Lebron is doing pretty special things
espn is probably already lining up the talking heads to decide if he is the GOAT. i can't stand espn. anyway,
debate:
what would jordan's stats look like playing in todays nba vs the late 80's-90's nba?
what would lebron's stats and game look like playing in jordan's era?
i know what i suspect would happen, but i like to read other peeps opinions.
My opinion is pretty simple
Put LeBron in Jordan era: Jordan Better
Put Jordan in LeBron era: Jordan Better
Jordan is the GOAT, nothing I've seen from anybody other than maybe Shaq in 2000 can approach MJ's prime, LeBron included. When all is said and done, LeBron will be a top 10 all time player, but MJ is on a pedestal by himself... and rightfully so
If you put Lebron in Jordan's era, I don't think I could put him ahead of Jordan, but I think he would clearly be the #2 player in the league. His body/skillset combination is too ridiculous to drop any lower than that.
Putting MJ in today's era, hmmm... I would say MJ and Lebron would be a dead heat. I think salary cap issues, luxury taxes etc would have prevented the Bulls from maintaining their elite talent level for 6 out of 8 years ( Same for the Magic era Lakers and Bird era Celtics ). Without the supporting cast, if he wins 3 rings instead of 6 then his legacy isn't the same.
Also the Jordan of this era wouldn't have the enormous athleticism advantage that he has over many of today's athletes. Don't get me wrong, he would still be elite athletically but there would probably be 10 guys on his athletic level today whereas in his era there was 1 or 2 maybe.
Hakeem, Shaq, The Admiral, Karl Malone, Dominique, Larry Nance, James Worthy, Julius Erving, Clyde Drexler, Charles Barkley, etc.
Jordan played with plenty of guys who would be elite athletes in any era. Not to mention he wouldn't have to deal with the hand check in today's game and would get even more superstar calls. If he wanted to, he'd easily be able to average 40/8/8 in today's game. Hell, he went for 33/8/8 on 56% shooting one year back in the day.
He has a career average of 30.1 (which includes two years in Washington when he was well past his prime). LeBron has never averaged that number for a single year. LeBron's single highest rebounding and assist averages are 8.1 and 8.6 while Michael's are 8 and 8.
More scoring, better defense, better leader, better winner. LeBron is a sensational player, so don't get me wrong. But he's no Michael Jordan
this is the single biggest reason why the GOAT argument is pretty lame in my opinion. lebron could avg 30/10/7-10 if he really wanted to. he doesn't. he isn't driven the same way mj is/was. however, talent wise i think it is closer than alot of folks in the 'mj will never be touched camp' think.Originally Posted by SWedd523
i like the cross era comps alot though. it is a much more enjoyable debate.
isguros (02-13-2013)
bismack biyombo
John Wall, C.J. Leslie, & Quincy Miller
That's the reason for the GOAT label for MJ and why Lebron can't/won't touch MJ. He isn't driven to be the best so how can he top the best?
Swedd is right about the level of competition in the MJ era as well as the hand check rules. Lebron is obviously a physical specimen unlike any other seen in the NBA and hand checking would only do so much but it would slow him down a tad...and guys like Dream, Ewing, and hell even Laimbeer and Rodman patrolling the lane, I can't see LBJ being as effective in the post as he is in this era (but thank god he has finally woke up and realized what an advantage he has in the post instead of on the perimeter).
Ulitmately, my thoughts are:
MJ would dominate in this era as in any era.
LBJ would be sensational in the MJ era seeing maybe a slight dip in points, same number of assists, but I see probably a couple less boards a game or more since boxing out was the norm back in the day, plus, the size of players and physical play.
"The owners are fighting for a system that will help save them from bad general managers and poor basketball decisions." --Kurt Helin via spectre
Lebron is doing pretty special things
They hate him because he's just too damn good! At the end of his career he'll be known as co-goat.
"I'LL KILL YOU MOTHER &*%$^@!!!"
- Tyrus Thomas
CampNightmare8 (02-17-2013)
Nobody hates Lebron because of his abilities. I think most people that criticize him point to a relative lack of leadership on the court and then the Cleveland debacle where he basically publicly humiliated a whole city.
That being said, I've never seen a player destroy teams like Michael. Yes, he had a good supporting cast, but they weren't anything special compared to the supporting cast of the top teams of today, other than the fact that they all knew their jobs and played them well. But Michael would rip people's hearts out. I don't think people are afraid of Lebron like they were of Jordan.
That's not saying that Lebron can't easily take over a game. (The Pistons playoff game in one of his early playoff pushes was one of the greatest single game performances I've ever seen.) That's not saying he isn't one of the greatest players of all time. However, I just don't see in him what I saw in Jordan. Kobe is the closest, but he whines a bit too much. Jordan would just remember and then murder you next time.
Other than Tiger in his prime, I've never seen a single player dominate like Michael. (Though Gretzky certainly comes to mind, I never really had the pleasure of watching him play.)
SOMEONE will pay for THIS!
Head game.
If Lebron played back then he wouldn't have been as great I don't think. I don't hate Lebron (I dont like him) and its easy to be nostalgic about the past and how tough it was. But I think it took a special kind of killer to be great then, and Lebron aint got that. Lebron is special and today when he gets two steps ... its over. But back then even if he had the full court to run there would have been a hard foul to contest his run. Its just difficult to judge two different eras.
The thing about MJ... he didn't change basketball he changed sports and possibly culture. Lebron is just a physical freak of nature playing basketball he isn't changing anything.
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