Trade Idea

[Chef]

stopped reading after the cats send wallace part.

[SWedd523]

If you trade Wallace the sputtering fanbase will only dwindle even more regardless of the fact that Boozer is a Dookie.

Crash is the main dude on this team. You don't trade him.

[GoBobs]

Wallace > Boozer

pass

[Walt Cronkite]

Crash and Diaw are both "value" contracts for what they produce, and Crash is the only reason half the people who show up to games do. Diaw isn't as effective at the 3, and Boozer is getting older.

And if we rebuild, it's without LB. He's pretty much said so.

Boozer turns 28 in November. Not sure how you can say Diaw isn't as effective at the 3, he only played 1% of the team's minutes there, as opposed to 50% of the teams minutes at the 4. People get stuck up on these numbers too much, but you want the 5 best players that compliment each other who are effective against another team. Wallace and Diaw are both "value" contracts for what they produce, so is Carlos Boozer. He'll be paid 12m next season (which is a contract year) and in the playoffs he put up 20/10 on above 50% shooting.

LB has already been around for rebuilding. Look at the roster compared to what we had when he arrived. There's what, 4 guys left?


Sweed, the fact that Gerald Wallace is the main dude on this team is the reason that this team is as bad as it is. I love crash, but he's not a franchise player. Boozer could be.

[teej]

Boozer turns 28 in November. Not sure how you can say Diaw isn't as effective at the 3, he only played 1% of the team's minutes there, as opposed to 50% of the teams minutes at the 4. People get stuck up on these numbers too much, but you want the 5 best players that compliment each other who are effective against another team. Wallace and Diaw are both "value" contracts for what they produce, so is Carlos Boozer. He'll be paid 12m next season (which is a contract year) and in the playoffs he put up 20/10 on above 50% shooting.

LB has already been around for rebuilding. Look at the roster compared to what we had when he arrived. There's what, 4 guys left?


Sweed, the fact that Gerald Wallace is the main dude on this team is the reason that this team is as bad as it is. I love crash, but he's not a franchise player. Boozer could be.

When Boris played the three, he just plain wasn't as effective. His best time in Pheonix was when he played in the 4 and 2...he needs a size/athleticism advantage to be effective from what I can tell.

Boozer won't stick around after next season

LB won't stay if we have to rebuild again, he wants to win, that's it.

Gerald isn't that much worse if any worse than Boozer. If we can have a Diaw vs. Boozer convo, I see no way that Boozer can trump Crash. We're a team, not built around one player.

[Walt Cronkite]

How would we not be a team with Boozer for the price of Diaw or Wallace?

Current construction

Felton: plays tough defense against any guard. good vision.
Bell: 3 point threat, mid range threat, capable of guarding elite wing defenders
Wallace: monster in transition, excellent rebounder for his size, good defender against players his size or smaller, injury prone.
Diaw: excellent playmaker for his size. poor rebounder, but he does the little things. can score in the low post. good defender against pfs, regardless of hight or athleticism
Okafor: excellent rebounder, very good defender against centers. Scoring threat in close.

Our team, as currently constructed, relies on Wallace or Diaw to have superstar level games. When Wallace gets injured, Bell and Diaw have to step up.

Boozer is a dominant offensive player. He gives us an actual top 30 offensive player in the league. He isn't as agile as Wallace or as gifted a playmaker as Diaw and he's worse defensively than both of them, but you're being straight up silly if you don't think he'd actually add a dynamic aspect to our offense.

The question to ask: Is the loss of Wallace/Diaw's defense offset by the go-to offensive presence Boozer brings, considering that Boozer would instantly be the weakest link on defense (a situation the Jazz have been doing alright with)?

In regard to the rest of your post, the Diaw at the 3 comment is still a straw man argument-- he never played there. I've already addressed your comments about LB in regard to rebuilding and how Boozer possibly leaving could be a plus. Did you even read my post?

[SWedd523]

I'm not saying Crash isn't better. But the simple fact is that he is the most exciting and loved player on the team. If you trade him for a one year rental of Boozer then that's going to seriously piss off the few fans that have been around for the Cats and RE piss of the fans that are finally warming up to the team since the Hornets left.

Add that to the fact that our only backups to Crash are a rookie (UPS) and a tweener (Vlad) and that really doesn't spell well. I mean, sure, Diaw could move down to the 3.. But he wasn't effective in that role in Phoenix and likely won't be very effective doing it her.

Trading Diaw for Boozer, on the other hand, would definitely be something I'd consider as there are far more high level wing players than post players so it'd be easier to make up for the loss of Diaw.

