3.2.1. Boom! Kemba talk. (From BB thread)

[spectre]

You realize that's not a debate at all, because the best sixth men double as guys who would be good starters on just about any team, yes? Also, if you don't think that Kemba's currently an elite point guard (and it doesn't sound like you do), then you recognize that the only real issue you have with me saying (and I paraphrase) "In order to be an elite point guard, Kemba's going to have to improve" is that I phrased it in a way that didn't pump Kemba up to be the greatest thing to hit North Carolina since college basketball, yes?

Wow, way to be an ass buddy.

You should recognize that I didn't take issue with the first part of the bolded above. I've not made ANY mention of Kemba being elite because I honestly don't have a clue on whether he can reach that point so your little insult isn't even applicable.

Yes?

[Bogg]

The post that started this whole argument was me saying that for Kemba to become an elite player he'll have to improve his passing. Without being a 25-ish point per game scorer, he's going to have to be able to run an offense at least comparable to Steve Nash or Rondo to be among the best of the best. That's the "criticism" I leveled at Kemba that some find objectionable. Other than that, I've been arguing that if a guy plays 30-plus minutes a night either way, "starter" is a meaningless distinction that people get hung up on. This is objectionable, apparently.

[Catch 22]

We agree to disagree with you Bogg. You think that Kemba's distributing trajectory is due to be parallel or decline as his career go along while some of us believe that it'll increase. I expect Kemba to balance out around 8-10 assist per game in his prime with about 17-19 points per game with better scorers around him. If you don't think so, that's your opinion I guess. I'm not mad at you.

[Bogg]

No, I expect Kemba to improve, most point guards do over the life of their rookie deals, I was just inconsiderate enough to talk about it. I also think he's exceptionally well-suited to a strategy that the Lakers, Spurs, and Mavs have all employed en route to championships in the last six seasons. I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

[Chef]

You realize that's not a debate at all, because the best sixth men double as guys who would be good starters on just about any team, yes? Also, if you don't think that Kemba's currently an elite point guard (and it doesn't sound like you do), then you recognize that the only real issue you have with me saying (and I paraphrase) "In order to be an elite point guard, Kemba's going to have to improve" is that I phrased it in a way that didn't pump Kemba up to be the greatest thing to hit North Carolina since college basketball, yes?



No need to apologize, if I wasn't looking to debate basketball I wouldn't be here.



A) It doesn't take advanced knowledge of NBA basketball to look up a guys' games played/games started split on ESPN
B) Terry moved to the bench before Kidd came to Dallas, Kidd had nothing to do with it. Terry requested a bench role because Dallas had a competent young point guard to take care of the ball-handling duties(Devin Harris) and by staggering Terry's minutes against Dirk's to start out a game, Dallas was able to have one of them on the floor at all times to keep the offense from lagging, while still playing 30+ minutes per game(which is my main point about Kemba). Terry had his best offensive year in Dallas(08-09, when he won sixth man of the year) coming off the bench, partially because playing stretches as the number one option of offense, instead of always having to defer to Dirk, gave him the freedom to play exclusively to his strengths, to the benefit of the team.(which is my secondary point about Kemba)

Also, for what it's worth, in this thread alone we've had Kemba a couple missed jumpshots from his teammates away from being Chris Paul and ten shots away from replicating Allen Iverson's impact, but somehow I'm the one with unrealistic expectations

god i love this guy

[spectre]

The post that started this whole argument was me saying that for Kemba to become an elite player he'll have to improve his passing. Without being a 25-ish point per game scorer, he's going to have to be able to run an offense at least comparable to Steve Nash or Rondo to be among the best of the best. That's the "criticism" I leveled at Kemba that some find objectionable.

...which had NOTHING to do with me. I did not project him to be elite nor do I think he needs to be that in order to be our starting guard when we're a contending team. I've been more than respectful to you but if you're going to throw that bullshit towards me I can certainly toss some right back.

Other than that, I've been arguing that if a guy plays 30-plus minutes a night either way, "starter" is a meaningless distinction that people get hung up on. This is objectionable, apparently.

If we can get a Steve Nash then fine...Kemba can be a 6th man...but I'd probably just rather cash him in because as a small market team finances will be a struggle anway. In my opinion however we don't have to have Steve Nash in order to get where we want to be.

[Chef]

We agree to disagree with you Bogg. You think that Kemba's distributing trajectory is due to be parallel or decline as his career go along while some of us believe that it'll increase. I expect Kemba to balance out around 8-10 assist per game in his prime with about 17-19 points per game with better scorers around him. If you don't think so, that's your opinion I guess. I'm not mad at you.

i am going to try and clarify what i think is some misunderstanding in this debate. bogg is saying the assist numbers aren't his concern but it is the way in which kemba plays. what kemba does to be effective, does not make his ideal role a starting pg but a 6th man who gets 30 mpg and has a tremendous (more than 8 of the 10 starters) footprint on the game. he is saying that if kemba can't be derrick rose, iverson or westbrook (25-30ppg per night guys) then his best role would be to come off the bench.

[SWedd523]

Mods can see deleted posts, just so you know


.. to nobody in particular

[gamecocksmitty4]

Basically what I'm getting out of all this is that most people are in "wait and see" mode for a young Kemba and think he could improve. Two others are saying that the best Kemba can become is an average to decent bench guy. Am I reading this right?

[Bogg]

i am going to try and clarify what i think is some misunderstanding in this debate. bogg is saying the assist numbers aren't his concern but it is the way in which kemba plays. what kemba does to be effective, does not make his ideal role a starting pg but a 6th man who gets 30 mpg and has a tremendous (more than 8 of the 10 starters) footprint on the game. he is saying that if kemba can't be derrick rose, iverson or westbrook (25-30ppg per night guys) then his best role would be to come off the bench.

ONLY if Charlotte can pair Kemba and MKG with two 20-plus a night scorers. They absolutely need him out there as their starter this year, and probably will for another two years after that.