You're right spectre...I forgot about the knees...tell me again why we drafted such a "safe" pick...
Hope Resurrected: "I think I can bring an attitude to a team as far as, ‘All right, no matter what, we are not losing this game'." - Kemba Walker
"Its okay to be bad; just so long as you're bad ass." - Keetch
You're right spectre...I forgot about the knees...tell me again why we drafted such a "safe" pick...
Welcome Gerald #2! i hope you are as good as gerald WALLACE!
With the way our fan base is and how struggling our team is, we needed to pick someone the fans can rally around and want to watch next year. You accomplish this by picking either, as you put it, a "KA-BAM" pick; or a hometown hero.
The "KA-BAM" picks were Holiday, Eaaaaarrrllll, and JJ to an extent
The hometown hero was Henderson
But our team is in the midst of a playoffs hunt so we needed to pick someone who could contribute from day one, not a project.
The projects are Holiday, Eaaarrrrlll, and JJ to an extent
The day one contributor is Henderson
So by my formula, the only guy that fulfills both of those needs is Henderson. Therefore, I'm okay with the pick
That guy from Duke? Yeah, he played well for Duke. I read that he was a good player at Duke. I wish I could go to Duke. Anyone else want to go to Duke? Let's all go to Duke. Duke Bound!
What questions did Roy have about him other than the fact he wouldn't work out here? Gay may have had a couple of questions but I don't think anyone questioned his physical skills and the fact that he was a proto-typical nba guy.
I'm not expecting Henderson to be a super star. I expect him to play his role. If he become a super star in the process...Great. But we needed a back SG...BADLY. We got one. We got one the coach really likes. We got someone who's already from a good program that teaches defense 1st. Now (please basketball gods, please basketball gods) we finally have no reason to play DJ and Raymond at the same time. Thank You Jesus!!!! ( Shuttlesworth )
I clearly wasn't a fan of Henderson, But I'm not bummed about the pick either. He's not a horrible player. He does fill a need and could seriously help this team. He may have the chance to grow into a real NBA mini star. Even though i HATE ...really hate Duke. I'm fine with him being on the team, He has talent. This is the NBA, real basketball.
College colors don't mean a thing when hunting for that ring!!!!!
Last edited by Ghost Kat; 06-27-2009 at 05:34 PM.
Yeah, there's so many factors that complicate this pick for me, that's why I'm having so much trouble coming to terms with it. Yes, I come from a Tar Heel family (only spent one month there myself before transferring though), but I always assumed as long as it wasn't Laettner or Hurley, I could pull for any Dookie that played on my NBA team (whether it was the Hawks, then later the Hornets, and obviously now the Cats), and now I'm finding it MAY not be the case. I mean this is the same douche who pulled the bush league shit on Tyler on senior day in '07; this is the same punk who I booed out of my gourd during the '07 and '08 ACC tourneys when he was announced over the PA for said vicious hit on Tyler, and it's possible, I can't separate this bitter dislike for him as a collegiate and reconcile this with him playing for the team I support. Not to overly-dramatize, but I'll really have to do some introspection to discover how much of this initial hatred for him has to do with my disappointment of the pick.
Secondly, I've been a Jrue Holliday homer for a couple years now, since I read an article about him in a mag during his junior season in HS. I thought it was a mistake for him to come out this year, as he needed at least one more year to learn his trade and hone his skills against collegiate competition, as it showed he was not quite ready for the NBA at times during this season, for sure. Still, he came out, was the source of quite a bit of hype as if he may be drafted by the Kings at 4 for crying out loud. Because of this, I had give up any delusions of us taking him, and had committed to TWill, Henderson, Clark or Johnson. Then, out of the blue, there's talk about minor shoulder issues for Jrue, and he falls down the board, and be damned if he's not available at 12. Go back and look at my initial post concerning this year's draft and from then on it's all been Jrue at number 1, jokingly at times, because I assumed he would be long gone before 12.....and then my dream scenario comes along (after the disappointment of having seen TWill drafted ahead of us), and then Jrue isn't picked. I mean, talk about the fucking double whammy for me. So in that sense, our pick, whoever it would have been, because it wasn't Jrue, I likely would've been pissed at him.
Everybody's counter to my argument of picking Jrue over Henderson is that Jrue is a project whose only asset is potential, whereas Henderson is a "sure thing," a "safe pick," which opens up a whole other can of worms for me, which this thread (and others) delineates in various ways. The fact of the matter is that I can't deny that argument: Jrue is not, as I've stated already, NBA ready yet; Henderson is closer to being NBA ready by a sizeable margin. However, (no apologies to Stephen A.) it's my opinion (as well as others, including actual paid scouts) that Jrue has the much higher ceiling to become something special, whereas Henderson is more of a "what you see is what you get" specimen. And what we see isn't bad at all, but it a likely role-player for a contending team, while a starter-in-the-grooming for a fringe playoff team, which segues to my next point about the statement this pick is making.
The playoffs. It seems that this is the finite goal of the current regime; and end unto itself. The playoffs. Lord knows it'll be sweet to have my team back in them, but I want to build a contender. I'm not delusional, I fully understand for however long the Cats are here, it's not likely we'll ever win a championship, or even take part in the Finals. I mean the damn Hornets have been around since '88-'89 and they have yet to make it to the a conference finals. But still, I want a team that has a chance, and in some cases be favored to win first round matchups, advance to the conference semis, and so on for a number of years, until a rebuilding needs to take place, and we'll start the process over. What this pick represents is a short-term goal of merely making the playoffs, as if that's the opiate of the masses (apologies to Marx). And even that's if things go right. Adding Henderson alone isn't improving this team drastically. I admit he's an upgrade over Martin and to a lesser extent Jefferson, but not so much so that he's the missing piece of this tantalizing playoff goal.
Now, would Jrue improve the odds of making the playoffs more than Henderson this season? Hell no. But I'm enough of a believer in the kid to not completely rule that out, which is obviously moot being that Jrue is only on our roster in a parallel universe, not the one we occupy. But like I've indicated above, the well-being of the team is not to treat the playoffs as an end in and of itself, as if making it to the playoffs one season is enough to rally the community/region around this ballclub.
Spectre, earlier in this thread, I belive, posted a list of previous number 12 picks in drafts past, which was quite underwhelming (much love to my man Mookie, though!!!), and which illustrated the fact that 12th is hit and miss, and littered, by and large, with players who maxxed out as role players. So my reasoning (however flawed) is that in a draft as admittedly weak as this year's, and having the underwhelming 12th pick, why the hell not take a chance? If we take Jrue and he doesn't pan out as I think he will, and is relegated as a backup combo before his 4 years here are up, then what did we lose? A mediocre draft position in a mediocre draft. Ho-hum. However, he could turn out to be the best 12th pick since Mookie, though his ceiling is such that he could be the best 12th ever. Contrary to others, the circumstances surrounding this mediocre draft, I say this is the absolute perfect time to take a risk and avoid the "safe pick" at all costs. After all, a "safe pick" in this year's draft class is tantamount to being a pejorative.
Yes, it's lengthy, but it shows I'm giving some thought with this and not just spouting out "Gerald sucks." Like I said, very complicated pick for me personally....feel free to have an intervention for me so I can continue to work this out in a healthy way
I agree about Derrick, dav, which is why I started the "welcome" thread for him....I think he's the diamond of our draft, and has the better long-term potential that I fear Henderson lacks.
For the organization, not taking Ammo was riskier than not taking him, plain and simple. This was, sad to say, a racial issue. MJ can spin it any way he likes, but the fact is, he and FO feared a backlash about passing up "the next Larry Bird." I think the fact Ammo was as popular as he was here illustrates the point. From a purely skill level, I think Ammo was a risky pick for sure; there were many questions about how he would fare in the league for good reason, but I can also hit the time machine and remember the same being said for Roy (my choice) and Gay. So I'll just clear the discussion up by qualfying it by saying Ammo was the safe PR pick, which I think is hard to debate.
Last edited by TheBeagle; 06-28-2009 at 01:58 AM.
"The owners are fighting for a system that will help save them from bad general managers and poor basketball decisions." --Kurt Helin via spectre
beagle...I can't (or will not ) speak to the UNC-Duke stuff because I really do not care (just me) when guys go to the pros where they played...well I take that back...if they only played in the bathroom...never mind...anyway...
The so called WYSIWYG players (like the "potential") players come in all flavors...I do not remember anyone thinking Roy had the kind of ceiling he is showing he has...and I doubt anyone (yes...including the experts) really know what Henderson's ceiling will be in the pros...he is coming to a team that is a great match...he already plays solid "D"...he shot is better (from the outside and FT line) than T-Will has...and he does not strike me as the kinda guy that will not continue to improve his game...I think he will and he is lucky (and I think he considers himself that) to have an opportunity to be coached by a very solid teaching coach...
I'm never going to claim that any player is a can't miss in any way (because I'm from the old baseball school of thought and the minors are littered with "can't misses"...)...but I feel that this year we drafted two players (their choice) that can make our team better and will do what they need to within the teams (our teams) framework to do that...I hope I'm correct but also recognize I can be wrong...
Holiday...I'm still out to lunch on him...I think he does have great potential but I don't (and I'm not sure he does yet...he really is still a kid) know what position he will play in the NBA....I wish him well (except when we play the 76s) and feel like Henderson...he went to a really good situation for him...Eddie Jordon is a good coach (IMO) and got the blame in Washington for what he had no control over...if the 76s resign Miller Holiday will have the time to develop that he needs with a solid mentor and a solid NBA coach...