and we didn't make it happen. Even if we had to go over the luxuray tax by $500,000 to match Memphis' offer it's what, a dollar for dollar penalty? We'd make that up and then some just in the revenue he'd have generated. And as for the playing time issue, I think LB is a great coach, but if we passed on AI because we were worried about getting Gerald Henderson minutes, then that's just silly. This has been the most frustrating off-season imaginable.

We watched the East get significantly better and all we did was make a bad trade to try to save some money. I want to have a good attitude about this season but I'm struggling right now. And when AI is scornig 20 a night for Memphis while we struggle to score 80, it's going to be even harder.

[dav7z]

Whosever decision it was, and whatever the reason, it absolutely sickens me that Iverson wanted to be here and we didn't make it happen. Even if we had to go over the luxuray tax by $500,000 to match Memphis' offer it's what, a dollar for dollar penalty? We'd make that up and then some just in the revenue he'd have generated. And as for the playing time issue, I think LB is a great coach, but if we passed on AI because we were worried about getting Gerald Henderson minutes, then that's just silly. This has been the most frustrating off-season imaginable.

We watched the East get significantly better and all we did was make a bad trade to try to save some money. I want to have a good attitude about this season but I'm struggling right now. And when AI is scornig 20 a night for Memphis while we struggle to score 80, it's going to be even harder.

Finaly some one else who sees this off season for what it really is. Could be i havn't gone off the deep end.

[teej]

Finaly some one else who sees this off season for what it really is. Could be i havn't gone off the deep end.

I'm frustrated too, but I firmly believe that LB and MJ are calling the shots, and In Larry Brown I motherfucking Trust!

If they didn't think AI was what we needed, then neither do I. And if you'll notice, I wrote a column in support of AI as far back as April...

[davcbow]

I dont think it was MJ or LB this time. I think that it was all BJ this time, because he lost a few bucks in past seasons he is going to use bad business decesions thinking he wont lose any more money. All I can say is it takes money to make money....I know if I was wanting to buy a team I surely would rather buy a team that has the chance to make the playoffs than a team that couldnt. Im convinced that BJ dont understand basketball nor does he know anything about running a pro team. I hope he sells soon before he ruins this team with his bad business moves....:cool: