We get a great look @ Milsap and Jefferson tonight and another question inside

[Stylesg1234]

Tonight should be an awesome opportunity to get an in person look at Jefferson and Milsap......I prefer Milsap...my question is would you rather spend a big contract on a trade guy or spend it in the offseason on Milsap or Jefferson?...I think Milsap could be that low post scorer and rebounder we need bad next to Biz...thoughts

[Bogg]

Jefferson's the low-post scorer, Millsap's the face-up guy who spends some time at small forward. I don't think that Biyombo's proven himself enough to be a building block yet, so I wouldn't plan on building the team based on how guys fit with him. I also think that pairing a 6'6" power forward with a 6'8" center is going to get you in trouble against any team that features real bigs. Also, Millsap's turning 28 this season, and part of what makes him so effective is his quickness and athleticism advantage against opposing power forwards. I wouldn't want to give him a long contract that stretches into his thirties. Flame away.

[murphman]

^ No flaming from me. We need to very careful about locking into long contracts with free agents who are already at or past their peak. Draft the core and get decent free agents on short contracts to complement them (Sessions is a great example).

[Chef]

i want neither. too expensive. not stars. until we get a true superstar and center piece, no big long term contracts.

[jmanvelocity]

Jefferson's the low-post scorer, Millsap's the face-up guy who spends some time at small forward. I don't think that Biyombo's proven himself enough to be a building block yet, so I wouldn't plan on building the team based on how guys fit with him. I also think that pairing a 6'6" power forward with a 6'8" center is going to get you in trouble against any team that features real bigs. Also, Millsap's turning 28 this season, and part of what makes him so effective is his quickness and athleticism advantage against opposing power forwards. I wouldn't want to give him a long contract that stretches into his thirties. Flame away.

Millsap is 6'8-6'9 with a 7'3 wingspan and Biz is 6'9 with a 7'7 wingspan. the height is not a huge concern

[Bogg]

Millsap measured in at 6'6.25" and Biyombo measured in at 6'8.3". Call them 6'6" and 6'8" in a league where your average frontcourt is 6'8" and 6'10"; or call them 6'8" and 6'10" "in shoes" when your average frontcourt is 6'10" and 7' "in shoes"; the end result is the same - both of those guys are going to be giving up a few inches almost every night. Considering that neither is all that great as a rebounder (you guys know that Millsap's averaging fewer than 8 a game right now and has never broken 9 a night over a season, right?) the height, and subsequently the ability to control the glass on both ends of the court, would be quite a concern.

[SWedd523]

Millsap measured in at 6'6.25" and Biyombo measured in at 6'8.3". Call them 6'6" and 6'8" in a league where your average frontcourt is 6'8" and 6'10"; or call them 6'8" and 6'10" "in shoes" when your average frontcourt is 6'10" and 7' "in shoes"; the end result is the same - both of those guys are going to be giving up a few inches almost every night. Considering that neither is all that great as a rebounder (you guys know that Millsap's averaging fewer than 8 a game right now and has never broken 9 a night over a season, right?) the height, and subsequently the ability to control the glass on both ends of the court, would be quite a concern.

(Hey look this conversation again!)

Now I'm no expert, but what difference does the top of a player's head make?

7'7 wingspan is longer than just about anybody in the league. You defend, block shots, and rebound with your arms. He has the weight to bang. His height is a silly argument. Bis is plenty big for a Center

[Stylesg1234]

I agree Jefferson is the better fit....and he isnt past his prime..he is 27 i think and Milsap 28....as for the height , i watched tonight and saw Biz and Milsap next to each other often and they are pretty close in height ...This is 2013 NBA when it doesnt matter if u have a big 7 footer down there as long as u have a big guy who can score and rebound as well as a D type guy....and the good thing about Milsap is he can take a guy out of the paint bc of his effectiveness hitting the 15 foot jumper ( which only opens up the middle for Biz to get putbacks and rebounds...i think u can very much start those 2 guys together ...if rbding is concern then it shouldnt be bc both guys are hard workers who hit the boards regardless of their size....and i really think if u have Biz and Milsap starting together u are fine as long as you have a sufficient 6'10 guy who can come off the bench and give u good minutes

As for Jefferson or Milsap i really dont think giving them a 4 year deal with option on year 5 is crazy...that makes them 31-33 at the end of the contract and they are not past their prime....they r right in their prime with the potential to get better in a new system...1 more note on their height Milsap is listed at 6 8 and Biz 6 9 ....i know thats a pro sports # and u may be right about their draft combine heights but rebounding is about will not height

1 last thing......as for not wanting to spend alot of $$ on either of these guys just keep in mind that after Gordon / Diop ect leave that we are in salary cap heaven....2 years from now in the 2014/15 season we will have a payroll of around 11-12 mill ( not including draft picks and mid level guys )

[Chef]

1 last thing......as for not wanting to spend alot of $$ on either of these guys just keep in mind that after Gordon / Diop ect leave that we are in salary cap heaven....2 years from now in the 2014/15 season we will have a payroll of around 11-12 mill ( not including draft picks and mid level guys )

until you start figuring in extensions for kemba, mkg, biz, jeff taylor, this years top 5 pick, next years top 10 pick and the portland and det picks.

point is the cap gets full really quick and when 10-14 mil is already committed for jefferson or millsap for the next 4 or 5 years it gets really hard to keep all that you want to keep.

[Bogg]

(Hey look this conversation again!)

Now I'm no expert, but what difference does the top of a player's head make?

7'7 wingspan is longer than just about anybody in the league. You defend, block shots, and rebound with your arms. He has the weight to bang. His height is a silly argument. Bis is plenty big for a Center

Every time we have this discussion I point out that Biyombo's strength and athleticism will let him get away with playing center just fine most nights, and every time somebody ignores that. He'll have trouble when he has to guard guys like the Gasols, Roy Hibbert, Pekovic, and Bogut and Bynum if they ever get healthy, otherwise he'll be okay. My concern isn't Biyombo playing in the middle, it's playing Biz with an undersized power forward who's only an okay rebounder. Truth be told, my concern is with the long-term plan being to start Biyombo at all. I think he's a nice third big, backing up both a traditional center and a stretch four, but that's an entirely different discussion. Going 6'6" and 6'8" in the middle with neither guy being an excellent rebounder will create problems on the glass.

I agree Jefferson is the better fit....and he isnt past his prime..he is 27 i think and Milsap 28....as for the height , i watched tonight and saw Biz and Milsap next to each other often and they are pretty close in height ...This is 2013 NBA when it doesnt matter if u have a big 7 footer down there as long as u have a big guy who can score and rebound as well as a D type guy....and the good thing about Milsap is he can take a guy out of the paint bc of his effectiveness hitting the 15 foot jumper ( which only opens up the middle for Biz to get putbacks and rebounds...i think u can very much start those 2 guys together ...if rbding is concern then it shouldnt be bc both guys are hard workers who hit the boards regardless of their size....and i really think if u have Biz and Milsap starting together u are fine as long as you have a sufficient 6'10 guy who can come off the bench and give u good minutes

If Millsap was an excellent rebounder we might not be having this discussion, but in the last three seasons (when he became a full-time starter) he's averaged 7.6, 8.8(career high), and 7.6 a game. He's not a slouch on the glass.....but he's only OK, and he isn't all that good of a defender. His points per game and field goal percentage have also dropped in each of the last three seasons (even though they're both still decent), and he was never a star to begin with. Tying up a whole bunch of money in Millsap is going to look a lot like the Nene contract a few years down the line when he enters his thirties while the rest of the roster hasn't even hit their prime.