Sign Boozer to an extension and trade Diaw for him and then we're talking.

[teej]

How would we not be a team with Boozer for the price of Diaw or Wallace?

Current construction

Felton: plays tough defense against any guard. good vision.
Bell: 3 point threat, mid range threat, capable of guarding elite wing defenders
Wallace: monster in transition, excellent rebounder for his size, good defender against players his size or smaller, injury prone.
Diaw: excellent playmaker for his size. poor rebounder, but he does the little things. can score in the low post. good defender against pfs, regardless of hight or athleticism
Okafor: excellent rebounder, very good defender against centers. Scoring threat in close.

Our team, as currently constructed, relies on Wallace or Diaw to have superstar level games. When Wallace gets injured, Bell and Diaw have to step up.

Boozer is a dominant offensive player. He gives us an actual top 30 offensive player in the league. He isn't as agile as Wallace or as gifted a playmaker as Diaw and he's worse defensively than both of them, but you're being straight up silly if you don't think he'd actually add a dynamic aspect to our offense.

The question to ask: Is the loss of Wallace/Diaw's defense offset by the go-to offensive presence Boozer brings, considering that Boozer would instantly be the weakest link on defense (a situation the Jazz have been doing alright with)?

In regard to the rest of your post, the Diaw at the 3 comment is still a straw man argument-- he never played there. I've already addressed your comments about LB in regard to rebuilding and how Boozer possibly leaving could be a plus. Did you even read my post?

First off, yes, I read your post - I read every post I can. I went back and reread it to make sure I wasn't missing anything, and maybe we just aren't on the same level.

First, you're discounting Mek's and Ray's offensive contributions. When Ray scores over 20 ppg, we're nigh unbeatable. When Mek is dominant, so is the rest of the team.

Next, I only recall Boris having two "superstar level" games. One in Toronto and one in Golden State. Boozer is a 20/10 guy. That's not much better than Crash, and if we traded Diaw, that limits the other players' opportunities. When Diaw did play at the three, which was close to a whole game, he wasn't nearly as productive. Before coming here, he was classified as a 3, but in reality he was best when playing the 2 or 4. If we move him to the three, he loses his advantages...

Lastly, Boozer leaving puts Mek as the franchise player, us still over the cap, lacking a fan base, and in need of a coach. How in the hell does that help?

[spectre]

How would we not be a team with Boozer for the price of Diaw or Wallace?

Current construction

Felton: plays tough defense against any guard. good vision.
Bell: 3 point threat, mid range threat, capable of guarding elite wing defenders
Wallace: monster in transition, excellent rebounder for his size, good defender against players his size or smaller, injury prone.
Diaw: excellent playmaker for his size. poor rebounder, but he does the little things. can score in the low post. good defender against pfs, regardless of hight or athleticism
Okafor: excellent rebounder, very good defender against centers. Scoring threat in close.

Our team, as currently constructed, relies on Wallace or Diaw to have superstar level games. When Wallace gets injured, Bell and Diaw have to step up.

Boozer is a dominant offensive player. He gives us an actual top 30 offensive player in the league. He isn't as agile as Wallace or as gifted a playmaker as Diaw and he's worse defensively than both of them, but you're being straight up silly if you don't think he'd actually add a dynamic aspect to our offense.

The question to ask: Is the loss of Wallace/Diaw's defense offset by the go-to offensive presence Boozer brings, considering that Boozer would instantly be the weakest link on defense (a situation the Jazz have been doing alright with)?

In regard to the rest of your post, the Diaw at the 3 comment is still a straw man argument-- he never played there. I've already addressed your comments about LB in regard to rebuilding and how Boozer possibly leaving could be a plus. Did you even read my post?

That is one stellar post.

The bolded part is what I tried to say earlier. I don't know which would end up being more successful...probably whichever between Booz & Crash who could stay the least injured.

What I think the deciding factor given the two choices will be is the consistent word in each of your descriptions for each current player...defense. Larry Brown's whole team concept is predicated on the defense initiating the offense. That's not to say he can't make it work with someone like Booz (he made it work with AI), but I think his preference would be to stick with the defensive theme.

[spectre]

Now what I disagree with...

Boris is too slow for the 3 spot. No matter what the stats say I've seen him iso'd on the perimeter against opposing SFs and he looked like a little girl among men. He just doesn't have the lateral footspeed to keep up with those guys. Using his weight he can compensate for that in the paint a lot better and use his smarts to defend his man.

We just need a stronger bench. Give Crash & Raja some rest and maybe they won't get injured so much. Give Felton more rest and maybe he won't fall off the reservation quite so much with those "WTF" moments.